Electric fan for Deuce

[Ridgerunner]

Be use now mater how many cheap fans u put in series ulmnever get 6000 CFO pm and as for the water pun take power away from the motor not the fan blades some one needs to back to school

Um....yeah, what he said

 

[swbradley1]

Thread cleaned up due to legibility issues. If you can't be bothered to use correct punctuation and spell check please go back and try again. I was actually hoping you could get it to work and not argue with people for opinions you disagree with.

Please update us after you get it installed and working.

 

[Kohburn]

multiple fans has been done with success - the head of the waterpump just sticks out too far to get a single large fan in there.

Setup i remember seeing was 3 fans. two on temp probe and the 3rd on when the AC was running.



the cleanest solution would be to alter the pump/pulley to not stick out past the belts. Then you could use any number of existing truck fans that might fit in there.

 

[m-35tom]

removing the thermostat is a really bad move. diesels run better when hot, plus this is not a normal thermostat, it is a 3 way valve.

 

[D'cheat]

Your engine's cooling system Needs a thermostat to properly function. Ive professionally raced for Years and have seen this tested over and over and over. With out a proper thermostat in place, its not so much that your engine will not hit operating temperature. The issue is that the coolant is now flowing too fast through the system to properly remove heat from your heads. The coolant will not be up to temperature, however your heads will be developing hotspots. The coolant needs to be slowed down to work properly. You need that thermostat. More so in a Diesel or multi.

As for electric fans, flex-a-lite fans (monster and black magic) can be wired to function on 24 volt. I have personally confirmed this with the factory. Get 2 of the 15" fans, hook them up and be ready to go.

Yes, the water pump pulls a bit of power. But thats nothing in caparison to what the fan does. If you have ever had your clutch fan go bad on your daily driver, then you know just how much power a fan can suck from your engine. Replacing the stock fan on our rigs with electric, I Guarantee you will free a substantial amount of power. And with our rigs, every hp counts.

 

[FireFighterHill]

Flowing to fast to absorb heat in a closed system? That is a myth and scientifically impossible. What is happening is the restriction from a thermostat cause a pressure differential which raises the boiling point of the coolant. Without a pressurized cooling system, steam would form. Steam is not a good conductor of heat. Imagine boiling water in an open pot or boiling water in a pressure cooker. At sea level water boils at 212 degrees, at 20psi water will now only start boil once it reach 260 degrees. If increased flow is bad, why do they make things like high speed water pumps for performance engines? Removing any restriction (such as a thermostat) will increase flow and allow the cooling system to displace more heat through the radiator as long as the normal pressure is maintained in the cooling system. The other issue that comes into play and also has to do with pressure differential, is cavitation of the water pump. If the water pump is pushing water through the system faster then it can be replenished at the inlet due to low or no pressure in the cooling system, it will cause cavitation. The only way to know for sure if removing the thermostat would cause problems is to try it and track the results. You could do this by tracking both the temp and pressure on the cooling system before and after the removal. If the thermostat is not the biggest restriction in the cooling system, its removal will not cause overheating. This is also why a bad radiator cap will cause over heating if it doesn't retain pressure.

 

[Carlo]

I would miss than fan howl from my M35. Its kind part of the truck no? Kind of like adding a muffler to the straight pipe or power stearing. Its just not the same after.....

 

[emr]

I would miss than fan howl from my M35. Its kind part of the truck no? Kind of like adding a muffler to the straight pipe or power stearing. Its just not the same after.....

In my opinion,I agree with this post the most... Expecially putting a muffler on an awesome straight pipe, Kinda like i bought this beast , i mean a real truck, Now i am going to make it quit smooth and fast , like it never was, Maybe some wanted a different truck ? , but see the reason for the fans to some. All good, just liked this post...

 

[Carlo]

EMR I have a 931 and 923A2 and use my finger to stear it some times around the hair pin mountain turns. I can make most the truns in one try, BUT The M35 needs both arms and allot of will to trun it and some turns I take 3 manovers all while me and my son talk back and forth with ear plugs cause its to noisey PLUS not to mention the cold air coming in from the back cab cover (no mater how you tighten it it the air still comes in). I LOVE IT!

 

[Carlo]

Flowing to fast to absorb heat in a closed system? That is a myth and scientifically impossible. What is happening is the restriction from a thermostat cause a pressure differential which raises the boiling point of the coolant. Without a pressurized cooling system, steam would form. Steam is not a good conductor of heat. Imagine boiling water in an open pot or boiling water in a pressure cooker. At sea level water boils at 212 degrees, at 20psi water will now only start boil once it reach 260 degrees. If increased flow is bad, why do they make things like high speed water pumps for performance engines? Removing any restriction (such as a thermostat) will increase flow and allow the cooling system to displace more heat through the radiator as long as the normal pressure is maintained in the cooling system. The other issue that comes into play and also has to do with pressure differential, is cavitation of the water pump. If the water pump is pushing water through the system faster then it can be replenished at the inlet due to low or no pressure in the cooling system, it will cause cavitation. The only way to know for sure if removing the thermostat would cause problems is to try it and track the results. You could do this by tracking both the temp and pressure on the cooling system before and after the removal. If the thermostat is not the biggest restriction in the cooling system, its removal will not cause overheating. This is also why a bad radiator cap will cause over heating if it doesn't retain pressure.

WOW I want you on my team when something ever bad happens to one of my trucks and I need tech help. You know your stuff Sir!

 

[rchalmers3]

Flowing to fast to absorb heat in a closed system? That is a myth and scientifically impossible.

It may be a myth, but if you consider the second heat transfer (dissipation) occurring at the radiator, you may find the concept is still valid.

The heated coolant must have sufficient time in the air stream to shed heat into the atmosphere. Therefore velocity may cause a gradual heat collection in the coolant which may become uncontrollable.

I am another advocate to leave in the thermostat. Faster warm ups with less engine wear and better economy are to be realized when the thermostat is working as designed.

Rick

 

[Carlo]

Removing the thermostat is not an option. There is just to much flow through the radiator. The coolant must have time to cool before returning to the motor. There is nothing to gain from removing it be it summer or winter.

 

[Cleveland Iron]

As for speed of the coolant being cycled through the system... Wouldn't the bottom line be the operating temperature of the system under similar conditions? If anyone has hard data, I'd like to see it.

 

[michigandon]

Ford flatheads had an inherit design flaw where the coolant flowed too fast due to the twin inlet and outlet hoses.

An old hotrodding trick was to replace the stats with large flat washers. The small hole in the center of the washer slowed the coolant down enough to where it was able to effectively do its job. In fact, I believe Edelbrock, Offenhauser, or one of their competitors actually manufactured a washer specifically designed for this purpose.

 

[steelandcanvas]

Flowing to fast to absorb heat in a closed system?

I'm not too sure about that statement, but maybe this is what he meant: If the coolant doesn't spend enough time in the radiator, proper heat transfer will not be achieved.

 

[FireFighterHill]

I suggest you guys who think increasing flow will negatively impact cooling performance give this article by a radiator manufacturer a read http://www.arrowheadradiator.com/14...apability_in_high-performance_automobiles.htm while our truck may not be what most consider "high" performance, the scientific laws of thermodynamics still apply.

 

[Carlo]

One note for the wise.. I did lower the temp in my M35 about 12° by power flushing the radiator, motor, and heater core. I then added good anti freeze.

 

[VPed]

Another thing to consider: The amount of power consumed by a centrifugal pump (or fan for that matter) is proportional to flow rate. Removing the thermostat ensures that the power required to pump the water is at max all the time because of the lack of restriction to flow. I work at a water treatment plant and I know for a fact that choking the discharge of a centrifugal pump has a huge impact on required horsepower. The thermostat should not be enough of an impediment to flow when the engine is hot and serves to reduce the power requirement whenever full-flow cooling is not required. Theoretically, the winter covers for the grill should do the same thing for the fan. FWIW

 

[nk14zp]

Ford flatheads had an inherit design flaw where the coolant flowed too fast due to the twin inlet and outlet hoses.

An old hotrodding trick was to replace the stats with large flat washers. The small hole in the center of the washer slowed the coolant down enough to where it was able to effectively do its job. In fact, I believe Edelbrock, Offenhauser, or one of their competitors actually manufactured a washer specifically designed for this purpose.

To any flat head guys out there a 5/8th hole in a fender washer in each water pump works best.

 

[JasonS]

Flowing to fast to absorb heat in a closed system? That is a myth and scientifically impossible. What is happening is the restriction from a thermostat cause a pressure differential which raises the boiling point of the coolant. Without a pressurized cooling system, steam would form. Steam is not a good conductor of heat. Imagine boiling water in an open pot or boiling water in a pressure cooker. At sea level water boils at 212 degrees, at 20psi water will now only start boil once it reach 260 degrees. If increased flow is bad, why do they make things like high speed water pumps for performance engines? Removing any restriction (such as a thermostat) will increase flow and allow the cooling system to displace more heat through the radiator as long as the normal pressure is maintained in the cooling system. The other issue that comes into play and also has to do with pressure differential, is cavitation of the water pump. If the water pump is pushing water through the system faster then it can be replenished at the inlet due to low or no pressure in the cooling system, it will cause cavitation. The only way to know for sure if removing the thermostat would cause problems is to try it and track the results. You could do this by tracking both the temp and pressure on the cooling system before and after the removal. If the thermostat is not the biggest restriction in the cooling system, its removal will not cause overheating. This is also why a bad radiator cap will cause over heating if it doesn't retain pressure.

I've done testing with normal thermostat, high flow thermostat, and no thermostat. The operting temperature decreased with each step. Magzines have done the same tests. The thermodynamics agree with t. Yet, somehow, this myth will not die.