002a Runs Great then Dies

[Guyfang]

I have writen several times, how to jump the Safty circuit. Look at the schematic. I would, but it's 24:38 and my foot is swollen up. Need to get to bed. At least two of you guys should can read schematics.

 

[Kenny0]

Temp sensors do go bad. Like Chainbreaker said, check the cooling fins, not just what you can see, but all the way around. Remove any tin work that you need to do so. Could be mice, mud wasps or any other critters that could get in there. Also check between the cooling fan and the cylinders to make sure there is free air flow. Any tin work in the cooling system that is missing must be replaced.

 

[Guyfang]

Jump from TB5-7, to TB5-9, run it for what ever time it normally ran before shutting down. If it shuts down again, its not a safety. If it runs without stopping, then jump each switch in the chain, one at a time, until you find the one that is not working. Troubleshoot Partner.

 

[impi]

Is the air vent on the fuel tank cap open ?


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[Chainbreaker]

Is the air vent on the fuel tank cap open ?

Good thought...however in his first post he did mention: "...cap set to "open" (was in closed, new)".

 

[n5yzv]

I'm sorry. I didn't know there was any more posts about this. I was out of town and returned to "much fun". Anyway, getting caught up and reading."air vent on fuel cap open" - yes, in fact, I tried it once with the cap "open" (sitting on it, but not engaged)"Cover closed and latched". I don't have the supression kit on it. I have no other "covers" other than the rear shroud coving the flywheel. I think you are referring to the cover that is near the shroud over the oil filter area. I'll see if I even have that cover as I've noticed that I didn't have one on mine when looking at pics.Guyfang - i'll jump TB5-7 to TB5-9 and get the above noted cover (or fabricate one) and test.All - Thanks for responding. The sad thing is that I just got this setup to be back up power for my house, new breaker panel, interlock and all. Now i'm going to sell the house and build a new one. This time, in the country. Yes, the Gen is coming with me. So this is a good time for me to put some load on this so I can make sure it will handle the new construction. Needless to say, the new house will be built a bit more generator friendly. Again, sorry for the delay in responding.

 

[glcaines]

I'm sorry. I didn't know there was any more posts about this. I was out of town and returned to "much fun". Anyway, getting caught up and reading."air vent on fuel cap open" - yes, in fact, I tried it once with the cap "open" (sitting on it, but not engaged)"Cover closed and latched". I don't have the supression kit on it. I have no other "covers" other than the rear shroud coving the flywheel. I think you are referring to the cover that is near the shroud over the oil filter area. I'll see if I even have that cover as I've noticed that I didn't have one on mine when looking at pics.Guyfang - i'll jump TB5-7 to TB5-9 and get the above noted cover (or fabricate one) and test.All - Thanks for responding. The sad thing is that I just got this setup to be back up power for my house, new breaker panel, interlock and all. Now i'm going to sell the house and build a new one. This time, in the country. Yes, the Gen is coming with me. So this is a good time for me to put some load on this so I can make sure it will handle the new construction. Needless to say, the new house will be built a bit more generator friendly. Again, sorry for the delay in responding.

You absolutely must have that cover present and it must be closed and latched. If it is missing, that explains why your generator shut down. If the cover is not present, closed and latched, the engine will overheat as that cover is an integral part of the air cooling. The temperature sensor will go open when the engine is overheating. Don't run the generator again until you have a cover mounted. Hopefully you haven't damaged the engine. You should be able to find a used cover quite easily. Some on here have parted out these gensets. If not, Delks likely has one. http://www.delksarmynavysurplus.com

 

[n5yzv]

yeah, it shut down twice. I've never had a way to have enough of a load on it until I had it connected to the house. Needless to say, I get the load up there. I have a door on order and I won't run it until it's installed. What would a sign of engine damage be? Anything I should check?

 

[Guyfang]

Get the door on. Run it with no load, to see if it will run an hour or two. If indeed the high temp is what shut it down before, the it was doing its job, and that's good. There should be no engine damage. If it runs an hour or two, try putting it on a load. Start light, go up. If it still shuts down like before, jump the safety circuit. If it will then run longer, then jump one safety after another. If it run when you have jumped only one safety, dig into the book and find out how to test it.

 

[n5yzv]

Guyfang - Sounds good. I guess it also makes sense that since that door (and sorry for my ignorance re the door) is not present, that it would have a tendency to overheat and trip the temp sensor. I've run it with no load / light load for 2 hours several times with no issues. So hopefully the temp sensor was doing its job due to my ignorance and lack of parts. The temp I tested before was about 87F out. Now, it's freezing cold, around 65 F during the day, so I would imagine at a full load, the cold temp won't affect the result/test.

 

[Guyfang]

Imagine and assume are words that will bite you in the patootie. In fact, your not even sure if it's the over heat switch at all. One step at a time.

 

[Chainbreaker]

Can you take photo's (or use your GoPro while running) to show us your unit from all angles? It might help to spot something obvious and to further confirm what cooling ductwork sheet metal might be missing.

 

[n5yzv]

Well, I got the cover in. I wasn't expecting it until later in the month. I got it mounted and proceeded to bring it online. Started great. I let it warm up for about 10 min. I turned the ac off via the thermostat. I turned off all breakers at the main panel (water heater, AC, Blower, Range, inside panel, etc...). I killed the utility breaker, then turned on the gen breaker (the one on the gen itself). Then, I engaged the panel side generator breaker. in short, I brought up each breaker to the house except the hot water heater and the dryer. Those are just too much. With the AC blower running, it was sitting at 75% load. Hz fine at 59.76 Hz. I ran this way for about 30 min. Then I started turning on more stuff. Heh. A couple of Elec blankets, 3 ceiling fans, all the lights on the second floor.... Shortly after, I heard it start to die. Naturally, I started killing light and fan switches as quickly as I could and it recovered a little, but died shortly after. I went out and reverted everything, killing the breaker on the gen side as well. I attempted to start the generator after it sat for maybe 5 min. It would not start as before.
Now, it did run longer than before. So, Was I expecting too much and this is a common thing when the gen is overloaded or do you think I have a possible issue with the temp sensor or one of the other failsafes in system? Also, I took some pics. Hopefully they attach.

 

[Guyfang]

Did you notice if the loovers opened up? Also, you are missing the exhaust elbow. About a million years ago we found out that when the exhaust went down onto the battery's, that the battery's were overheated and quickly went bad. Also, the engine tended to run hot. Try again, and see if the loovers open. The linkages tend to rust closed. Your set used to be an ASK model. Often people disconnected the loovers.

 

[n5yzv]

Yes, the loovers open up pretty wide. I'll dig up images of the elbow as I have a nice battery charger keeping those batteries good. Regarding the ASK, yeah, I started overhauling it with new insulation and prep to paint. When the 002a gets to be overloaded, wouldn't it sound like the engine is "bauging" down? This sounded similar to being shut down, but not as sudden as last time. Also, after it did die, It wouldn't start.

 

[Guyfang]

That COULD be, because the thermal element in the over temp switch takes time to cool off, and reset.

But that's IF its the over temp switch.

AND, the over temp switch could be doing its job. The set could be overheating.

Or the over temp switch COULD be acting up, (bad).

OR it could mean there is some other switch acting up.

Will the set start now?

If so, you may need to check the over temp switch, to see if its good. If it is, then maybe we need to see if the set is in fact overheating. If so, then that needs to be corrected. I tend to think its over heating. It didn't run long before putting the door on. You put the door on, and it ran longer. That in itself, is strange.

 

[n5yzv]

I couple of things. First, I looked at some equipment logs, turns out, it died at 16 min, not 30. Time must fly. So it didn't run longer. I just tested and it starts fine. When I open up the louvers, I begin to think about air flow. So, the large fan on the main shaft blows into the area where my new "close when run" shroud. From there, is the air flow to go across the fins of the "head" (from right to left - from front) then out the louvers? If this is the case, I have no air flow and I can't "see" from left to right across the fins of the "heads". (I'm saying "heads", the items between the louvers and the close-to-run shroud.) See image when open the louvers.

 

[glcaines]

You stated "When I open up the louvers". The louvers open automatically as the engine heats up. When first started the louvers should be closed. As the engine heats up, the louvers start opening and only open to the point required to cool the engine. When the engine is very hot, the louvers are wide open. The louvers not only open to cool the engine, but they also close or never open in cold weather. The automatic function is designed for the engine to maintain a uniform temperature when running. If you can open and close the louvers by hand, something is wrong.

 

[n5yzv]

Yes, they open as the unit warms up, and close when it cools down.

 

[n5yzv]

Oh, I'll clarify "when I open up the louvers": To see if there is "stuff" blocking airflow, and to that that picture, while the unit is off and cool.