Tell me more about the M813...Thinking about getting one, would like some info!

[71DeuceAK]

Latest ridiculous idea:

So not long ago I was reading that the 809 series 5 ton trucks (predecessor to the M939s we all know and love) have air-over-hydraulic brakes like a Deuce does. It's thus my understanding that in my current state (Alaska, for those of you who really want to know) I would not need a CDL since their gross weight is less than 26,000 lbs empty and they don't have air brakes. (I've also read it's really hard to take the CDL air brake road test in an M939 series truck because of the weird wedge air bakes and automatic transmission those things have.

So...I'm now entertaining the idea of eventually getting an M813, and sort of daily driving it when not taking the bus (my current city, Fairbanks, AK has a great public transit system). I'll probably still get an M939 series once I get a CDL, but in the meantime...

P/S: this probably wouldn't be for at least another year or two, I'm a college freshman who still doesn't drive and still lives on campus. (Although I plan on moving off in the future, I'm actually looking at a house right now).

Thoughts? I'm not offended if anyone wants to just laugh at me for considering one of these as a first car and daily driver. It's already been established that I'm nuts-just read my other threads entailing things like considering daily driving a Deuce or M939 on a 2 hour each way road trip each weekend.

Just looking for some 809 series 5 ton experts, chime in!

 

[fasttruck]

In the enchanted land of New Jersey (and elsewhere I imagine) the threshold for CDL is 26000# gross weight, not empty weight. A 809 series truck is above the rate. If you can claim in your state that it is a "recreational" like a motor home, may be you can escape the CDL requirement. Problem with air brake test for CDL with a 939 series is they do not have an emergency brake valve on the dashboard that will pop off a 40# as e brake control is on the floor under the handbrake handle. 809s have a manual transmission and 939s are automatic if that is a problem. M35s are below the CDL threshold and have manual transmissions and very manual steering.

 

[EMD567]

I hope you are rich. 809 series are poor fuel mileage vehicles- think low 5's if you use one around town. Plus you have to burn real diesel in them- can't burn used oil or cooking grease.

 

[mkcoen]

Check your DMV but most states CDL requirement is Gross Weight not Curb Weight.

 

[porkysplace]

Check your DMV but most states CDL requirement is Gross Weight not Curb Weight.

From Alaska DMV;http://doa.alaska.gov/dmv/dlmanual/cdlmanual.pdf

Section 1 - Introduction
Page 3
Version: July 2014
COMMERCIAL DRIVER LICENSE CLASSES, ENDORSEMENTS AND
RESTRICTIONS
GCWR
= Gross Combination Weight Rating: The value speci
fied by the manufacturer as the loaded weight
of a combination vehicle.
GVWR
= Gross Vehicle Weight Rating: The value specified
by the manufacturer as the loaded weight of a
single vehicle.
Class A
Any combination of vehicles with gross combination
weight rating (GCWR) of 26,001 or more pounds falls
in Group A, provided the GVWR of the power unit is
at least 26,001 or more pounds; and the GVWR of
the vehicle(s) being towed is more than 10,000 poun
ds. (18 wheelers, logging)
Class B
Any single vehicle with a GVWR in excess of 26,001
pounds or any such vehicle towing another
vehicle that does not weigh 10,000 pounds or more (
dump trucks, cement mixer trucks, box trucks,
motor coaches).
Class C
Any single vehicle with a GVWR less than 26,001 pou
nds falls in Group C or any such vehicle towing
another vehicle not in excess of 10,000 pounds GVWR
. However, vehicles of this size are included in
the CDL program only if they are:
(1) Designed to carry 16 or more passengers includi
ng the driver, or
(2) Used to transport hazardous materials in quanti
ties requiring placarding under the Hazardous
Materials Regulations (49 CFR Part 172, Subpart F)
or is carrying material listed as a select
agent or toxin in 42 CFR part 73.

 

[red]

I hope you are rich. 809 series are poor fuel mileage vehicles- think low 5's if you use one around town. Plus you have to burn real diesel in them- can't burn used oil or cooking grease.

I'm getting just over 6mpg with my m816 wrecker, cruising at 2,000rpm makes a big difference on fuel economy with the nhc250

 

[71DeuceAK]

Thanks for the replies guys! I was anticipating the low fuel mileage and the gross weight makes sense...but how does that go if I'm not loading the thing fully? Would that get around a CDL requirement? If not I would just wait to get a CDL and go get an M923A2 or something like that. Probably wouldn't be driving as much as I've had the possibility of having to drive in the past, thankfully no 2 hour each way road trips each weekend or hour-long commutes each way during the week.

Is the 809 series transmission like the one in a Deuce in that 5th gear is in a different spot? How loud are they compared to a Deuce?

 

[red]

Same shift pattern. Noise is much lower pitch than the multifuel engine (deep rumble). With the muffler it is quieter

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[71DeuceAK]

Thanks for the info! I know they have power steering and pretty much the same cab as a Deuce. Any other major differences?

 

[red]

Everything else is bigger/heavier. The m809 series has a long nose compared to the m35a2 and the nhc250 is a challenge to start in the cold without a block heater.

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[droprat]

Have an M-810 and starts are a little harder in the cold. Does yours have Primer Heater? Power steering is a BIG PLUS, especially when you are backing short trailers up! Like Red said everything else is bigger and heavier! Good Luck!

 

[71DeuceAK]

The 250 Cummins being challenging to start is good to know for Fairbanks, AK, but everyone here has block heaters...I mean every car has the male end of an extension cord dangling out of the front bumper. By comparison, how is the 8.3 Cummins in a M939A2?

 

[M813rc]

... the gross weight makes sense...but how does that go if I'm not loading the thing fully? Would that get around a CDL requirement?

Gross weight refers to what the vehicle is capable of carrying, not what you personally actually carry. You're not going to legally get away from the CDL requirement (or Non-Commercial Class A, if your state has such an animal) with an M813.

M813 is a fun vehicle to drive, mine gets 6+ mpg on regular diesel. But it is big, much bigger than a deuce. Takes a lot more room to park, to turn, etc.

Cheers

 

[71DeuceAK]

Yeah, anybody got any comparison photos of one next to a Deuce? I'd be curious to see those.

Yeah, I'd be doing all sorts of different driving with mine. Jamming gears on our never-got-finished freeways here that stop at traffic lights, dry/maintained dirt/gravel roads, (Once you get out of the city proper and away from the university it's practically all freeways or dirt roads here), having some fun in the mud, climbing up on/crushing dead compact cars destined for scrap metal anyway, you name it. That said, I'll probably still take the bus whenever possible, college students here ride for free so why spend the money on fuel? That said, I'd like to drive cross country in a Deuce or 5 ton, I think a long-distance "recovery" road trip would be a fun adventure, even the possible breakdowns.

 

[Lukes_deuce]

Just to repeat some of these guys concerns, I love my 813 but it is not a daily driver. Its a rough truck that always gets the job done. They are getting old and they require a lot of maintenance. While the truck is not hard to work on, it is tough. A lot of parts are big and heavy. Also a theres a lot of rust to contend with. I had a lot of tools for normal cars and pick ups, I had to go out and buy a bunch of heavy truck tools to do the work. And even then, its tough. If you ever want a work out, work on a 5 ton.

 

[simp5782]

M923 on 14.00s m35 on 9.00s

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[Scar59]

Had my M813A1 out yesterday, hauled a bunch of Vets in the Jeffersontown, KY Gas Light Parade. Real fun truck to drive, brought back a lot of memories for some of the guys (pictures are no loading for some reason). They are big, loud, heavy, thirsty trucks. Take into account all the input so far. The guys are spot on. You'll need all new tools and a place to park it. It's worth it.

 

[SWMARTINA]

as far as block heaters go, I picked mine up a Napa for around $60. install was a snap. Starts like summertime even a 0 degrees. If you plan on using it year round in Alaska just remember all of your other fluids are going to be the same temp as the ambient air is. Bill

 

[74M35A2]

The 250 Cummins being challenging to start is good to know for Fairbanks, AK, but everyone here has block heaters...I mean every car has the male end of an extension cord dangling out of the front bumper. By comparison, how is the 8.3 Cummins in a M939A2?

They fire up very well. I have never plugged mine in, and I have started it down to -23F ambient temp with only the factory ether button.

 

[red]

M809 series didn't come with the ether setup

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