Another misadventure in the Deuce!!

[airmech3839]

Well I took deuce out of town to my moms. Even knowing my IP was leaking alittle but expected to have to stop a couple of times to bleed air off.... well it was more than a few times.... it took me 5 hrs to go 160miles. I admit that I was not the wisest of men and need some advice. I know that the Hydraulic head is leaking but I am not sure if I should just change the head or the whole IP... I can get either one but not sure if I would be ok to get just the head or IP.... also I am doing this under the "In the field" method and have limited tooling and places to work on it.... I am gonna look at manual tonight and look at how hard it is. Any advice for field service of IP replacement would be welcome.....

Oh and I already know I am an idjit for driving it.....

Tracy

I am in Gainesville, GA and am scheduled to be in the parade on monday so would like to get it resolved tomorrow..

 

[Parker2]

I would just change out the head. It's alot easier. Why is it leaking?

 

[thehaas]

where can you get injection pump or is better to get rebuilt or how hard is changing head or pump

 

[KsM715]

Oh and I already know I am an idjit for driving it.....

Not an idjit. Just more adventerous than others.

 

[airmech3839]

well the head has started leaking from the fittings under the lines that go to injectors... and on this trip she started acting up more... normally I would have to bleed air off every 15-20 miles but other than that she would run strong until it built up air in the system enough to make the truck hesitate...

Well now it will start cycling the power... I will have throttle all the way to the floor and she will hang out around 2000 rpm and then it would get a boost then back to 2000rpm... I was able to make it to my destination but I really cannot work on it here... I will have to take it to another location to work on it. I also think the in tank pump has weakend... at first part of trip the fuel would fountian out of the bleed port...now it dribbles... The IP is coverd in fuel and I dont know if some other part of the IP might be leaking...

 

[RANDYDIRT]

Your IP head may be bad, but this sounds like a filter issue.

Dirt

 

[airmech3839]

I just changed the filters about a month or 2 ago. hmmm I drained the bowls on the road as well and got a little water out.... but it looked good other than that...

 

[Jake0147]

The hydraulic head may still be an issue, but this really sounds like a supply side issue. Make sure the lift pump (in tank pump) is providing fuel under some pressure to the fuel pump on the IP. A clear section of line is a good way to check for air intrusion (or excessive water pockets) being supplied at the injection pump.
Fuel in the IP should be under pressure above atmospheric pressure, so while not impossible, it is unlikely that intrusion at the IP is causing this.
low pressure (below atmospheric pressure) in the delivery lines will certainly cause this, and a weak stream from the lift pump indicates this is a possibility. If it's having a hard time "feeding the need" at an idle (or with the engine stipped), then it's most certainly got at least some portions of the delivery system at a pressure lower than atmospheric pressure, where air intrusion can be an issue.
A very subjective test- Compare the "visually estimated" pressure at the secondary filters and at the primary filter. The primary can should have no obstruction to the tank, just lines. The secondary requires that fuel pass through the primary and secondary. Pressure gauges are awesome for this, but if the issue is great enough, you'll be able to "see" it without necessarily quantifying it.

 

[airmech3839]

what psi should I be looking for? and where... I cracked a line with intank pump running at the tank and got good fuel just after turning it one turn... so I checked the primary bowl and got good fuel... went to secondaries and drained as well... however the aft most filter seemed like it didnt have pressure behind it.... so my secondary filters may be clogged or causing enough resistance to cause the surging of power?...

 

[airmech3839]

well I have been instructed by the spousal unit that if I want her love and affection that I am not allowed to wrench on the deuce today since today is a celebration of my youngests 4th birthday and I am not allowed to miss it.... so I will probably spend monday moving the truck to a secure location and locking it up and then come back at another weekend to fix and repair it. I plan on bringing a set of spin on filter kits and changing all the fuel filters with the spin on type...then possibly change some fuel lines and maybe the whole IP... but I will need to build up funds for this and my wife will probably want me to just sell it as is and get rid of it...

I can see it coming.... she has always said it would cost too much to own... I can already feel the "I told you so" coming.........

 

[Parker2]

I bought a good take off hh for $100.00. So it's not an expensive fix. However if you do replace the entire pump it is more money and a bigger pain in the rear.

 

[airmech3839]

I have a line on a fairly cheap HH and an entire pump.... but I would like to know if I should have to bite the bullet and get the pump or if I could get away with a HH... but the spin on filter kits are nearly 400 for the primary and secondary... thats a chunk of change!! If I change the pump I will have it in a hanger and do it over a weekend..

Well time to build a list of things to do to it...

 

[G-Force]

Airmech,
I don't believe there is anytrhing wrong with your IP...except that its leaking. There are copper gaskets under the fittings that screw into the IP like the gasket in the center bolt you pulled out previously. It appears you're pulling air into your fuel system and it isn't from the fittings on the top of the IP. Think about it.....the in tank pump only floods the line up to the IP gear pump mounted on the side of the IP body. I beleive it should develop between 5 to 7 psi. The gear pump boosts the pressure up to about 28 psi. The lines running up to the injectors are pressurized to over 2000 psi. If you keep having to bleed the air out of your filters to restore power then you're sucking air into your fuel system. apparently not a big air leak but one that causes a power loss over a short pereiod of time. If I were you I'd start looking at your fuel lines and keep your money in your pocket for the time being......let me do some checking and I'll see what I can come up with.........In the mean time go enjoy your sons birthday party......He's only 4 once you know......

 

[airmech3839]

Roger that G-force.... that makes since...... As long as I know what the pressures should be at different points I can hook up some gauges to figure out where my real problem is...

Thanks again!!

We slept out in the deuce last night.. and we are staying out there again tonight.... we will have a sister of one of the cousins out there tonight and we may get some rain too... fun times...

 

[SpyDad]

Air Bleed Off

Ok, being a Noob M35A2 deuce owner, I am wondering about the frequency of bleeding out the air and any condensation out of the tanks. Is this done after driving it each time? What can happen if this air is not bled out once you stop driving and shut down. Any help and info from you more seasoned owners is appreciated.

 

[Parker2]

Ok, being a Noob M35A2 deuce owner, I am wondering about the frequency of bleeding out the air and any condensation out of the tanks. Is this done after driving it each time? What can happen if this air is not bled out once you stop driving and shut down. Any help and info from you more seasoned owners is appreciated.

He is having a problem with his truck. This is not something that should be happening at all.

 

[clinto]

Ok, being a Noob M35A2 deuce owner, I am wondering about the frequency of bleeding out the air and any condensation out of the tanks. Is this done after driving it each time? What can happen if this air is not bled out once you stop driving and shut down. Any help and info from you more seasoned owners is appreciated.

There has been much discussion on the site about air tank draining procedures.

Go here:

Steel Soldiers::Military Vehicles Supersite - Search Forums

Use "air AND tank AND drain" as a search query, select the deuce forum (not the deuce modification and hot rodding forum!) and you should find several threads which cover this topic in detail.

Welcome to the site!

 

[airmech3839]

Thats right this is not a typical... Although the air tanks need to be drained after a days operation to get the moisture out..

 

[airmech3839]

Ok here it is and all my dumb butt thinking... Ok IP HH is still leaking but I have found the air intering the system... I had an extra primary filter that was in the box under my seat I had forgot about... I was gonna have to move the truck to park it in more secure location...so I said hhmmmm.... I remembered that I had good fuel flow out drain on the primary filter bowl... and hardly any at secondaries... hmmmm.... well it cant hurt I said and I had my step dad help me change it.... got her good and snug and checked her for leaks then bled the air out and checked it again... no leaks.... so I fired it up and took it on a road test to see what it might do... I was only getting about 10-14 miles before she would start building up air.... and oh the primary filter was nasty.... anyway went about 15 miles and then came back to house and checked for air.... no air in system and good fuel flow.... Praise the Lord!!!


I am now sitting at my home 180 miles away after a nice non-eventful trip home!!!

So..... I am a dumb butt and should really like to thank you that chimed in and set me straight!!

 

[G-Force]

Glad you got it fixed airmech. I think since your primary was partially clooged the gear pump might have been pulling such a vacuum that you might have pulled some air from the preheater circuit. I was looking for a page in a TM that said the minimum pressure from the in tank pump is 2 psi but I couldn't find it. I found that the in tank pump pressure is about 5 to 7 psi. The gear pump on the side of the IP should develop 30 psi at idle and 60 psi at 2600 rpm after the final filter. Attached is the spec page from the TM for the IP. Sorry it took so long to get back to you...and I'm glad you got it home.