Rear PTO Leak

[DeucesWild11]

OK, so here I am gearing up for a nice 35 mile ride to work tomorrow as the guys want to see the Deuce. I am checking everything and notice a pretty good wet spot on the ground under the rear PTO which is not hooked up to anything. My Deuce used to be a fire truck so the rear PTO was used for the water pump. It's not hooked up to anything but it is still there. It is leaking so I took the square nut off the top and added some more "stuff" that was left over in the tank behind the pass seat, I assume some sort of Hydraulic fluid. It was pretty empty so I added about a 1/2 quart.

My question is since this PTO is not being used for anything should I still be concerned about the leak? Is there something spinning in there that needs the lubrication when it's not engaged?

Thank you for your help on this..

 

[scoutmanadam]

leaks should always cause a little concern so great job getting on it, i would pull the pto and put the cover plate back on with a new gasket, its probably leaking from the gasket

 

[phil2968]

You need to let me have to run a rear winch on my bobber! I'll give you the cover for no more leaks! With a new gasket even!

 

[phil2968]

I have a Ramsey 8000# winch to mount between the frame rails and need a Pto like that to run it!

 

[DeucesWild11]

Phil, I may consider that.. I heard it's a rare and possibly valuable piece. One less thing to leak. However I was thinking of putting on a dump bed in the future, not sure if I could use that PTO to run it. I am in no rush to do anything at this time.. but you never know.. Just want to make sure I am not messing something up if that fluid gets too low..

 

[ODdave]

is the pto engaged? It shouldnt leak unless it is spinning as the pump only works when its engaged

 

[scoutmanadam]

just check it often

 

[DeucesWild11]

ODdave.. I have never gotten it engaged.. I tried it a few times putting the lever in the cab all the way down all the way up.. nothing. When the engine is off and I put it up, if I try to turn the coupling it does not turn, in any other position it spins freely, so I assume up is engaged? There is also some kind of push switch that it hits in the all the way up position.

PS: Love that avatar.. ha!

 

[phil2968]

If you decide to get rid of it keep me in mind.

 

[m16ty]

The PTO is lubed by the gear oil in the transfer case. I don't think I'd just pour "something I found in a can behind the seat" in it. Where you added the mystery fluid isn't where you add fluid anyway. The oil level is checked and added by a plug on the side of the transfer case.

There is a lock on the lever that keeps it from engaging when not needed. Up position should be engaged.

May not be a bad time to download the TM and take a look at it.

 

[gringeltaube]

.................................
Is there something spinning in there that needs the lubrication when it's not engaged? ..................

No.

My question is since this PTO is not being used for anything should I still be concerned about the leak?

It is the T-case that will sooner or later run low; since both housing's cavities are open and communicated to each other. Adding fluid to that plug (access to shift-fork set screw) is like adding it to the TC.

G.

 

[m16ty]

If you decide to pull it I will tell you it's not easy to pull it with the bed in place. With the bed removed it's still not a cakewalk. I have done it with the bed in place but the bolts are really hard to get at and most of your wrenching has to be done by feel.

 

[DeucesWild11]

Thanks MT16, I didn't just take anything behind the seat.. There is a tank mounted there that held the extra fluid that went into this PTO. right next to where I added it manually. They cut off the connection I guess when they bobbed it. Based on what you are saying I suppose the oil in there is separate from the oil in the transfer case.. Sorry for the confusion.. Didn't realize there was a TM for that, I'll have to find it.. Thanks!

 

[ODdave]

ODdave.. I have never gotten it engaged.. I tried it a few times putting the lever in the cab all the way down all the way up.. nothing. When the engine is off and I put it up, if I try to turn the coupling it does not turn, in any other position it spins freely, so I assume up is engaged? There is also some kind of push switch that it hits in the all the way up position.

PS: Love that avatar.. ha!

Sounds like you got it figured out, Just make shure it dosnt spin when your driving around. Also there may be check valve that wasnt installed causing it to leak. You wont know if its there untill you pul the pto though.

 

[DeucesWild11]

Gringletaube, Thanks for the info. Just to clarify it seems to be leaking up high and dripping all over the parking brake.. guess that won't stop me now.. not that it would anyway.. I'll keep an eye on the level, I think it's leaking out the shaft right at the end

M16ty, thanks for the add'l info, it didn't look like a cakewalk and that's why I am in no rush to remove.. however if the leak continues then... perhaps..

Phil, I will keep you in mind..

Thanks again guys!

 

[m16ty]

There is a tank mounted there that held the extra fluid that went into this PTO. right next to where I added it manually. They cut off the connection I guess when they bobbed it. Based on what you are saying I suppose the oil in there is separate from the oil in the transfer case.. Sorry for the confusion.. Didn't realize there was a TM for that, I'll have to find it.. Thanks!

There is no tank that holds extra fluid for the PTO. The oil in the PTO and the oil in the transfer case IS the same oil. The PTO is lubed by the transfer case oil. No other oil is required for it to operate.

It sounds like maybe they had some sort of hyd pump powered with the PTO. According to your pics, they have removed the pump if it had one because there's nothing attached to the PTO.

 

[gringeltaube]

Didn't realize there was a TM for that ........

LOL.. there is a TM for almost everything in life... also for the P-136-C T-case PTO.
See TM 9-2520-246-34 & -34P

I think it's leaking out the shaft right at the end

That would be easy to fix without removing the whole unit. Pull yoke, remove bearing/ seal retainer and replace oil seal.

Tomorrow I will post part#s and dimensions for that seal.

G.

 

[DeucesWild11]

M16, I am sure you have much more experience at this then me.. no wait I know you do.. as I have little. Here are some more pics so you can see what I see, crap pics as it's dark.. I assumed the plumbed line went down to the capped off part on top of the PTO. But with what you are saying that also makes sense. But if so what connected to the capped off part in the first pic.

To clarify Pic 1 is the top of the rear PTO, pic two is the cut line running across the outside back of cab, pic 3 is the tank behind the seat that connects to that cut line..

I owe you all if you are in my neck of the woods..

Thanks!

 

[DeucesWild11]

ODdave, she can't spin because it hits the frame rail of the M105 trailer that's on the back.. However up does seem to be the engaged position and when it's down there is a metal plate that you have to rotate before you can engage it, a safety mechanism I suppose.. learned allot tonight! Thanks guys!!

 

[DeucesWild11]

LOL.. there is a TM for almost everything in life... also for the P-136-C T-case PTO.
See TM 9-2520-246-34 & -34P


That would be easy to fix without removing the whole unit. Pull yoke, remove bearing/ seal retainer and replace oil seal.

Tomorrow I will post part#s and dimensions for that seal.

G.

Ohhh you are awesome! Thanks!!!!