Dinger65 M38A1 Jeep

[zout]

Call it what you want. After being in the field for many a years chit that goes wrong either will eat you up - or you just continue on - it is what it is. Will they get any future business - NO. Did they reimburse me any labor or whatever - NO- but I will have a new part on my desk tomorrow to at least cover the headgasket.
Did I trust the engine shop - no - but they were reputable supposidly - now I know.

IF I meet up with the folks later will there be attitude - I will leave that to your imagination. I would not want to meet me.

I will say that I have almost always done this stuff by myself and I guess that is why I have such a different outlook on it. Would someone a few years back walked away with an engine that I needed to fix - absolutely not. Would have I had anyone around me to help pull the engine - absolutely not.

This in itself is new ground for me - other hands on the project and I take it for what it is because they are more than friends. Do I trust them - more than you can imagine.

I have known - sooner or later it will come back to bite these folks and its not my call to get my enjoyment to make it happen - but it will happen.

Soon as the engine come back and its in and running will be the end of this thread. opcorn:opcorn:opcorn:opcorn:

 

[Tinwoodsman]

I know the feeling Zout. I am not experienced enough to do many of these things myself and must rely on others. Usually it works out but sometimes is rises up and bites you in the A$$. Life goes on.

Your threads have done much to teach SS members and I read every post.

Thanks,

TWM

 

[papabear]

OK y'all, looks like a simple mistake was made.
I've made mistakes just as bad and even worse...but let's not discuss that right now...LOL.

At Zouts AO we all checked what could be checked without pulling the head and all was correct and Zout had already checked it.

Zout and Dinger had every right to expect that engine to fire up and run like a brand new one...which it basically is.
I am positive Zout could have diagnosed the problem and had the engine running after finding the problem had CAMO not sorta over stepped our bounds and asked to take the engine home with us as it was a challenge we wanted to tackle.
Tony, Doc and I discussed our error on the way home and for that we humbly apoligize for overstepping our bounds.

Long story short, there were some wrong gaskets used...specifically head and manifold...Zout has addressed this with the builder.

I've attached a couple pics of what was found. Evidently, an L134 gasket was used on an F134 when reassembled causing the problems.

All the headbolt holes aligned perfectly but look at the holes where the finger is pointing...I don't know how to do the fancy arrow stuff so I had Troy point to one of the holes that should have been closed off by the head gasket.

Let's look on the bright side here...at least it's not a cracked head or block we are dealing with.
The proper head gasket should take care of everything.

As Zout said...it is what it is and it's gonna get fixed ASAP.

 

[Tinwoodsman]

I agree PB. Even a builder can make mistakes. On a side note, that engine sure looks clean. Since I am into overhauling my 230 flathead, I like to get information from any source that may be helpful. What I don't understand is how the headgasket can affect the distributor and the busted rotor. Is there something I am missing? Speaking purely technical now just to understand.

 

[zout]

Kent - from my understanding there is an ole style and new style. Dingers takes the old style. The cap is a poop brown color and the newer one is black. Internal dimensions are totally different. So when the newer internal cap was installed it places the rotor to far up into the cap and when rotated - snapola.

Debs has the older style dist as well - picked up a new cap to replace hers I stole for Dingers along with a couple new rotors. Funny thing - couple vendors at H/ville were asking $50 just for the caps and I passed on them. Last day and second trip to the center PB calls me and told me he found the "spider" Dinger needed and this fella had 3 NOS older style caps sitting there. Seeing as he was asking a fair price on the spider I inquired about the caps and he told me $15.00

I hauled out the wallet and told him I would give him no less than $20 for it because that was a fairer price to me - he had a very dumbfounded look on his face and first thought I was trying to pay less for it - PB was standing right there as my witness - I had to repeat the offer I would pay him no less than $20 for that item.

I asked if I could have the box and he said yes just take one - I said NO I will not take one of the boxes sitting there because it had the points and condersor as well in them - that was not what I was paying for either - I showed him the parts in the box and I do not think he even knew they were in there. We left with a great sale and a couple items from that vendors table. I think that vendor found someone that was not willing to screw him over and make a good sale between the two of us equally.

I picked up another stretcher from WM last day at the show as well and WM treated me very well on the price - wish I had the money then to get the second one from him - these will make a great display for the 43 when I am done along with the litter racks our great SS member donated to me along with a surgeons apron Viet Nam Era garb. Very COOL.

F headgasket - John up at Midwest Military who was a vendor at the show and got to meet is sending the headgasket out Monday directly to PB Compound.

Apologize for a long thread - but it was a great time off just to get the H** outta Dodge and hang with some friends. It was also great to have Ron get the time to come up with us and spend some time together - thanks RON.

 

[papabear]

I told BabyBear he had to stay back from the MVPA trip and finish his work so he can come with us to "Uncle Dave's" when we bring the engine back.

Of course he was "miffed" but he did as asked so when the head gasket gets here we gotta get it on quickly and bring him up to see "Uncle Dave"!!

Whatta ham BB is!!
The dispatcher said he heard my truck coming way off so he jumped up from a dead sleep (pic 1) and got on his work uniform and ran outside.

Pic # 2 is what we saw when we entered the compound gate!

 

[papabear]

It's here!!

Whoo Hooo! The head gasket just arrived and it's the correct one!
Prolly be able to bring it home Monday if Zout is off and will have us.

Ya know...I don't remember this engine being so rusty and missing so many parts??

 

[zout]

That is great news - at least the engine builder did what he told me he was going to do. You still have a second one coming from Midwest Military and put this on your shelf down there for any future issues.

Zout will be home Monday breaking down a 43 tire and putting a new tube in it - from yesterdays extravaganza in the heat.

When I flip the engine in I might even snag the 48 inch shop fan here to borrow for a night.

 

[papabear]

Yup...the right head gasket did the trick...then just for grins and giggles we tried to see if the oil pump was gonna work...it didn't.
Tony and Troy made the pump work with some grease to prime the pump...bad news...leaks in the oil lines...but Zout has the knowledge/assets to make some new ones.

Once we had oil pressure we were gonna "Ground Hop" that rascal but we realized we didn't have any plug wires!!POOP!!

Oh well...she sucks and blows when she should and she oils...so she is headed north Monday.
Again...I apologize for the Southern CAMO Crew over stepping our bounds and taking the engine South when she could have been fixed in the Northern CAMO (Zout's AO) coumpound.

I accept full responsibility.

Sometimes we (I) just get carried away...those who know me understand...but wish they didn't

Anyhoo...here's a before and after pic of the problem:

 

[zout]

I apologize for the Southern CAMO Crew over stepping our bounds and taking the engine South when she could have been fixed in the Northern CAMO (Zout's AO) coumpound.

Never have to appologize to me for anything. It was a great reach out on commradre as I saw it.

Those pics are a great reference for anyone opening one up and during reassembly of nearly any engine - always look twice at everything and never take what you get in a kit for being what it should be.

Monday - Zout will be ready for another "round".

SALUTE Southern Camo Crew.

 

[papabear]

I apologize for the Southern CAMO Crew over stepping our bounds and taking the engine South when she could have been fixed in the Northern CAMO (Zout's AO) coumpound.

Never have to appologize to me for anything. It was a great reach out on commradre as I saw it.

Those pics are a great reference for anyone opening one up and during reassembly of nearly any engine - always look twice at everything and never take what you get in a kit for being what it should be.

Monday - Zout will be ready for another "round".

SALUTE Southern Camo Crew.

Thank you Zout. I do tend to get a little over "Bear" ing..lol
When the engine didn't run..and the checks we did didn't work.. the BEAR in me took over!
I know you could have done the same thing and it would have been much cheaper transpo wise etc., but...hey we are buds/ Brothers...so that don't count...right??

Anyhoo...CAMO..North..South or anywhere else rocks...right??

BabyBear wants "Uncle Dave" to know he helped so I'm gonna post the pic...yes I know it has nothing to do with the engine but BB wants the pic to be posted so here bit is:

 

[zout]

OH - you mean when BB was standing in front of my blower fan slowly moving his body from side to side to get cooled off in that greenhouse garage of mine - now that was funny as a hoot. I am going to fix him Monday cause I am brining another fan down - so unless he has an evil twin I have not met - we should have our own fan while he bogarts that one.

I do plan on searching the Big Red Truck upon arrival - football has gone array once again. At least he did not unplug the fan and take it home with him.

Ron will be up to get his pictures taken once again by me while he works and I stand idly by taking pics

Don't forget to have the crew remind me to take my big liner puller home with them. This one pulls roughly 28 inches.

 

[papabear]

Ooops...I forgot the pics

The first pic is the old (incorrect) gasket which did not seal off the water jackets and allowed the little bit of compression/smoke the poor lil engine could muster to come out of the water pump!!

The second pic is the correct gasket that made the engine a happy camper.

The third pic is...well...guess who??

 

[zout]

Excuse me opcorn:

But if I heard PB correctly when the stop watch was clicked off - he stated engine install took 27 minutes to be ready to fire up opcorn:.

Indeed she wanted to fire and the timing was nearly correct - and when we let the starter cool for a second from the first attempt to fire up - she would not engage or throw the bendix. With a jump start it would not kick in as well - and after pulling it and on the floor she was being stubborn as well.

Starter goes out tomorrow to the rebuilder and tomorrow night I will get it back in and finish what should have easily been able to do today.

AHHH - football magically arrived at Zouts house again today as well.

So confident she is going to fire up we got the grille and radiator installed with the snorkle hoses minus coolant at this time. Once she barks - she will get coolant.

Some things have a mind of their own and its beter to stick the wishfull thinking in the closet till all is accomplished, otherwise it will drive you .

Big gracious thank you to the CAMO crew and brother Ron once again for his assistance.

 

[Tinwoodsman]

To quote an old friend, "I wonder what is in the red cup?"

 

[papabear]

Excuse me opcorn:

But if I heard PB correctly when the stop watch was clicked off - he stated engine install took 27 minutes to be ready to fire up opcorn:.

Indeed she wanted to fire and the timing was nearly correct - and when we let the starter cool for a second from the first attempt to fire up - she would not engage or throw the bendix. With a jump start it would not kick in as well - and after pulling it and on the floor she was being stubborn as well.

Starter goes out tomorrow to the rebuilder and tomorrow night I will get it back in and finish what should have easily been able to do today.

AHHH - football magically arrived at Zouts house again today as well.

So confident she is going to fire up we got the grille and radiator installed with the snorkle hoses minus coolant at this time. Once she barks - she will get coolant.

Some things have a mind of their own and its beter to stick the wishfull thinking in the closet till all is accomplished, otherwise it will drive you .

Big gracious thank you to the CAMO crew and brother Ron once again for his assistance.

To quote an old friend, "I wonder what is in the red cup?"

I'm sorry Brother Zout but I cannot tell a lie (well not often). It was actually 28 minutes from hanging on the cherry picker to "Hey Ron...give er a whirl!!"
I blame Ron for the starter issue!! That engine had sucked up the gas and was gonna fire off on the next attempt!! We all heard her hit before Ron stopped cranking!

I think he had steel toed boots on and they caused an electromagnetic pulse that rendered the starter combat ineffective!

Bad news about the football...BabyBear sorta rendered it combat ineffective as well...it's flat as a fritter...oh...and by the way...you are prolly missing something that DID look like a ball.
BB slept until we got around Lagrange then we heard a crunching sound in the back seat and he had a formerly round object broken into itsy bitsy pieces.
If it was something important to you or Deb, please just add whatever it was on Bud's bill.

TWM...the "red cup" contained a magic potion to help start the engine but since Ron fried the starter...I drank it...

Also...the pics I took are in my camera...in my truck...at the terminal...and I drove a car home...so youse guys are safe for tonight...but there's always tomorrow!!

 

[swiss]

How many southern SS men does it take to get one jeep running?? I have counted at least 4 and that does not include the meal support team

 

[papabear]

How many southern SS men does it take to get one jeep running?? I have counted at least 4 and that does not include the meal support team

Actually...that jeep has been running for months...we just like to pull the engine and swap parts and re-install it to confuse former yankee fellers!

It's sorta like "Snipe Huntin"!!

 

[doghead]

That reminds me, you said you'd take me snipe hunting at the next Ga rally! I can't wait!

 

[swiss]

Actually...that jeep has been running for months...we just like to pull the engine and swap parts and re-install it to confuse former yankee fellers!

It's sorta like "Snipe Huntin"!!

See PB, I told you Nanner Pudding rots your brain and you start to do funny things like pulling engines and swapping parts. I knew there was something wrong with that stuff, kind of like crack, good when you get started and all downhill from there