Alternative fuels for diesel: impact on emissions?

[Adamlee]

I am doing more and more in-depth reading on the use of WVO, SVO, biodiesel blends, and so on (used ATF, used motor oil, among other things) for diesel-powered vehicles and equipment.
Mostly, I am interested in these options as a way to save money from overpriced fuel, but just as importantly as a means to becoming less dependent on foreign oil and all the politics attached to the oil industry (in a micro sense, of course!)

I have not read too much about studies or comparisons on emissions generated from these non-traditional sources of diesel fuel substitutes. I do know that the exhaust might smell like french fries or fried chicken, depending on what yer burning but any knowledge as to CO emissions, N, anything like that?

Bjorn? Know anything about this side of the issue? I would be really grateful if there was a source of info on this particular "angle" of the alternative fuel story that someone could point me towards.

This could be a win/win, for the veggie oil crowd, if there was a clear improvement in emissions quality versus straight diesel. Now, as far as burning waste motor oil and ATF, I have a feeling it's not going to be a particularly "clean" burn, but it is great to know that it can be done, if one chooses to go that route.

The more this alternative fuels idea bounces around in my head, the more I'm inclined to start looking for an old beater diesel VW to play with.....

 

[ken]

Most recycled motor oil is sold to shipping companies as bunker oil. Witch is burnt in ships as heavy fuel oil. So used oil is going to be burn't in a engine somewhere. It moght aswell be mine saving me money instead. i've used it in my multifuel for a while. The only prob has been having to change primary fuel filters more often.

 

[Adamlee]

alternative fuels

Most recycled motor oil is sold to shipping companies as bunker oil. Witch is burnt in ships as heavy fuel oil. So used oil is going to be burn't in a engine somewhere. It moght aswell be mine saving me money instead. i've used it in my multifuel for a while. The only prob has been having to change primary fuel filters more often.

what exactly happens to the filters? are they just clogging, do you notice a performance difference, what's the exhaust smoke (visible smoke) like, how's it smell (does it smell like a car does when it's literally "burning" oil), these are a few questions I had about using old motor oil or used ATF as fuel.

I am not knocking either choice, in fact; it may be a source of blend I might use myself.

Thanks for the insight!

Adam

 

[ken]

Adam, Yea the filters start to clog quicker. The truck starts to loose power like it's starving for fuel. I keep 2 extra filters under the seat and just change it out. I haven't had any problems with the other 2 filters though.
As far as the smoke goes, It stinks! and depending on how much oil is in the tank is how blue the exaust gets.
If you decide to go this route, i strongly sudjest you let the oil sit about a week. This will let as much of the metals suspended in the oil to settle. I use regular coffie filters to try trap clumps and trash that might be in the oil. I recently got a centrafuge and started slinging the oil to remove impurites. It works great. In 5 min the oil will seperate and you will have a clear liquid on top. So i've started burning that. I'll let you know how it works out on the filters

 

[clinto]

Yea the filters start to clog quicker. The truck starts to loose power like it's starving for fuel.

Ken, I am curious how much mileage you now getting out of filters, and how much of a change it is from straight diesel.

 

[houdel]

Adamlee - To answer your original question specifically - Biodiesel significantly reduces ALL engine emissions EXCEPT NOx. Per Joshua Ticknell, "From the Fryer to the Fuel Tank":

Carbon Dioxide - Net CO2 reduced 100%

Sulpher Dioxide - SO2 reduced 100% (don't know if this applies to Biodiesel made using the two stage Acid Esterfication-Base Transesterfication process though)

Soot reduced 40-60%

Carbon Monoxide - CO reduced 10-50%

Hydrocarbon - HC reduced 10-50%

Carcinogenic Polycyclic Aromatic Hydocarbons - PAH reduced 13-96%

Nitrous Oxide emissions (NOX) may increase or decrease 5-10% depending on age and tuning of the engine.

NOX and soot are further reduced in engines using a catalytic converter. Converters will be required on 2007 engines and are destroyed by sulpher, which is why 2007 and later diesel vehicles will have to use the new ultra low sulpher (ULS) fuel. ULS fuel requires a lubricity additive to properly lubricate the fuel injection pump. The sulpher in older fuels used to provide the needed lubricity; lubricity additives are not needed in Biodiesel as it inherently provides more lubrication than either the sulpher or the additives.

Hopes this answers your questions; if not feel free to ask more.

 

[ken]

Clinto, It's hard to say on the milage difference for the filters. Most of my trucks running is off road or stationary, running air powered tools. I can tell you that i used to change the filter about every 6 tanks of diesel. Now it's about every 4. I only pay $9 for the filter so i'm comming out way ahead. The used motor oil also adds lube for the injector pump so the new ULS fuel won't be a problem.

 

[lovebloodhounds]

Adam i am currently useing Bjorn recipe for biodiesel and my 95 dodge cummins loves it less engine clatter seems to have same mpgs but hard to say just yet. only burned one tank of bio with a hint of petrol diesel just yet. only problem with bio is cold weather my next project is to figure out were to put another tank on truck to keep it heated hope this helps Kenneth

 

[Adamlee]

alternative fuel choices for diesel....opinions

Guys, thanks alot for those perspectives on use of other fuel substitutes. Lee, thanks for that numerical data.....wow! Veggie oil & biodiesel sure seem to be pretty darn clean!

I am thinking of not only using my duece but experimenting with an old Mercedes 300 diesel or a beater VW diesel Rabbit......this could be good!

 

[cranetruck]

RE: alternative fuel choices for diesel....opinions

Here is what a couple of guys on the greasecar forum think about burning used motor oil (I don't necessarily share their opinions, but it's food for thought):

"Hey Grease Sheik,

Why bother burning the shit just bring it to a auto shop.
You have nothing to gain by burning it.

1) small particles of metal in the oil can add wear to your engine if they pass thru the filter
2) the toxic soft metals from the engine bearings such as cadmium, lead. tin will be released into the air.
3) old motor oil is acidic ( not hassidic - thats brooklyn)
and is detrimental to the oil it is mixed with
4) this will get you in a bad habit and cause more continual pollution
5) you will have a clean conscience by recycling it properly.

Any questions call George Bush at the White House and ask him if he gives a shit

Sincerely

Batteryboy

-------------------------

cgoodwin
grease master
Joined: Jun 2004 Jan 02, 2005 21:11

Batteryboy - you have my re5pect for that reply.

Sure you "could" burn it, you could also dump your antifreeze down the storm drain. "Should" you burn it is another question entirely.

1) Mess up your engine
2) You have no idea what is in it, used motor oil is about the most carcenigenic material there is and you will be burning this around your family and friends...In your comunity? See:3
3) Why not just make a huge early withdrawl for the Karma Bank.

Just give it to a recycler, if it is so little then why take all the risks. Get rid of it and smile to yourself.

chris "

 

[Adamlee]

alternative fuels

Thanks for your insight, BB...I had the sense that "burning oil" in the form of used motor oil would be fairly noxious....

but I had not done much research yet into the possibilities. I am trying to go as "clean and green" as I can....it would be great to be able to truly go "off the grid" with fuel dependence.....and do it with minimal negative impact.

Bjorn, do you run any other vehicles on Bio? I know you run a variety of vehicles in your family, just wondered if you used bio in any cars smaller than a deuce.

take care, Adam

 

[cranetruck]

RE: alternative fuels

Actually, we just got a '83 240D Mercedes plus a parts car just like it. it will be for my daughter....and the idea is to run it on Bio.

 

[rizzo]

RE: alternative fuels

getting tired of mixing bio all the time?

 

[cranetruck]

RE: alternative fuels

Not really Rizzo, only spend a couple of hours a week doing it.
BUT, I say this, people who collect grease from rendering dumpsters parked behind the restaurants are in for a messy task de-watering and filtering the contaminated WVO. Just pumping it out is a job. Anybody who took a peek into one of those dumpsters would know what I mean, a discusting stinking slop....don't know if it's even legal to remove the contents from somebody else's dumpster once the oil is dumped in it.
Getting the oil hot and fresh from the fryer makes all the difference.
One could even eat the french fries still floating in the oil, although I pick them out and toss them in the dumpster since they may contain water.
I have lots of WVO sitting in cubies in the garage, perhaps 300 gallons, which I'm using to mix with biodiesel for my "summer" mix (50-50). Decanting and filtering that oil takes more time than preparing biodiesel and it's clean oil, no water, detergents etc.

After the biodiesel is prepared and has been sitting in the tubs (my procedure) for a day or so, it's hardly necessary to filter it, it's so clean.

Kenneth, glad you decided to use the biodiesel, now just find a source for WVO and start your own production.

 

[Adamlee]

Re: RE: alternative fuels

Actually, we just got a '83 240D Mercedes plus a parts car just like it. it will be for my daughter....and the idea is to run it on Bio.

now here's something ironic....old 240D's and 300D's/TD's are on my short list of Xperimental bio-cars that I've been thinking of....given the choice between older/plentiful diesel vehicles (old rabbits, jettas, etc).....

my brother-in-law has a parked 82 300SD that would be worth a try....you never know!

 

[cranetruck]

RE: Re: RE: alternative fuels

Adam, check out greasecar.com forum for lots of info on running the old mercedeses on filtered WVO.

 

[Adamlee]

greasecar website

Bjorn, I've been glomming thru greasecar.com, saving stuff to my PC and it is truly a great resource.

Also, I've been doing the same with all of your posts on your WVO/bio work....made a "bio" folder to use as reference when not on the 'net.

Good luck on the 240D conversion, if you feel up to it, I'd love to hear how that goes (either via email or on-board here)..BTW, does that car (or the parts car) have a stick shift? That would be a nice option.

Adam

 

[cranetruck]

RE: greasecar website

Automatic. I don't want to "convert" the 240D, just run it on a mix of bio and regular diesel depending on the season.

 

[rizzo]

RE: greasecar website

I know a guy running his deuce on straight WVO. He has been doing this for over a month with no problems. Is the "cokeing" of the injectors a long term effect?

 

[Polverone]

Rizzo,

Is he just filtering it and putting it in the tank?
I was wondering about just going to Costco and getting fresh/new Soybean oil at $14 for 5 gals ($2.64 a gal) and mixing that 50/50 with diesel.