HEMTT wheel adaptor plates

[13 MIKE]

I finally got time to make some plates. Some guys were asking about how they bolt up differently. You can remove the outer studs, and press them into the new plate. Assemble the wheel with the plate underneath, and bolt together as normal.

This allows you to mount the wheel on the truck, and not have it sit inboard towards the springs.

The plates work both ways so the choice is yours.

 

[nk14zp]

Looks good.

 

[DMaddox]

it looks a though the wheel is covering the holes for the studs?

 

[mahdey]

it looks a though the wheel is covering the holes for the studs?

you need to machine the Hemmt wheels to fit these and any other adapter plates on the market. What this plate does is effectively remove the machine work and precise welding needed to weld in a new center.

With these you can either place them behind the rim and pound the studs back in, or place it in front of them and bolt them on using the Hemmt's nut's on the studs (sounds weird doesn't it ). After that you can place the tire on the wheel and bolt your new wheels on your Deuce.

This is an ideal design as Hemmt rims are everywhere for super cheap. It beats having to pay 350 plus bucks/piece for A3 rims or more for other guys's wheels.

I'll be making a step by step guide/review on these adapter plates and will post pictures and all that fun stuff we SS'ers like once i get my set on my truck.

 

[DMaddox]

thanks for the clarification

 

[wreckerman893]

Are you selling them?????

 

[13 MIKE]

Yes, i have an ad in the classifieds. $120.00 a plate plus shipping.
HEMTT wheel adaptor plates for Deuce and a half - Steel Soldiers::Military Vehicles Supersite

 

[jsaulter]

Sounds so much better than those other ones. How or why can you sell them cheaper?

 

[13 MIKE]

I'm a manufacturer of metal goods. I buy millions of pounds of steel a year.

My steel suppliers appreciate my business, so i get pricing very few people can touch. I pass the savings on.

These kind of products are what i make every day, i have been doing it for decades.

 

[jblack6527]

I was just admiring these on another site, good looking plates!

 

[gimpyrobb]

I have been to Mike's place. He makes LOTS of metal stuff, big and small.

 

[pjpiche1]

Mike, the shoulders on the original studs are not long enough to go through the plate and back side of the wheel. This allows the wheel to move up to 1/4 of an inch on the plate which is enough force to sheer the lugs and possibly loose a wheel. The studs must be replaced with a stud that has at least 1/2 of an inch longer shoulder than stock.

btw, I do like your adapter plate.

 

[jesusgatos]

Mike, the shoulders on the original studs are not long enough to go through the plate and back side of the wheel. This allows the wheel to move up to 1/4 of an inch on the plate which is enough force to sheer the lugs and possibly loose a wheel. The studs must be replaced with a stud that has at least 1/2 of an inch longer shoulder than stock.

btw, I do like your adapter plate.

I was wondering about that. Asked in another thread, but never got an answer.

 

[13 MIKE]

Mike, the shoulders on the original studs are not long enough to go through the plate and back side of the wheel. This allows the wheel to move up to 1/4 of an inch on the plate which is enough force to sheer the lugs and possibly loose a wheel. The studs must be replaced with a stud that has at least 1/2 of an inch longer shoulder than stock.

btw, I do like your adapter plate.

The holes in the plate are smaller than the clearance thru hole in the rim, so it doesn't move a 1/4", but there is some.

Tightening the outer nuts to spec, is important. If this is an issue for somebody, than they should swap the studs.

This is the same as somebody letting there lugnuts get loose, and shearing the studs at the hub.

Just to point out, you don't have to mount these to the back of the rim. They work just fine the regular way. I saw a way to make them a little more versatile.

Jesusgato, i don't remember seeing the question asked before, i wouldn't ignore it.

 

[jesusgatos]

The holes in the plate are smaller than the clearance thru hole in the rim, so it doesn't move a 1/4", but there is some.

Tightening the outer nuts to spec, is important. If this is an issue for somebody, than they should swap the studs.

This is the same as somebody letting there lugnuts get loose, and shearing the studs at the hub.

Just to point out, you don't have to mount these to the back of the rim. They work just fine the regular way. I saw a way to make them a little more versatile.

Jesusgato, i don't remember seeing the question asked before, i wouldn't ignore it.

I like the plates too, but I think the points that have been raised about the plate and the studs is something that deserves a little more attention than 'if this is an issue for somebody...'. If this is an issue for anybody, it's too late.

If these plates can be mounted on the frontside or the backside of the center-sections, then I don't see how the stud holes could be smaller than the stud holes in the center-section. I mean, if the studs can be pressed into the plate, the holes must be the same size as the holes in the back half of the center-section, right? But the threaded section of the studs is smaller in diameter than the splined part of the studs, right? So if you use the plates on the backside, the studs will be loose in the center-section. And if you use the plates on the frontside, the studs will be loose in the plates. Right?

I don't think this is the same as letting lugnuts get loose either. Wheels are either hub-centric or lug-centric, but what keeps the two halves of these wheels and the plates all properly aligned? I'm guessing that the holes in the front half of the center-sections are smaller in diameter than the holes in the backside of the center-section. Is that right? I honestly don't know. I've never even seen one of these wheels in person. If the plates shift/move at all, relative to the center-section, I think that would be VERY bad. So as far as backside adapter-plate go, I would think that longer studs are just about essential. The stud would just need to have splined shanks long enough to engage the back hale of the center-section, after being pressed through the adapter plate.

I guess it's cool to give people the option to mount these plates on the frontside of the wheels, and it seems like you could solve this problem by just making some 'frontside-specific' plates with smaller holes. Personally though, I wouldn't want to give up the ability to disassemble these wheels quickly and easily, with the wheel still mounted on the truck.

Then there's always weld-on adapter plates. But in order to make them more DIY-friendly, you could include a second indexing ring that would be be bolted to the center-section using a few of the stud-holes, just to position the adapter plate for welding (then the indexing ring would be removed after tack-welding). That would eliminate the need to center the wheels on a lathe, or whatever other method someone might use to make sure the wheels were true prior to welding. I think that would be pretty cool.

 

[13 MIKE]

The remark about "it being an issue" was in reference to somebody not being able to torque the nuts tight enough, or somebody who wouldn't do any kind of PM.

With the nuts loose, the plate has about .040 of movement, .020 side to side. Nowhere near the 1/4" that was mentioned earlier.

The plates don't need the hole size changed to run them on the front, they are already as small as you would want to go.

Any plate that anybody has made has slop between the holes, and the stud. They all require the nuts to tightened to spec.

How is it not the same as a hub centric truck, like my F-250 that has loose lugnuts? There is more slop between that wheel, and the studs.

The 2 halves of the rim center to themselves, and the most the plates can be out is .020.

The holes in the front half of the rim are larger than the holes in the back half.

The outside nuts must be tightened correctly, and inspected just like a lug nut.
That goes for any similar adapter.


Not to mention that if the nuts come loose, the wheel goes flat.
Mike

 

[DAS]

Mike, they do look good, I was toying with the idea too,but have alot of other projects going......Something to talk about.....Drill all the holes the same and buy GR 8 bolts and nuts with lock washers or lock nuts to assemble it in perfet alinement.......DAS

 

[Leadfoot]

This is from a person whose wife was test driving a volvo that was hit by a 22.5 tire and wheel of a truck coming at her at 60 plus miles an hour. The volvo was completely totaled. Wheels are not something to guess about. If you really look at the wheel you will notice the outside studs only hold the tire on the wheel. The center stud holes are tapered on both sides not only to make the wheel reversible but it also centers both halfs of the wheel. Any movement will only compound with the weight of the tires and wheels. The outside studs only have flat nuts so it does not matter what you torque the nuts to they are not going to stop that movement. Maybe you could taper all of the holes and use tapered nuts. Sorry for being negative but after you see what a loose wheel can do to a car you realize this is not something to take lightly.

 

[pjpiche1]

I designed and built this same conversion over a year ago. I do not have my exact figures in front of me. I do remember, the wheels at my shop having almost a 1/4 inch of possible misalignment. Not exactly 1/4 but very close. You have to add the possible misalignment of the back plate to the compounded misalignment of the top plate off of true center. That is the shock load that the deuce studs receive. Their is nothing holding the top plate centric. It is cushioned by the rubber o-ring. It still moves on the bottom plate. These wheels were originally designed to be center centric. That part of the design is cut off to make room for the conversion. So, something has to be put back into place to correct that flaw.

The .040 of play in just the back-plate alone (not even taking into consideration the possible play of the top plate) is more than enough play to sheer the studs on an axle.

The two plates are bolted together with flanged nuts. It doesn't matter if they are torqued to the correct spec, they will not stop lateral movement of the plates. You must have a tapered designed nut to stop that. The plates are going to constantly misalign as the truck goes down the road.

I know for a fact that a flanged nut on a wheel that is non-centric does not work. My sister in law had a horse trailer custom built by a large trailer manufacturer. They delivered the trailer(about 50 miles). The trailer was loaded for the show. With all new wheels the lugs should be re-tightened in short intervals. So, I torqued the lug nuts(to the stated spec.) before she left. They were loose. I did not take the time to look at the design of the hub and wheel. She left Athens, Ga. and just as she crossed the South Carolina line on I-20 she noticed her wheel in the other lane. Once stopped, all of the studs were sheered on that hub. The wheel behind it was loose and missing studs. All of the other wheels were loose. So, I had to drive to South Carolina to pick up 7 horses. Luckily no one was hurt. miraculously, the wheel rolled to a stop without hitting anything

Here is what they had done. They installed a 19.5 center centric 8 lug /5/8 bore wheel on a non-centric 8 lug /5/8 stud hub with flanged lug nuts. The tolerances between the stud and bore were far tighter that .040. The manufacturer claimed that the design they put on the trailer was safe, until they had it delivered back to the plant. Their tuned changed. Come to find out they had just purchased these axle-wheel packages. This was the first trailer they had installed it on. They were glad that we had found the flaw before they sent out a bunch of trailers. They corrected the problem with the axle/wheel and added a few nice features to her trailer for free.

I want you to know, I like your product. I am not knocking it at all. Just simply stating that the original stud with a flanged nut is an accident waiting to happen. By simply changing the studs the wheel will be a top shelf conversion.

 

[13 MIKE]

I designed and built this same conversion over a year ago. I do not have my exact figures in front of me. I do remember, the wheels at my shop having almost a 1/4 inch of possible misalignment. Not exactly 1/4 but very close. No, .040 is nowhere near .250 . The holes in the top part are .855, the studs are .750. The holes in my plate are .800 You have to add the possible misalignment of the back plate to the compounded misalignment of the top plate off of true center. That is the shock load that the deuce studs receive. Huh, shock load. Its cushioned by a big air filled tire.Their is nothing holding the top plate centric. It is cushioned by the rubber o-ring. The wheel top and bottom center themselves as it draws down on the o-ring.It still moves on the bottom plate. These wheels were originally designed to be center centric. That part of the design is cut off to make room for the conversion. So, something has to be put back into place to correct that flaw.

The .040 of play in just the back-plate alone (not even taking into consideration the possible play of the top plate) is more than enough play to sheer the studs on an axle. Are you saying that being out of round .040 will shear the axle studs off a truck with the lugs tight? I'm not even going to argue that nonsense.



The two plates are bolted together with flanged nuts. It doesn't matter if they are torqued to the correct spec, they will not stop lateral movement of the plates. You must have a tapered designed nut to stop that. The plates are going to constantly misalign as the truck goes down the road.

I know for a fact that a flanged nut on a wheel that is non-centric does not work. Again, wrong. Works great on my F-250. It is hub-centric, with flanged nuts. My sister in law had a horse trailer custom built by a large trailer manufacturer. They delivered the trailer(about 50 miles). The trailer was loaded for the show. With all new wheels the lugs should be re-tightened in short intervals. So, I torqued the lug nuts(to the stated spec.) before she left. They were loose. I did not take the time to look at the design of the hub and wheel. She left Athens, Ga. and just as she crossed the South Carolina line on I-20 she noticed her wheel in the other lane. Once stopped, all of the studs were sheered on that hub. The wheel behind it was loose and missing studs. All of the other wheels were loose. So, I had to drive to South Carolina to pick up 7 horses. Luckily no one was hurt. miraculously, the wheel rolled to a stop without hitting anything Glad to hear no one was hurt.

Here is what they had done. They installed a 19.5 center centric 8 lug /5/8 bore wheel on a non-centric 8 lug /5/8 stud hub with flanged lug nuts. The tolerances between the stud and bore were far tighter that .040. Really? Far tighter than .040. So maybe.015. That's roughly 2 human hairs clearance on each side of the lug. That's pretty snug. The manufacturer claimed that the design they put on the trailer was safe, until they had it delivered back to the plant. Their tuned changed. Come to find out they had just purchased these axle-wheel packages. This was the first trailer they had installed it on. They were glad that we had found the flaw before they sent out a bunch of trailers. They corrected the problem with the axle/wheel and added a few nice features to her trailer for free.

I want you to know, I like your product. I am not knocking it at all. Just simply stating that the original stud with a flanged nut is an accident waiting to happen. I don't remember a statement like this being said about anybody else's plates. By simply changing the studs the wheel will be a top shelf conversion.

Ok, my answers in red.

There are a bunch of these plates made by others, and being used now. If someone has not flipped their hubs, then they have the same condition as mounting my plates behind the rim.

Has anybody questioned using a 3/8 plate on the steer axle with the severe side load presented by steering? Thats why i went to a 1/2 plate.

How about the guys welding wheels together? Everybody seems to assume they are fine, I hope they had their welder set right.

I know a little about welding too, i have 10 guys that are certified to D15.1 AAR railroad spec. They can weld a railroad coupler on a car back together, and send it back on the tracks.

I saw what people were making, and i wanted to make something stronger, and safer. 1/2 vs 3/8, and much cheaper, i also believe my outer holes have less clearance than others plates.

I accept any questions, and am not offended by criticism.

There is a certain amount of personal responsibility required to make sure everything is assembled, and tightened properly. Proper attention has to be made to regularly check that nothing is loose. No matter whose product.


This is not a business to me, just a way to help others use their rims. If anybody thinks my plates are inferior, or a "accident waiting to happen" please do not purchase any.