Reliability A2 Vs A3

[Djstorm100]

Kinda of a silly question but my search results did not yield that much.

I looked at a A3 today and drove it. Mech seems fine other than 2 pinion seals need replacing and oil pan gasket.

Any who the owner of the A3 said how the a2's engines are not reliable compare to CAT engines. I do believe he was either A) trying to sell the A3 up B) He didn't know the engine as well C) he is telling the truth. I work at Cat and would love to show up driving it but what has got the future wife sold is the ability to run 80/20 mixture of WMO and diesel. That 30-40 dollars in diesel will let me have a fun weekend with it.

Thus I'm back to my question. How reliability are these engines? What is the max SAFE cruising RPM, that is it will ok with until the cows come home (so to speak) and at what MPH would that be roughly? I understand the reliability factor is given with the previsions owners, so lets say they took care of it like they should.


The A3 has the tire inflation system that can will be removed.

 

[cattlerepairman]

Hm. Not exactly a flood of suggestions coming in.
Look, you work at CAT, so you know the powerplant of the A3 and probably a thing or two about heavy machinery and trucks. Yes, the multifuel can run on all sorts of cr**, from diesel to nail polish remover. That it "can" does not mean that you "should". The military did not care about longevity - it needed to finish the mission, that was it. Most owners here seem to run either straight diesel or mild diesel/something else mixtures.
Sure, you might save at the fuel mixture, but you will change filters more often, have to clean gunk out of your tank once in a while and service other parts (injectors etc.) sooner. There is no such thing as a free lunch.

There are other differences between the A3 and A2 (automatic tranny, hydraulic winch, more modern CAT engine) that seem to be held in higher regard than the multifuel capability.

 

[rtk]

If you want to run a "diesel mix" then you have to stick with the A2 . The A3 is straight diesel Let me say this about both engines . They are both good engines that were spec'd for the military . With the proper care you will get good life out of either one . I liked my A3 and auto ,never had a bit of problem with either one . Air assist steering was nice , REAL PS would be nicer . I had 395's on mine for better top speed , which was around 60 or so . As they say pick your poison . Take your time and look for a nice ride . You work for CAT so go for the A3 , the 3116 is a common engine group . good luckbob k

 

[welldigger]

The cat engine is far more reliable when you look at its track history versus the multifuel history. In fact in Vietnam they set up an entire infrastructure to supply multifuel engines and repair parts because of the dismal reliability of the multifuel. Granted these engines were being used to their limits and beyond.

The average civilian owner of a multifuel will most likely not experience nearly that many problems.

My biggest concern if I were purchasing an a3 would be the transmission. If it seems to be working as normal then I'd say go for it.

The a2 is also a great truck even with the anemic multifuel. While there are people who routinely run wmo or wvo in them you need to understand that it's not as simple as dump whatever semi - flammable liquid you find in the tank and go. It's a lot of work to collect and prepare your "fuel". Check out the alternative fuel forum and see what I mean.

Regardless of what you buy I hope you enjoy your truck.

 

[Djstorm100]

The cat engine is far more reliable when you look at its track history versus the multifuel history. In fact in Vietnam they set up an entire infrastructure to supply multifuel engines and repair parts because of the dismal reliability of the multifuel. Granted these engines were being used to their limits and beyond.

The average civilian owner of a multifuel will most likely not experience nearly that many problems.

My biggest concern if I were purchasing an a3 would be the transmission. If it seems to be working as normal then I'd say go for it.

The a2 is also a great truck even with the anemic multifuel. While there are people who routinely run wmo or wvo in them you need to understand that it's not as simple as dump whatever semi - flammable liquid you find in the tank and go. It's a lot of work to collect and prepare your "fuel". Check out the alternative fuel forum and see what I mean.

Regardless of what you buy I hope you enjoy your truck.

Yes sir, I've been reading there as well. I do plan to filter down to 5 or 3 micron with three steps and run a mixture of at least 20% diesel or more. the idea is to cut fuel cost as much as possible with in reason, that reason is running no less than 20% diesel.

 

[rtk]

Don't let the Alison transmission stop you from a A3 , it's a common unit , it does however lack a overdrive gear . I am not sure about the Bio Diesel in a CAT engine , you would have to check that out .

 

[Djstorm100]

CAT does no encourage it at all from what I'm told, but I'll have to do some more digging. The a3's are a little out of my price range it seems and for the $ I could get a 5 ton and it be more comfortable higher speed and etc. Personally I like the looks of the 5 tons and interior (can't believe I just said that) to the deuce but I still have a soft spot for them. I work at BCP facility, I'm one of the design engineers here.

 

[rtk]

BIG difference between a Deuce and a 5TON ! It seems the 5 tons are the deal of day right now , BUT , they are BIG for a reason . They later model A2's do run good , but now you are into a CDL and possible insurance issues and no HX plates if you were going that way . On another note the PARTS for a 5ton are BIG ! and HEAVY ! Just do your homework and pick a vehicle that is RIGHT for YOU . Bob k

 

[Djstorm100]

BIG difference between a Deuce and a 5TON ! It seems the 5 tons are the deal of day right now , BUT , they are BIG for a reason . They later model A2's do run good , but now you are into a CDL and possible insurance issues and no HX plates if you were going that way . On another note the PARTS for a 5ton are BIG ! and HEAVY ! Just do your homework and pick a vehicle that is RIGHT for YOU . Bob k

Do not need a CDL since I'm not for hire. Getting a airbrake endorsement at the most, or class B regular license. It is not hard with my other job (with my father.)

HX?

Parts for any of the machines are big and heavy. I would not even think of getting one without having the means to service/repair it my self. I'll have to buy some new tools but tools make me happy . Alot of it is because I'm partial to Cummin's engines.

 

[Warthog]

Just a few weeks ago I was working on a 1970 M35A2. It had been sitting for many years (at least 5). Replaced the fan belts, installed some new batteries and bled the brakes along with a PMCS.

It fired up on the second crank and it was driven home over 100 miles. I don't know if an A3 would have done that.

 

[Wildchild467]

I would jump in my M35A2 right now and drive it to anywhere in the country and not think twice about it. Of course I would bring tools but still, I wouldn't be scared. I know every inch of my truck and don't see why I wouldn't trust it. I love that thing and it loves me!

 

[74M35A2]

The CAT 3116 is not known for it's reliability. I would trust an LDT over a 3116, even though decades apart.

 

[rtk]

HX plates are "Historical Vehicle" plates usually given to vehicles at least 20-25 years old in a lot of states , which allows you to get a cheap rate on plates and insurance . The insurance DOES have some limitations on your MV usage , i.e. no commercial use , no passengers in the troop seats , all the policies are different , gotta read that fine print! LOL !!

 

[Warthog]

Something else to think about. There where Tens of Thousands of A2s made and only a few thousand A3s. Parts for the A2s are everywhere, the A3s not so much.

You can buy a multifuel engine for cheap (or free). The CAT and the Allison will set you back some cash.

 

[porkysplace]

Just price out the wheel bearings between a A2 and A3 , everything on a A3 is golden.

 

[Warthog]

Just price out the wheel bearings between a A2 and A3 , everything on a A3 is golden.

I forgot about those. $40 vs $600+

 

[Scar59]

I operate both models of the M35 (A2) (A3). They both start at the touch of the starter button/switch. I have the A2 for it's multifuel capabilities and because it's fun to drive a manual vehicle. The A3 is very comfortable to drive and the Mrs. can handle it well. As Wildchild states; you need to know your truck, maintain it, and it will take care of you. -and heed RTK's advice, 5 tons are big and heavy, their parts are big and heavy. I operate 5 different 5 ton models, help is needed if you do not possess to correct support equipment. In the end you'll end up with more than one truck anyway, start shopping for the deals.
JC

 

[Scar59]

Just a few weeks ago I was working on a 1970 M35A2. It had been sitting for many years (at least 5). Replaced the fan belts, installed some new batteries and bled the brakes along with a PMCS.

It fired up on the second crank and it was driven home over 100 miles. I don't know if an A3 would have done that.

Sure it (A3) would have. I fired my A3 up at WPAFB, drove it up a 32 ft trailer, with a flat, and drove it 130 miles home. Pulled it in the shop and immediately pulled the wheels and serviced/greased the $600 bearings to ensure I would not have to replace them. Maintenance is the key factor to service life. These trucks, like a lot of heavy duty equipment, are designed to last; only if properly maintained and not subjected to abuse. The majority of the problems that occur with these vehicles in the hands of hobbiests/new owners, are a direct result of the abuse or neglect they recieved in their past service life. Maintain it properly and don't trash it and they will out last us; your grandkids will be driving them when we're long gone.

 

[Wildchild467]

The CAT 3116 is not known for it's reliability. I would trust an LDT over a 3116, even though decades apart.

Now... 8.3 Cummins or multifuel? Haha! you don't have to answer... I don't want to thread jack.

 

[rtk]

One of things I did to my A3 was loose the CTIS system and went to the A2 bearings and seals . Lot cheaper . Then I put on the 395's . CTIS system is maintenance intensive in the A3 and that inner bearing is expensive . , Bob k