Help Needed

[M35A2]

Hi all.

A friend of mine has an M109A3 and needs some help. He thinks his engine has seized and I need some ideas.

He said the truck ran fine. He then parked it up for two weeks. When he went to use it he said he started the engine and within 20 seconds the engine shut down. When he went to re-start it he said it will only turn over half an inch. The engine is a LDT-465-1D Hurcules unit. He said the last time it ran it was running great.

Any ideas greatly appreciated.

Cheers

Andy

 

[willysmd]

Hi Andy
You can sometimes get engine lock through un-burnt fuel in the cylinders, did it go BANG when it happened?

 

[Massm35a2]

Have him try to remove all the injectors and turn it over to see if it is hydrolocked.

 

[poppop]

Get on the flywheel first and see if it will turn backwards. If it does then it is hydro locked.

 

[willysmd]

Have him try to remove all the injectors and turn it over to see if it is hydrolocked.

Thats the word I was looking for Hydrolocked

 

[builder77]

How could it be hydrolocked if it ran for 20 seconds? I thought that that was just at initial cranking.

 

[JDToumanian]

How could it be hydrolocked if it ran for 20 seconds? I thought that that was just at initial cranking.

I agree... If it hydrolocked while running the pistons and rods would be bent / broken. It sounds like it seized before the oil pressure had a chance to come up and / or there's a problem with the oil pump or oil (diluted with fuel, etc.). Not good, but I've heard of engines being unstuck with the use of a penetrating oil, you would need to remove the injectors to pour it into the cylinders. The engine would probably never be the same though...

My guess is that your friend will soon be shopping for either an overhaul kit or a replacement engine.

Regards,
Jon

 

[Manstein]

Make sure to tell him to take all the drive belts off the engine before trying to turn it by the crank. I have seen many engines that folks thought were locked up only to have a alternator/generator or other component that was locked up and the belt stopped the engine.

 

[rdixiemiller]

I would wonder if it popped a rod in the first 20 seconds.

 

[M35A2]

Thanks for all the replies guys, keep them coming.


I thought that it hydrolocked myself, but when he told me the engine ran for about 20-30 secs before shutting down, I thought that this can't be the problem as any water that was in the cylinders would have been burnt off by then.

As I haven't seen the truck I can't really help much. He said when he cranks the starter the engine will only turn about half an inch, then jams. I'm at a loss as to what this could be. Maybe he has blown a con rod? I'm also wondering if the timing chain failed and mashed the engine, but he never said it made a really bad noise, just that it shut down.

I suppose oil pump failure is a very possible possibility? I will ask him if his gauge was working? But when you look at this video link of a chevy V8 running at full revs with a gallon of water in the crankcase and two blown head gaskets, 20 seconds on tickover then engine shutdown must mean something serious has happened.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=TuKYBb9wPDs

This is the poor sods second engine, the first burnt the pistons out using contam as fuel.


Any more ideas will be great, then I can go down and have a look at the truck for him as he isn't mechanically minded.



Cheers Guys.

Andy

 

[ARMYMAN30YearsPlus]

Of course it could be a chain of unfortunate events like a fuel shut off by some unknown reason and then hydrolocked by the unspent fuel. I would most likely start by loosening the injectors as mentioned and try to crank. Are the batteries up to grade to turn it over? That could be the reason it only goes a little and would be good news if that was all that kept it from turning.

 

[pistolnut]

I'd think always check the easy stuff first. The accessory (alt, water pump, etc.) sounds like a good place to start. I had a seized engine in a pickup truck many years ago. It had been running fine but when I went to start it--nothing. I tried push starting it and the tires locked on the pavement. I took the spark plugs out and it still wouldn't turn over. When I removed the engine, I found that a tooth had broken off of the starter bendix and the bendix had been in a bind with the flywheel somehow. The engine was fine, I needed a $10.00 (at the time) starter bendix assembly.

 

[JDToumanian]

I have seen many engines that folks thought were locked up only to have a alternator/generator or other component that was locked up and the belt stopped the engine.

When I removed the engine, I found that a tooth had broken off of the starter bendix and the bendix had been in a bind with the flywheel somehow. The engine was fine, I needed a $10.00 (at the time) starter bendix assembly.

Great tips! I'm making mental notes for future reference... I may have pulled an engine before thinking of either of these. There's quite a bunch of mechanics on this site.

Regards,
Jon

 

[rdixiemiller]

Pull the injectors, put the tranny/t-case in neutral. Try to turn it over. Depress clutch pedal and try again (in case tranny is somehow locked up). If it still won't work, pull tranny and try to turn engine at the flywheel. I'm afraid it doesn't sound good!
Pulling all belts is a good idea, try that first.
Now, if all these things don't free up the motor:
1) Pull the IP and front cover, look for something in the gears.
2) Pull the heads and check pistons/sleeves/etc. Try to roll the engine backwards and see if all pistons are moving.
3) Drop pan and check crank, rods, and oil pump gears.

 

[Manstein]

Assuming the engine is toast... anybody know what a engine assembly for one of these costs?

 

[rdixiemiller]

I paid 450 for one in the can from GL a couple of years ago.

 

[Manstein]

That is a bargain in the scheme of things, if you can do the work yourself.

 

[M35A2]

Thanks for all the replies guys.

I will let him know what to check.

Cheers

Andy