FLU419 SEE HMMH HME Owners group

[patrol578]

Quick question for the group: how much should I be paying for hydraulic lines for the front loader? A source claiming to have NOS wants $100 - 150 each, depending on which one. Is this in the ballpark of what others have paid? I need 3-4, so the cost is adding up quickly.

 

[Migginsbros]

Quick question for the group: how much should I be paying for hydraulic lines for the front loader? A source claiming to have NOS wants $100 - 150 each, depending on which one. Is this in the ballpark of what others have paid? I need 3-4, so the cost is adding up quickly.

Seems much. We purchase at Dunlop Hiflex part of http://www.alfagomma.com/en/
They manufactured lenght and cupling you want at there shop. We paid about 25-35 each.
Perhaps you find a "mobile hydraulic line express" who service excarvators and dozers on building sites and repair hydraulik lines on demand.

 

[Migginsbros]

And don´t forget. If you´re not only a SEE FLU419 enthusiast so have a look at our Steinbock forklift from 1987.
http://www.steelsoldiers.com/showth...s-MV-of-the-month-2017-March-VOTE-HERE!/page2
It´s SEE´s best friend (behind the HMMH)

 

[The FLU farm]

Quick question for the group: how much should I be paying for hydraulic lines for the front loader? A source claiming to have NOS wants $100 - 150 each, depending on which one. Is this in the ballpark of what others have paid? I need 3-4, so the cost is adding up quickly.

The local NAPA makes hoses to order, and they're not cheap, but I don't think even that route would cost as much as $100 to 150 a piece.
You may want to try your local friendly hydraulic shop, too.
Possibly the least expensive is to measure the stock hoses and order the closest available lengths from Surplus Center, for example. Just be sure to go a bit long rather than on the short side if using that approach.
It may even be cost effective to buy basic NPT end hoses and add the appropriate adapters. That way, if you ever lose a hose, it'll be quite affordable to replace it.

 

[patrol578]

Thanks for the ideas!

 

[peakbagger]

Quick question for the group: how much should I be paying for hydraulic lines for the front loader? A source claiming to have NOS wants $100 - 150 each, depending on which one. Is this in the ballpark of what others have paid? I need 3-4, so the cost is adding up quickly.

If you are new to SEE world (despite having a SEE for two years, I am still new), you will learn that the folks selling NOS surplus equipment on Ebay seem to use a dart board when pricing SEE parts that they bought at auction for 10 cents on a dlollar. I expect there is some source out there that I haven't located that lists the US governments purchase price for these spares and maybe that's where they come up with prices. I guess it comes down to how long they are willing to wait to sell an item that realistically has thin demand. I have stated before that Mercedes guaranteed parts availability to the US for many years (allegedly 50) but nowhere did they guarantee how much those parts would cost. If in doubt on wear components you are far better off adapting to a standard part. Note there are also many firms that respond to NSN queries on google and to date its extremely rare that I have found one with availability of the parts I look up, I think they make their money acting as a middleman that ultimately go back to Mercedes and put a mark up on Mercedes already hefty markup.

The other issue is that there seems to be a far more active parts market in Europe for mog parts and frequently a web search doesn't pick up those suppliers.

I do agree with others that if you are willing to work with a good independent hydraulic hose shop they can probably get you set up with reusable fittings with adaptors and end up with new rubber hoses compared to potentially 30 year old hoses. I lucked out in that the prior owner of mine replaced many if not all my hoses (expect for the hard to do ones in the backhoe mast) with new ones. In the past I have worked with hydraulic hose shops and its quite amazing what they carry for fittings. If you are out in boonies and don't have good shop nearby, it definitely worth picking up a cheap dial caliper and US, British and Metric pipe gages to figure out what size and thread you have and then you can just look around for a firm that can make the hoses for you on line. Not as good as a hose shop where you can bring it in and drop it on the counter and let them do the work but beats buying marked up OEM.

 

[General Hood]

If you are new to SEE world (despite having a SEE for two years, I am still new), you will learn that the folks selling NOS surplus equipment on Ebay seem to use a dart board when pricing SEE parts that they bought at auction for 10 cents on a dlollar. I expect there is some source out there that I haven't located that lists the US governments purchase price for these spares and maybe that's where they come up with prices. I guess it comes down to how long they are willing to wait to sell an item that realistically has thin demand. I have stated before that Mercedes guaranteed parts availability to the US for many years (allegedly 50) but nowhere did they guarantee how much those parts would cost. If in doubt on wear components you are far better off adapting to a standard part. Note there are also many firms that respond to NSN queries on google and to date its extremely rare that I have found one with availability of the parts I look up, I think they make their money acting as a middleman that ultimately go back to Mercedes and put a mark up on Mercedes already hefty markup.

The other issue is that there seems to be a far more active parts market in Europe for mog parts and frequently a web search doesn't pick up those suppliers.

I do agree with others that if you are willing to work with a good independent hydraulic hose shop they can probably get you set up with reusable fittings with adaptors and end up with new rubber hoses compared to potentially 30 year old hoses. I lucked out in that the prior owner of mine replaced many if not all my hoses (expect for the hard to do ones in the backhoe mast) with new ones. In the past I have worked with hydraulic hose shops and its quite amazing what they carry for fittings. If you are out in boonies and don't have good shop nearby, it definitely worth picking up a cheap dial caliper and US, British and Metric pipe gages to figure out what size and thread you have and then you can just look around for a firm that can make the hoses for you on line. Not as good as a hose shop where you can bring it in and drop it on the counter and let them do the work but beats buying marked up OEM.

Sound advice Peakbagger

 

[alpine44]

The local NAPA makes hoses to order, and they're not cheap, but I don't think even that route would cost as much as $100 to 150 a piece.
You may want to try your local friendly hydraulic shop, too.
Possibly the least expensive is to measure the stock hoses and order the closest available lengths from Surplus Center, for example. Just be sure to go a bit long rather than on the short side if using that approach.
It may even be cost effective to buy basic NPT end hoses and add the appropriate adapters. That way, if you ever lose a hose, it'll be quite affordable to replace it.

As FLU farm pointed out, NAPA can help and so can most Fleetpride stores and of course your local hydraulic shop.

There are two types of hose fittings. The swaged ones where you need dedicated equipment and the field replaceable fittings (AN or copy cats) that you can assemble yourself. The trick with the field replaceable types is buying the fittings and a roll of hose at a bargain price before you need them.

 

[alpine44]

No luck on today's FLU419 auction. Got outbid on two low mile ones and did not want to take the risk on the ones with thousands of miles on the clock.

For the next try it would be valuable to know what the current FLU419 owners consider acceptable as far a miles on the odometer is concerned?

Who has the one with the most miles that is still running strong and did not need major repairs?

 

[Migginsbros]

No luck on today's FLU419 auction. Got outbid on two low mile ones and did not want to take the risk on the ones with thousands of miles on the clock.

For the next try it would be valuable to know what the current FLU419 owners consider acceptable as far a miles on the odometer is concerned?

Who has the one with the most miles that is still running strong and did not need major repairs?

Dont know if the miles on the odo is valuable to count on.
Think they have plenty of new gauges and replace the old one. Our SEE has about 250 on the odo. He was in great shape but bad belts, wiper bottle damaged, brake fluidreservoir damaged, bad boots on the axeltubes, windshieldwiperarms damaged on axels....... No bad damage on engine or trany but not look like complete overhoul 200 miles before.
But we are very satisfied.

 

[BigBison]

Yup, thanks. I've got that line for the tires. I have thought of buying a cheap air tank, filling it at the gas station and using that for diagnosis and filling duties. She sits on a building site with no power as of yet, so getting a compressor out there would not help.

Get an Oasis DC-brushless compressor. I replaced the one that came in my service body, with the same thing in a continuous-duty (the difference is cooling fans); I'm running an *optional* receiver tank on the service body, this ain't yer Daddy's DC air compressor! I got a 2nd new Oasis, in 24V continuous-duty, which will be mounted in what used to be the house-battery nook (house batteries will be under the mattress in the bedroom) in my GMCMH, replacing both the OEM air-ride compressor and the aftermarket "brake-buddy" compressor she came with.

The 3-yr-old Oasis that came with my service body had been subjected to a wire-around by the previous owner, breaking the warranty seal and just making a mess out of it. If I need air right now, I'm just jumpering it directly to operate, while I wire up the new ones. One's wired up, but I'll be having NAPA make me some custom stainless-braided hoses before I get those going. You can jumper a 12V Oasis compressor off the "upstream" battery on your FLU, plenty of amp-hours there, these things are really efficient.

 

[BigBison]

FLU Junkie here from Phoenix, I have bought several FLU's and an HMMH.

Sweet! We needed a 3rd HMMH owner around here!

 

[BigBison]

Welcome back. The auger is the tool that we´r missing in our collection. Post some pics so we can at least have a look on it.

Yeah, I'm not so concerned with eventually acquiring the impact & chainsaw, but I could put that auger to use right away drilling holes to support my water tower, and later the windmill. I also want the optional hoist for the HMMH crane, if it isn't a unicorn, I still don't know?

 

[BigBison]

Somewhat on subject, I remember reading that the brake system could be damaged if driving without the air pressure built up.

Wow, link please, if you can find it? That's news to me, and something I've been doing all winter with my SEE.

Not that I usually use the brakes for a while, but I always wondered what would/could go wrong if applying the brakes without the air assist.

Nothing, if your quads are burly enough to squat an 8-ton tractor. Half my braking in the SEE this past winter, came without the benefit of air assist. You'll also need toned biceps for pulling against the steering wheel, but it stops just fine without power assist. The steering's another matter, even while moving.

I guess I just figured out in recent months, that a FLU has *three* hydraulic reservoirs. Two are mounted on the truckbed, the third's under the doghouse cover. The front equipment and the hose reel are *not* the same hydraulics as the power steering. I was under that impression, because I lost PS in the HMMH for a while unloading the Quonset-hut pallets, which was "fixed" by topping up the forklift reservoir. Now the temporary loss of PS I experienced is a total mystery.

As peakbagger points out, it's a regular brake system, with the exception of using pressure rather than vacuum. Or hydroboost, for that matter.

I'm serious about going hydroboost on my FLUs. The air system, in general, is a massive single-point-of-failure for the truck as a whole. Bye-bye brakes, half your gears, 4WD/difflock... if my air goes out, and I could pick just one system to still have functional, I'd have to say brakes!

 

[BigBison]

If you are out in boonies and don't have good shop nearby, it definitely worth picking up a cheap dial caliper and US, British and Metric pipe gages to figure out what size and thread you have and then you can just look around for a firm that can make the hoses for you on line. Not as good as a hose shop where you can bring it in and drop it on the counter and let them do the work but beats buying marked up OEM.

Speaking from out in the boonies, I know a few guys who make hydraulic hoses from time to time, with support from tractor-repair places nowhere near here for fittings and such. When I get a "parts SEE" I'll strip the hoses off of it, and set these guys to making a few sets, maybe over next winter. The hoses on my FLUs are the least of my problems, especially as the Quonset hut nears completion to park the FLUs inside.

 

[BigBison]

For the next try it would be valuable to know what the current FLU419 owners consider acceptable as far a miles on the odometer is concerned?

I think FLU odo's are accurate, but meaningless. Unless I'm mistaken, the units we've obtained were *all* rebuilt and I haven't heard of anyone saying their engine-hours gauge wasn't working. Engine hours are a much better indicator of post-rebuild life, IMO. My odo only adds miles when I'm going forwards, but at least 1/3 of my SEE's usage last winter was in reverse, mostly with a loaded bucket.

My SEE just hit 2,200 miles but I've barely put 100 on it. Engine hours have gone from 20 to 120, which is a much better gauge of wear & tear on the machinery.

 

[alpine44]

I think FLU odo's are accurate, but meaningless. Unless I'm mistaken, the units we've obtained were *all* rebuilt and I haven't heard of anyone saying their engine-hours gauge wasn't working. Engine hours are a much better indicator of post-rebuild life, IMO. My odo only adds miles when I'm going forwards, but at least 1/3 of my SEE's usage last winter was in reverse, mostly with a loaded bucket.

My SEE just hit 2,200 miles but I've barely put 100 on it. Engine hours have gone from 20 to 120, which is a much better gauge of wear & tear on the machinery.

Thanks BigBison. Agree with the engine hours being more important. Unfortunately GP/IP does not take pictures of the hour counter on the engine anymore.

 

[alpine44]

Dont know if the miles on the odo is valuable to count on.
Think they have plenty of new gauges and replace the old one. Our SEE has about 250 on the odo. He was in great shape but bad belts, wiper bottle damaged, brake fluidreservoir damaged, bad boots on the axeltubes, windshieldwiperarms damaged on axels....... No bad damage on engine or trany but not look like complete overhoul 200 miles before.
But we are very satisfied.View attachment 673201

Do you have a "Recapped at date" tag next to the data plate? Does anyone know what "recapped" actually entailed on the FLU419s?

 

[BigBison]

I have the local Corbond guy coming out to spray the Quonset hut next week, he'll also be doing the GMC after we've pulled up the old subfloor. A good bit of which has either wet or dry rot after 40 years, but it's standard plywood, not marine grade. Turns out, the GMC will be my next residence come Summer. Ordered:

http://www.gn-espace.com/en/yacht-galley-equipment/marine-gas-cookers/levante/ (see "Levante 3-burner")
http://www.gn-espace.com/en/yacht-galley-equipment/sinks-taps/galley-sinks/ (see "Sink 600")
http://www.engelcoolers.com/sr70f-u1.html

Re-doing the propane lines on the GMCMH gave me occasion to call Comet Gas in Aurora (been around longer than propane gas), and also pick their brains about propane absorption fridges (i.e. "3-way" RV/marine fridges). The reason those fridges have blown up so many folks' RVs and boats has nothing to do with the propane, as it also happens under AC or DC operation... and also applies to rural CO residents' barn fridge/freezer units, even though it's only the likes of Dometic and Norcold currently being subjected to massive class-action lawsuits from disgruntled exploded-RV owners, but it's more a conceptual than a design flaw:

https://www.hbsslaw.com/cases/domet...gerator-defect-linked-to-explosions-and-fires

There's always a piece of copper tubing in an ammonia-based absorption system that's heated by direct flame or electric element, and highly subject to corrosion. Usually starts to leak while pressurized (heated), in which case it vents Hydrogen gas into your living space... turn on the stove, have the furnace or water-heater spark up, and it's more than just *poof* so to speak, if the propane flame in the fridge doesn't torch it off first.

So I went with Engel's biggest built-in, about 1/2 the size of the Norcold it's replacing. I could always get a 2nd one, or get an electric cooler to shove under the mattress next to the batteries, or set outside. Mine will be running 24VDC/120VAC, it's one of those newfangled DC brushless motors so it'll be friendly to run directly off the 24VDC solar panels in the daytime. This is a compressor-based fridge, not an absorption fridge, rated for RV/marine use. Engel's been making this sort of unit for ages, but they're becoming "all the rage" now from all mfrs, most likely due to negative publicity and lawsuits over propane-fridge explosion risk, which is news to me who set out to buy a new 3-way fridge!

 

[BigBison]

My insurance agent informs me that I'll need on-site visits (at my expense, of course) from underwriters' adjusters -- one from the insurance provider for the FLUs, and another for the GMCMH. Nutshell on the FLUs, is if you intend to register them and get license plates, in CO that requires at least liability coverage, from an underwriter who may only have a handful of policies covering others' FLUs... what they want to see is a stock FLU, not one that's been modified into a snowblower, if you catch my drift.

Coverage for a heavily-modified GMCMH as my primary residence has led to some interesting exchanges via my local insurance agent. Adjusters routinely inspect boats, underwriters are aware that RVs aren't subject to those requirements, just those of manufactured housing and vehicles, but there's overlap in regs (boats need D.O.T. highway-approved propane tanks). The upshot of which, is by adhering to boat regs and *not* having a propane fridge, I'll save enough on the policy to more than pay for the site visit.

I could go with propane hoses, but 1/4" ID is 1/2" OD with nowhere near the radius of comparable copper tubing, so I'm going with copper tubing in my tiny li'l space. Unlike the original GMC design, I can't just have one propane line leading from the tank and branching off to various appliances. I *must* have an individual line and shutoff for each appliance, leading from a manifold in my propane compartment.

Also, I must install a shutoff solenoid between the tank & regulator, connected to propane sniffers in the "house" and the propane compartment. While my heaters will have isolated combustion circuits with external intake/exhaust, that is a gas range I'm installing, so I'm required to have a CO detector -- also for running the 6KW Onan. Smoke detectors required. Also, and I don't know how I'll ever get a blower-door leak test as my door is curved (maybe build a plywood "jig" for the back cap before it's put back on, to account for the leakage of my one door and be as useful a data point for me as it is for the insurace co), but below a certain volume and above a certain leak value, there's a requirement for an oxygen-concentration alarm.

Yeah, I've been at the GMCMH project for a while, but it's good to finally have my insurance ducks in a row. Refurbishing means you have to jump through all the same hoops the insurance industry requires of anyone manufacturing new motorhomes. I even got my NOS 3-point seatbelts in the other day, to replace the stock lap belts. The 3-point belts were an option when new, so there's a mounting point already there on my frame. In a rollover, the actuarial tables show that the lap belt was more survivable than the 3-point, but that choice is up to them not me! I've never rear-ended anyone in my life, but I guess you get elderly folks driving RVs around and it's so common to rear-end someone that the risk managers insist on the 3-point belts. My Mom had her first car accident ever last year -- rear-ended someone. I told her to buy a new car, they have computers for that now!

Whereas I'm not wearing my seatbelt out of concern of running into anything. It's the insane logging truck coming at me that'll put me over the edge one of these days, and I'd hate my epitaph to read, "Killed by shoulder-harness in rollover" when a lap belt woulda been adequate. I had to find NOS 3-point belts, because while newer alternatives will fit, those belts are designed to give in conjunction with the airbag system my '77 GMC just doesn't have. They're out there to find, and not all that costly.

Oh! You can't put integrated-belt seats on the existing mounts in the GMC without reinforcement, and you'll still have the "give" problem. What this means, is I can now also shop for "helm chairs"...

https://www.llebroc.com/product-p/4brbanl01.htm

...instead of "captain's chairs," because the 3-point harness and the chair are independent from one another. If the chair breaks loose, I'm not going anywhere if I'm buckled in... unless rollover... if I'd put the GMC off the road where I did the SEE a while back, the sideways deflection of the upper frame would've caused the driver's-side shoulder harness to tear me in half diagonally, if it'd gone over. A survivable scenario with just a lap belt.