Turbo classification...?

[MilitaryRestoration]

Call me stupid but where do I look to see what turbo I have. I usually see it right away but for some reason I'm not seeing it and haven't done so in a while so I needed to get a friendly reminded Thank You

 

[jimk]

the C (whistler) turbine housing has a band clamp and a more pronounced scroll. Half of the compressor blades have angles in them.

The D exhaust housing is wider and bolts on. Its compressor has smoohly curved blades .JimK

 

[doghead]

pics (these pics were found by doing a search for "turbo picture") they were not originally posted by me.

 

[MilitaryRestoration]

and which one has more power? and how would i tell if the motor is from a 5ton rather a 2.5 because it sure does seem to have a lot more power than both our other trucks...

 

[doghead]

There is not really much difference in power between the C or D turbo.(D seems to be able to make slightly more boost when the fuel is turned up some) The engine tag that is under the exhaust manifold(seen in the above pics) will say if the engine is an LD, LDT or LDS(LDS is the 5 ton motor). Look under the M in multi-fuel in this picture and you can see it is a LDT engine.(I think this is Emmado's engine pic)

 

[m139h2otruck]

If it is truly a 5 ton motor, you should freeup the air intake as the deuce filter is not rated high enough cfm.

 

[doghead]

If it is truly a 5 ton motor, you should freeup the air intake as the deuce filter is not rated high enough cfm.

I think that this is only correct if you have an LDS turbo on an LDS engine in a deuce. I don't think it really matters if you have a C or D turbo on it in a deuce.

 

[doghead]

This is the engine tag on mine (LDS engine in a deuce with a D turbo)

 

[emr]

I don't belive the turbo has anything to do with power, its an anti smoke thing, only, there were different turbos like everything else, as for the power, the 5 ton and deuce motar are basicly the same, its highly unlickly U have a five ton motor, ive seen a deuce motor in a five ton at the local armory ,and man they said it was the dog of dogs, and heard of them doing it the other way when they wanted to play,but never seen one, but extreamly rare, as for the power, I have experienced in a non turbo , that in my opinion, has more fuel tuned into the injector pump, when U or somebody puts a turbo on a smoker, with out tuning down the fuel U will have a super runner, i have put a turbo on a smoker, and it the pump was brand new from memphis, the part # for a non torbo pump is different from a turbo, although they did not know why, when asked, i think its just common sense its the fuel mixture., the trucks are faster so the fuel is at a highwer rate in the non turbos. or smokers as i call em, so more likely its fuel has been turned up, or it was a smoker that had a turbo just bolted on, Mine is a runner for sure, a few of the guard guys that have driven her in parades,and everyone else thats driven her has said "what did U do to this truck it flies!" for deuce that is, if it were a five ton motor it would only be a mater of fuel mixture too, I know of a couple of guys who have put a 5 ton turbo& manifold and tuned the injector, for a screamer, but for me a deuce is a deuce, and part of the fun for me anyway is the way it runs, just 2 cents from what ive gone thru over the years.,,,Randy

 

[ken]

The "D" turbo will move 30CFM more than a "C" model in stock form. That doesen't mean more power though. They both will move more air than the LD can swallow. The "D" turbo was a attempt at stopping hot shut down failures. It has a heat shield between the turbine and the bearing housing. Although if you have a "d" you still need to let it idle before shutting it down. The 5 ton's turbo will have a wastegate on it with a much larger compressor housing and intake elbow. You won't see more PSI of boost from these because the wastegate will open. But it will move alot more air at low engine RPM"s witch will help EGT's to stay lower. If your 5 ton doesen't have one of these then the engine was probally a rebuild that was swapped in. If your truck is a dog then the fuel rate is too low. Some trucks will fly while others won't get out of thier own way. A small increase in fuel rate will make a big difference in power.

 

[5tonpuller]

C & D

The 5 ton's turbo will have a wastegate on it with a much larger compressor housing and intake elbow. You won't see more PSI of boost from these because the wastegate will open. But it will move alot more air at low engine RPM"s witch will help EGT's to stay lower. If your 5 ton doesen't have one of these then the engine was probally a rebuild that was swapped in. If your truck is a dog then the fuel rate is too low.

I took a picture of what is in my wrecker. I did not have this in it when I got it. ( it was leaking oil big time ) It has a bigger housing then this one.
Do I dare to remove the cap and up the gate spring for more pressure?

 

[MikeON]

I recently swapped turboes and took pictures while they were both out. Installed a pyrometer probe at the same time.

The C turbo gave 7 psi max boost, the D gave 8 psi max, and gives some boost at much lower engine RPM. I since turned up the fuel and get 12 psi. Turned the truck from a real dog into a decent runner.

Mike

 

[m-35tom]

a turbo has everything to do with more power, although the mil did not use them for that.

 

[DanMartin]

Re: C & D

If your 5 ton doesen't have one of these then the engine was probally a rebuild that was swapped in.

Here's a pic of the turbo in my LDS equipped deuce. Note that there is no wastegate, but this *is* the turbo that came with the "crate" engine they swapped in. Note that they had to slightly "engineer" some of the exhaust to make the 5-ton motor fit right. This appears to be an LDS-465-1A (the engine dataplate is missng unfortunately).

Not sure if this helps, but I had the pics so here ya go.

 

[doghead]

Excellent comparison pictures, Mike! These should be a real help for those trying to identify which turbo they have. Thanks

 

[sweetk30]

so if you have your choice as to turbos what would you go for?

 

[MikeON]

If I could only have one, I would go for the D. The C sounds very cool, but the way I use my truck the noise is just too much. The difference in torque is noticeable too.

I'm thinking of swapping the C back on for a few events this summer, like the "Jeep Nite" sponsored by a local tavern.

Mike

 

[sweetk30]

basic bolt on from c to d or what is needed. i have a few local trucks in mind but thay have c turbos on them . and whats a good price for a good used d turbo.

 

[MikeON]

I got my D turbo off ebay for $76.25 plus $23.00 shipping. It seems more people want the C because of the sound effects. I work around my truck with the engine idling, loading logs with a 24 volt winch, and the noise was too much.

It was pretty much a basic bolt-on job. I used the original gaskets. Counting drilling and tapping the manifold and installing a pyro probe, I probably had less than 2 hours in it.

TM9-2320-361-24-1 has a section on turbocharger replacement.

Mike

 

[LanceRobson]

I'm scratching my head a little over this thread. It's moved somewhat off topic and I'm not sure if it should be re-named.

I've been out of the GI wrenching world a few years and it's 12-13 years since I was involved in a 5 ton to deuce engine swap but here's a few thoughts.

There's some good info and pics flying around this whole website. After more than 30 years around military vehicles I'm often humbled by the vast scope of my ignorance.

As said above the turbo was added (officially) for emissions reasons. It will give better acceleration and lugging ability at the cost of harder cold weather starting due to the pre-start restriction of the impeller in the intake airflow. Fuel mileage is probably not worth considering except that the ability to drive in a higher gear without lugging the engine may make a small overall difference.

Regarding a 5 ton to deuce engine swap: If memory serves, the bell housing needs changed, some exhaust fabrication (including bracing and hangers) is needed and the rest of the swap should be pretty straight forward.

If swapping a deuce turbo for a 5 ton turbo: I know that the fuel pump timing is changed when adding a turbo to a normally aspirated engine but cannot remember if the timing is different between a 5 ton and deuce a engine. Probably not.

Since the fuel rate is adjustable, I'm unclear why there'd need to be different fuel pumps. I guess the best way is to check the &P manuals and compare the NSNs.

I don't know if the injector nozzles are the same. Back to the &P manuals we go.

If adding a 5 ton turbo to a deuce, be careful with long periods at high RPM. I believe the piston cooling oil spray nozzles are higher flow rate on the 5 ton plant. The higher possible EGT might be an issue. Also, depending on when the deuce engine was built/rebuilt the head gasket may not have the steel reinforcements around the combustion chamber that, I believe, the 5 ton head head gasket has.

Radiator size may become an issue, especially in hot highway driving too, but that corner of my brain cell is fuzzy.

If looking for a few more HP, give thought to having an experienced shop shave the head. I've no experience with it but it seems that raising the compression ration would give a few "free" HP. Perhaps at the cost of harder cold weather starting.

In any case, put a lot of thought into a pyro and boost gauge, especially if you're running on the highway.

Most of us looking for a few more MPH or better fuel mileage might be better served making sure the tire pressures are correct, the drive line is lubed correctly and the tire heights of the rear axle and intermediate axle are matched to reduce tire scrubbing. Lock out front hubs are worth a hard look as a way to reduce wear, increase mileage and smooth out the ride.

All this could be just pole vaulting over mouse turds but it helps make the winter nights go by.