NDT Replacements

[AN/ARC186]

I've searched through the forums and came up with loads of info on tires to use when going to super singles and such.

I'm a bit drain bamaged and I prefer to keep my rig on all 10 feet.

what tires would you recommend to replace the NDT's for decent off road as well as on road performance while still using the stock rims and 10 tire configuration?

 

[srodocker]

defiantly listening in on this one

 

[cattlerepairman]

You do realize that you asked a question somewhat similar to "what is the best pizza topping"?
Answer is: "It depends...."

If you want to keep the stock look, then consider 11.00x20 NDTs. Benefits of the bigger tires and no look-compromise. NDTs perform surprisingly well, when used correctly (i.e. aired down to as little as 15 psi when going on soft ground).

Twin duals in the back will degrade your off-road capability in most cases, regardless of tire choice (and I am not talking about the casual trip over an unpaved road, but "serious" off-roading where you get stuck far, far away from civilisation!

Radials with aggressive tread (e.g. Michelin military tires) look cool and are "better" in some instances; the issue is the higher side wall flex of radial tires, compared to NDTs, and the lack of clearance between the duals. You will hear anything from "does not matter" to "will rub and blow up", depending on what people experienced, how they use the truck and how heavy of a load they carry on the bed.

Generally speaking, singling out is preferable for many people when using more modern and/or bigger tires.

You can mix; depending on what you use the truck for, you can use different tires on the steering axle than on the duals, as long as their circumference is the same.

 

[number9]

I think the Firestone T831's look awesome and they seem to be big for their size in the 11.00R x 20. There is a pic of a few trucks on here with them. Search for Firestone and in one of the threads you'll see a tan Deuce with 10 of them on it that looks bad-arse. From accounts of folks here who have seen them in action off-road they go really good too.

If I were to put 10 new tires on my truck, that's what it'd be I think for sure. I'm really wanting to single out though, but don't want to go the 395 route. Still have to figure that one out.

.....

 

[hklvette]

I have no basis for comparison, but the truck I have has 11R20 Michelin XLs, dualed out back and singled up front. The perform pretty well, but I need to do something about the truck's tendency to "push" through turns.

Also, one thing I noticed about the dualed XLs in snow is that they like to bounce once they begin to loose traction. I haven't checked the air pressure in them yet, so it could be that they're too high, but I would think that singled XLs would be far less prone to bouncing in the same situation.

 

[LanceRobson]

My only experience with alternative tires is with 1100R20 XLs on a M35a2.

As far as "stock look" I guess it depends on the era. I've bought a M35A2 and a trailer with 1100R20 XLs from GL and there are some sold through GL that way every week. They also come out of GL with Goodyear and other radials, both standard tread and off road tread. My truck was already singled out with the hubs flipped.

To me, the only drawbacks to the XLs, and they are small ones, is the vibration below about 25 MPH from the lugs hitting the road and the weight of a mounted tire when changing them. I feel the vibration mostly in the steering wheel so I keep a close eye on the front end parts.

Sidewall flex and rubbing are not a problem with aired down tires. The XLs sidewalls are far stiffer than the NDTs and they would only be aired down for low speed operation so even if there were contact you wouldn't build up heat. The sidewalls of the XLs are stiff enough that I've wondered if an empty deuce with both tires flat on one axle end would have the rims collapse the sidewalls or just bow them a little like our dune buggies.

Don't forget to check for rocks stuck between the duals after any road operation. They can be deadly if they come out at highway speed and can ruin both tires in short order if they stay stuck.

I agree that a singled truck with something like XLs will outperform a dual tire truck in many off road situations. Most of the time a deuce rear end is not heavy enough to get 8 tires to bite in reduced traction situations. My singled M35A2 with XLs and a sprag transfer case will go places in mud and snow that would leave my dual tired M35A2 with NDTs and airshift transfer case stuck. I've never driven a truck with dual XLs so I can't speak to whether the difference is mostly tire tread or the better per tire bite of the singles (regardless one tread pattern).

I'm awaiting the EUC on my first M813A1 and will have it on dual XLs before next winter so I'll get my chance to compare then.

FWIW, NDT sidewalls are pretty prone to getting cut in crawling around sharp rocks and downed trees and the XL sidewalls are far less so.

One of the guys who did the coast to coast run on US 20 a few years ago had pretty aggresive Goodyears and jatonka had Goodyears on his M109 for the trip. If he doesn't reply to this thread, shoot him a PM.

Lance

 

[BKubu]

The Goodyear G177s are fairly aggressive, ride well and seem to wear well, too. I have them on a couple of trucks. Admitteldly, they are 5 tons, but they will work just as well on a deuce, but you'll lose a bit of power with the larger tires.

 

[LanceRobson]

but you'll lose a bit of power with the larger tires.

Good morning, Bruce

I think my singled truck, which came from a NJARNG maintenance unit, had the fuel turned up and may have had the speedometer drive recalibrated. The speedo is dead on and it goes up hills a lot faster than you'd expect. I very rarely downshift.

It will bury the speedo needle without straining. I like the exptra power for short hills but keep my foot out of the fuel on long hills since it does not have a pyro and I don't want to break anything. I usually keep my road speed at around 50-52 MPH.

Do those Goodyears have a highway or more aggressive tread?

Lance

 

[BKubu]

The Goodyear G177 has what I would call an aggressive highway tread pattern, but I would call it more highway than aggressive. They are commonly used on the M939 series trucks that were converted from NDCCs and where ABS was installed.

 

[LanceRobson]

Thanks, Bruce

Where exactly are those tires and, ummm, how big is your dog?

Lance

 

[BKubu]

Those tires are not mine. I just did a quick Internet search for a picture since I do not have any good pics of the tires on my trucks. That guy may not have any dogs. I have two German Shepherds. The female is fairly friendly, but the male does not like people! Seriously, though, are you looking for G177s? If so, I will try to help. I may even have a set for sale. I sold some to a guy in December who sent me a deposit (even though I told him to send the whole amount) and now we have been having trouble meeting up. I set a deadline of March 17th. No money by then, the tires are for sale again...11 of them mounted on 5 ton rims for $1,450. They are 90% or better. I sold them for what I had in them with shipping.

 

[Ferroequinologist]

Bruce,
I'm also looking for a good set of radials to put on my m109 for the AK trip. I'm not too picky on the tread or brand, just need a nice low milage matching set.

If you run across some would you let me know?

Thanks,
Adam

 

[BKubu]

Adam, the set of G177s tires I have is just what you need. They are the identical tread pattern to the picture I posted, although those tires are not mine. The spare tire has never been on the ground. The rear eight tires are probably 95-98%. The front two, while very nice, have VERY, VERY slight rounding to the squared off corners of the tread bars...I want to stress very slight rounding. They are great tires and were on my M817 before I parted ways with the truck (the buyer, a major dealer, did not want to pay for the tires...so I kept them). They are "sold," but, if I don't have my full money by March 18th, they can be yours! I am trying to be patient with the other guy, and I will be...until 3/17!

 

[XM 2742]

Forgive me for piggybacking on this thread .......but..........I have the same question about 9X20s. Is there a modern tire that will fit and work as well as the military 9x20s? I don't want perfection or some mud hogs just a kinda sorta "stock" replacement.

 

[BKubu]

The tires that I mentioned are 1100 X 20s. They are commonly used as singles on a deuce and recently have been coming out from the military installed as duals. The Goodyear G177s, Michelin XLs, and Firestones mentioned above are all 1100 X 20s and are used by the military on many deuces (and 5 tons).

 

[Bob H]

12.5R20 XL's are the same diameter as the 900-20's
(unsure if those can be used in a dual rear setup though)

picture is
eleven - 1100R20 XL's on stock rims

 

[emr]

Bruce is on it if u want one of the best for sure, and info needed big time in this question,...randy

 

[srodocker]

I love the tires bob H how much did those run you?

 

[Westex]

Do you pick up any MPH when you go to 1100 X 20? Am I correct to verify that you CAN run 1100 X 20s on the stock rims in a dual configuration on the rear?

 

[hklvette]

Westex, I know for sure that you can run dual 11R20s on the stock A2 wheels, as that's exactly what mine has. If the stock size is 9R20 (I'm not sure, but think so), then you pick up a few mph as well.