Rule update

[patracy]

I have updated the site rules to include the following:

Answering questions:
Please do not reply to a question with a 'Read the TM' or 'Did you search?' type reply that lacks in content. If a question is posted that could be answered from the TM's, provide a link to and details (page) where the answer is contained. Alternatively, if there is already a thread documenting the answer, a link to that thread is also acceptable.

The purpose of a internet forum is to help grow an interest/hobby amongst a group of people. We seem to be straying from that these days. If those are the answer to any question here, then there's no point of a forum. Everything should be static. I enjoy reading what others are doing. Often times it's outside the normal routine of repair. I completely understand that responding to "what is this missing plug on the bottom of my deuce bellhousing?" threads is monotonous. But what's better? Giving a man a fish, or teaching him how to fish? Alternatively, you don't have to respond to every question asked. Sometimes allowing others to speak promotes growth as well. (Sharing personal knowledge feels rewarding on it's own.) As for the search part. I'll admit, searching at times can be a mess given the topic. From poorly titled threads to a overabundance of information. It's enough to make one's head spin. But linking to past examples will help future searches as well when they read the thread. (I know at times I've hit threads that have been linked to other threads yielding a goldmine of info.)

Some rules that have been overlooked lately:

• Keep it OPEN-MINDED. Share your ideas and information freely with the membership. Be open to new ideas and changes suggested in the forums.
• Keep it FRIENDLY. Welcome new members with open arms. Don’t chastise them and belittle them just because they are new. All of you were newbies at some point too!

The sad truth of this is something I've seen in the staff forum of all places. Someone started a technical/build discussion in the staff forum simply because they were afraid of the bashing that has all to often become the norm when someone tries something new. Now, we can't dictate common decency amongst individuals, but it should be a common courtesy here. If you want to tear down someone's build there's a 4x4 forum well known on the internet for that. If you just want to bash someone, there's other forums for that elsewhere as well. Now, understandably, if you have concerns over the safety of a modification to the driver and other drivers on the road, it's understandable to make mention of them. But do so tactfully.

I'm not going to cast stones, because I'm guilty of these as well. All I can say is, I'm sorry for it and I'll do better.

 

[swbradley1]

But what's better? Giving a man a fish, or teaching him how to fish?

What's the plug missing at the bottom of my bell housing?

Give him a fish or tell him where to find it and TEACH him. You are basically saying that we should give him a fish.

I'll welcome a new person (most times) AND teach them to fish politely. If that isn't sufficient I'm more than willing to give up moderating.

 

[patracy]

What's the plug missing at the bottom of my bell housing?

Give him a fish or tell him where to find it and TEACH him. You are basically saying that we should give him a fish.

I'll welcome a new person (most times) AND teach them to fish politely. If that isn't sufficient I'm more than willing to give up moderating.

No I'm not saying give them a fish. I'm saying that replies should hold more content than the short "Read the TM" replies.

Adding content to replies only helps the site. A thread started with a single reply of "read the TM" and closed thread doesn't help address the issue. And it also complicates searches in the future.

 

[DevRev]

Thank you

 

[steelandcanvas]

I think recently we have been better at politely suggesting the search and TM features. I don't think it's too much to ask for someone to do a little research themselves, most of us would be more than happy to assist them. Something about spoon-feeding folks one answer after another, just doesn't sit to well with me. Unfortunately we cannot dictate common sense. Bashing someone elses work, just shows the inadequacy of the basher, if you can't say anything positive, don't say anything at all.

 

[Coffey1]

I don't want someone to give me the solution but guide me to a solution. If I don't know what a part is or called I can't search for it.
Thanks Drew this is a great rule to be good members
We should always treat each other with respect. And try to guide our brothers and sisters to the solutions they seek.

 

[Recovry4x4]

Linking is not always practical for those living and working outside of an office environment. I can often guide a person to what they are seeking by simply providing a keyword to search for or list a TM number that contains the exact info. If this isn't an acceptable practice let me know. In my heart I often feel that helping a person to search by giving them a keyword that will help is better that handing over a link on a silver platter.

 

[patracy]

Linking is not always practical for those living and working outside of an office environment. I can often guide a person to what they are seeking by simply providing a keyword to search for or list a TM number that contains the exact info. If this isn't an acceptable practice let me know. In my heart I often feel that helping a person to search by giving them a keyword that will help is better that handing over a link on a silver platter.

Perfectly understandable. And I know many users are on mobile devices on tapatalk. (That's a total pain to try any copy/pasting from any mobile device!!! [I say bad words often...]) But giving reference that "TM 123 has what you're looking for" in it is good as well. And also will help with the content. (Think future searching) I will make a slight tweak to address that now. Thanks for pointing that out.

Edit:

added the following:

On mobile devices, it's understandably difficult to respond with a link. Giving specific information such as the TM number in which the info can be found is acceptable. Or some helpful keyword to aid in searching.

 

[papabear]

What's the plug missing at the bottom of my bell housing?

Give him a fish or tell him where to find it and TEACH him. You are basically saying that we should give him a fish.

I'll welcome a new person (most times) AND teach them to fish politely. If that isn't sufficient I'm more than willing to give up moderating.

If I read the OP's post correctly that's exactly what's being asked(?). I've read some of your posts trying to help folks and I was impressed with the way you did it....guiding in the right direction.

Also SWB...you cant't give up moderating...we're all counting on you. (looks for the pic of Leslie Neilson in the plane cockpit on the movie Airplane but doesn't find it)

 

[jbayer]

Curtsey?
"but it should be a common curtsey here"
Thanks Patracy, I know others feel intimidated sometimes to post for fear of asking a question that other more knowledgeable members might think is dumb, or should already be known because you should have read/memorized the thousands of pages of TM's that pertain to your vehicle.

 

[patracy]

Curtsey?
"but it should be a common curtsey here."

Oops. Fixed.

 

[wheelspinner]

Curtsey?
"but it should be a common curtsey here."

 

[gimpyrobb]

I've had lots of folks PM me questions they were worried about posting. I try to answer to the best of my ability, but it isn't always easy from a phone. If anyone is worried about posting a question they should feel frre to contact me.



On a side note, it amazes me how many post a question and get upset with an answer.
Don't like an answer, just look past it. I don't know why people get upset, its just a website.

 

[KansasBobcat]

In answering a question I like to cite the TM and then give an abbreviated answer to save the questioner time. I hope this is still acceptable

 

[porkysplace]

No I'm not saying give them a fish. I'm saying that replies should hold more content than the short "Read the TM" replies.

Adding content to replies only helps the site. A thread started with a single reply of "read the TM" and closed thread doesn't help address the issue. And it also complicates searches in the future.

You can give them a link to the TM and the page / section , but you make them open it . Myself my computer skills haven't figured out how to copy the page from the TM and post it like a lot of people ( mostly doghead ) .

 

[Recovry4x4]

Curtsey?
"but it should be a common curtsey here"
Thanks Patracy, I know others feel intimidated sometimes to post for fear of asking a question that other more knowledgeable members might think is dumb, or should already be known because you should have read/memorized the thousands of pages of TM's that pertain to your vehicle.

TMs can be intimidating for sure. Personally, I can't memorize or have read the thousands upon thousands of pages of TMs, nor would I expect anyone else to. What I do think should be expected is that the person read or even skim through the -10 operators manual. I understand the TM structure and school as many folks as I can with it. I'll also point to which TM should be searched along with keywords.

I may irritate someone with the following statement but it's my belief that folks searching for basic operators info that is easily gathered from the operators manual, should be referred to that manual. Asking what the 3 lever thingy does is just not acceptable when these manuals have been made easily available here.

 

[rosco]

Some of us are not particularly computer literate. I often feel incompetent trying to do a search, and soon become frustrated - so I give up because a ton of irrelevant stuff turns up! How about, "How to do a Search", instructions, up on the tool bar, where we can find it better. Sometimes there are threads, where I know the information is, but I can't even find the threads.

 

[patracy]

Some of us are not particularly computer literate. I often feel incompetent trying to do a search, and soon become frustrated - so I give up because a ton of irrelevant stuff turns up! How about, "How to do a Search", instructions, up on the tool bar, where we can find it better. Sometimes there are threads, where I know the information is, but I can't even find the threads.

There's a great discussion here:
http://www.steelsoldiers.com/showthread.php?58151-trouble-searching

 

[Woodsplinter]

Some of us are not particularly computer literate. I often feel incompetent trying to do a search, and soon become frustrated - so I give up because a ton of irrelevant stuff turns up! How about, "How to do a Search", instructions, up on the tool bar, where we can find it better. Sometimes there are threads, where I know the information is, but I can't even find the threads.

I have to agree that searching usually brings up lots of irrelevant information which is difficult, especially for new members to wade through. Giving someone enough information to search successfully is always a good thing!

 

[wheelspinner]

I have to agree that searching usually brings up lots of irrelevant information which is difficult, especially for new members to wade through. Giving someone enough information to search successfully is always a good thing!

If you use the "advanced search" function and choose "show posts" and NOT "show threads" you will get much closer to your needs as it will highlight your keyword specifically in the POST that it finds. Much better product of the search that way.