Electrical problem - from battery to starter buton

[buck1013]

I need help with my deuce. The other day I drove my deuce to one of my friends house. I had no problems. When I cranked my deuce, it sounded very weak, but cranked on the the first turn, of course. On the way home my guages were twitching and my lights would not work. The next day I did some investigating and found that one of my battery cable ends had melted (no corrosion) where the bolt that hold the cable eye on the end. I made a new cable and crimped on the end with a hydraulic press (ground cable). Turned the power switch to the on position, and the beast tried to turn over without pressing the starter button. Assumed it might be the starter solenoid and took off the starter and had it rebuilt. Put it back on and plugged the starter button back in and same thing happened. I know I should have replaced the button, but the starter had stripped bend-ix gear and other problems, so they say. Might there be a wire grounded between the started button and the starter?

 

[1stSarge]

Welcome Buck.

So did you disconnect the starter button?

You said no corrosion. Sounds like you know what you are doing, so I assume that there was no dirt, or a loose connection involved.

I can imagine a scenario where a starter button shorts out, then the starter kicks in, and with the fuel shut off, it just keeps cranking and melts the old battery cable, running the battery down in the process, hence the slow cranking and the “other starter problems“.

Just a wild hypothetical, but trying to figure what would cause all of the problems mentioned.

Isolate the button first, then work down the line. You have the prints out of the TM right?

---John

 

[Gunner0311]

I am pulling my hair out(what hair I have left) with a similar problem!

My M109A3 would not "roll over", so I pulled the starter and had it
rebuilt. Put it back it and EVERYTHING was dead! No electrical
power anywhere but at the batteries?

My son and I fingured we got the wires going to the starter mixed up,
so we changed them around. Presto! My low air pressure alarm
sounded and my instruments all worked again, so I thought I was back
in business. Wrong! I pushed the starter button and nothing! Just
had the voltmeter drag down some, and the started did squat....

Can somebody post the wiring diagram for the starter, as I cannot get
any of the technical manuals in RESOURCES to open. Very frustrating...

Any and all advice is welcome. This I my first real problem with my truck.
I hate these electrical mysteries!!

 

[cowhauler185]

check your batterys, isolate them and check voltage on both, multiple battery, both in series and parallel (how do U spell it) can be challenging, just a thought, good luck

 

[buck1013]

Batteries are good. Starter is new, however there is a small difference where the wires bolt to the back of the starter. The guys at aamco said that they served the same purpose, but in different locations. The starter is fine, I think. It works perfectly, but I believe the problem lies within the starter button. It is a two-prong harness at the back of the button. When I plug the harness into the button, the starter engages. My batteries are being drained when I leave them connected. like there was a wire grounding to the frame. On the other hand, seems to me that I would smell rubber smoking, or my batteries would be hot. Neither is happening. My brother said that maybe she got struck by lightning. Kind of silly if you ask me, but it happens.

 

[buck1013]

By the way, thanks you guys for reading and responding to my question so fast. This is the kind of place I can get used to.
TM? Not sure what you mean. Service manual ... yes, I have that. Kind of moldy and hard to read. I have isolated the button. I believe that is going to be my problem, but would it cause a slow drain on a 24v battery system. I know it can happen with 12v, so I guess it is plausible for any low voltage system.

 

[rchalmers3]

Buck,

I had a starter button fail, it failed kinda like you are describing: Stuck in contact mode. Low voltage can cause a welding of the contacts in both the starter and push button switch.

Maybe you can pull out the switch and attempt a contact cleaning??

Rick

 

[MATT]

Buck,

Buy a Digital-Volt-Ohm-Meter and check voltage on the smaller wire on the starter solenoid while someone attempts to crank the engine over. Do you have 24 volts?

Yes- Check your grounds on the starter-if they are good, you got a bad "new" starter
No- Could be a bad starter relay bolted to the engine block, push button switch to name a few

 

[1stSarge]

Yeah Sorry, TM = Technical Manual

There should not be any drain or “phantom load” when this switch is connected. It gets it power directly from the main power switch. If that switch is off, then there should be no power to the starter button.

All of the diagrams are in the manuals in the recourses section. Gunner, right click the link to the manual, and pick “save link as” then save it to your desktop or wherever. You should be able to see it then. Keep them in a folder for handy reference when you are not on line.

Its hard to show the diagram in a JPEG format on here because the diagram is meant to be printed in a large format, and the size restrictions on posting are too small, but here is this one:

 

[63sierra10]

I would check your wires coming out of the main power switch on down to your starter switch. Disconnect the starter switch on the dash and check the ohms, without pushing it in, there should be no signs of a connection. Also check each wire from the solenoid to their end point for any signs of a short. The Technical Manuals may be viewed in the resources drop down list at the top of the page. Good luck.

 

[buck1013]

Thanks guys. Will do today, now that our temps are in the two digit realm.

 

[Ord22]

i would like to know the end result, thanks.

 

[Westex]

I was pulling what's left of my hair out with electical problems, and decided to go the easy way and replaced the military batteries with 94R Maxx start batteries from Wally world and voila! It starts like a champion. Moral of the story, suspect the batteries.

 

[buck1013]

Cranked Deuce Lee yesterday. It was an easy fix once I acquired a good wiring diagram (thanks bob). Attach wire "10" here and there ... attach wire "74A" here and "74" there, etc. and whola. All six cylinders bangin. Magnetic relay was the whole problem. $$$, time, and a little wisdom is all it takes, and when we can find a way to maintain without the $$$, we will all be in better shape.

 

[jakemanzee22]

im so glad i found this thread. the same exact thing happened to me. i go to start the deuce and it does nothing, doesnt turn over, nothing. i press the button again and i get a clicking sound and smoke from the passenger side. so i go open the battery box and there it is, a molted pile of metal. almost like the battery terminal was welding itself to the post on the battery. as soon as i removed the rubber cover, my truck started right up, and no more smoke.