Michigan M923/925 Owners Question

[rneely]

Considering a M923A2 or M925A2 but concerned that I will have to get a CDL to drive in Michigan. What has been your experience with the SOS? I read that having a vehicle with air brakes automatically means a CDL. I would not be using it for commercial purposes, just parade duty.

 

[moriboy]

You need a cdl....many threads on this.

 

[Derrickl112]

http://www.michigan.gov/documents/cdlmanul_16090_7.pdf

 

[ida34]

Refer to my many other threads from a few years ago. The PDF above is intended for commercial operators. YOU DO NOT NEED A CDL IF YOU ARE NOT ENGAGED IN COMMERCE. You are not engaged in commerce if you are using it to drive or move your stuff. For those that do not know, I am an LEO. Again, do a search for my other threads as they will have cut and paste excerpts from the actual law. Not PDFs made for commercial operators. If you are a making money by using the truck you would need a CDL. PM me if you want more details.

 

[islandguydon]

ida34


So you are saying as a personal truck " Not for hire" it is not required to have a CDL..?

 

[Ruppster]

The PDF above is intended for commercial operators. YOU DO NOT NEED A CDL IF YOU ARE NOT ENGAGED IN COMMERCE. You are not engaged in commerce if you are using it to drive or move your stuff.

While most state level CDL manuals are written in a way that implies you are commercial by the mere fact that you are reading it I have to give Michigan credit as they actually included comments about personal use in it. Under exemptions (on page vi) is the following:

INDIVIDUALS: Operating motor homes or other vehicles used exclusively to transport personal possessions or family members, for non-business purposes.

Most manuals just say "recreational use vehicles" which leads many CLEO's to say it must be registered as an RV to meet that exemption. The wording Michigan uses actually makes it a lot clearer about personal use. Another thing I like about the manual is it actually mentions whether an air brake endorsement (or lack of restriction) is required if you're not commercial. Under Section 5 is the following sentence:

An air brake endorsement is only required if your vehicle needs a CDL.

The reason I mention this is that there are several people here on the forums that believe the presence of air brakes require a CDL regardless of use. At least this sheds some light on the issue (as far as Michigan is concerned anyhow). It's nice to see a state take the time to make things as clear as possible in it's publications.

rneely: The one problem with the CDL manual is the legal fine print. It says at the beginning that it is not a legal document. Your best bet would be to call up the State Troopers and ask for the Commercial Law Enforcement Office and talk to a CLEO (Commercial Law Enforcement Officer). Ask them for the regulation or statute number that contains the info about CDL requirements and exemptions. Once you have that info print out the pages that show you are exempt and place those pages in a binder. Then keep that binder with you when ever you drive the truck. This way if you get stopped by a CLOE that isn't as well trained as Officer Graham above you can show them what the reg/statute says.

One other thing to watch out for is if you ever drive out of state you may run in to issues regarding IRP (International Registration Plan) and IFTA (International Fuel Tax Agreement). This is a state by state deal and if you do drive out of state you will want to talk to the state you will be driving through to see if they allow an exemption from IRP/IFTA if the vehicle is for personal use. If they say you're exempt be sure to write down who you talked to and the date and time of the call and place that info in your binder. I found out the hard way about this the first time I drove in to N.C. from Virginia and was hit with a $600 ticket.

 

[diverman555]

You

 

[diverman555]

Cdl

You do not need a CDL or a air brake cert, in Michigan if you own your truck for personal use. Don't
listen to guys that are not from Michigan. You can listen to the guy above me he is right.

 

[Lawrence of Arabia]

Heres a number for the MI DOT regs. They are always very helpful and answer the phone everytime I call. 800-682-4682.

 

[flibob]

We have beat this to death many times over. I always read though. One thing is consistant..NC is the worst.

 

[ida34]

ida34


So you are saying as a personal truck " Not for hire" it is not required to have a CDL..?

Putting "Not For Hire" on the side is not enough. If you are using it in any way to make money you would be engaged in commerce and need the CDL and everything that goes with it. If you use it to move stuff to a swap meet you are technically engaged in commerce. I do not know of many LEO's that would take it that far. Even helping out a neighbor move with the large truck could be considered a violation since it clearly states a vehicle is exempt if used to move your personal goods. Getting paid for fuel to help him would further move you down that slippery slope. Also, if a LEO sees you moving scrap steel in your truck every day for a week it would be assumed you are engaged in commerce so I would suggest only using going with no CDL if you are truely using the truck for only parades, shows and such.

 

[maxxplanck]

?

You need a cdl....many threads on this.

Moriboy, please do some research before you give out some wrong info

 

[moriboy]

moriboy, please do some research before you give out some wrong info

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