802 tripping overload

[CapePrep]

Hello all. Have my "new" 802a up and running. Have a 240volt 4K watt space heater hooked up via the main lugs. The heater runs for approx 10 min than starts tripping the overload. I have 2 of these and was going to use them one at a time and than both together to put a strain on the motor and avoid wetstack. So I hooked up the second heater and run that one. I only have one on at a time. They are pulling 14amps on each leg. Approx 60% load on the gauge. But, both have the same symptoms. Now I can't get the AC interrupter switch to kick back on after I reset the light and disconnect the heaters. I did run it with the "Battle Short Switch" on for not even a minute. It does let the heater run. I went thru the -10 manual, but don't see anything specific for a reset or what might be wrong. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks

 

[jamawieb]

Dirty connections on the reconnection switch are the problem 90% of the time. How many hours are on the unit?

 

[Guyfang]

We just had this Dance, in the Thread "new to me mep-802a" i think was the Titel. Take a Look at that Thread, and Troubleshoot the K8 relay. Do You get an idiot light When You ran it it Battle Short?

like jamawieb Wrote, Check the connections on S8.

 

[CapePrep]

Not sure what "dance" your talking about. I just re-read the whole thing and there was nothing mentioned about a K8 relay. I am not sure which of the multiple books and hundreds of pages I have to scour to find the "K8" or "S8", but I will attempt to do that.
Yes I did get an idiot light on the battle short. Than, both idiot/indicator lights went out. I see there is a "push to test" on the light and in section 3 of the -10 book. I do that and I get nothing. So something has tripped/blown. Just trying to figure out what the trouble shooting process is to figure this out and why it shuts down after 10 minutes of a 4KW load.

We just had this Dance, in the Thread "new to me mep-802a" i think was the Titel. Take a Look at that Thread, and Troubleshoot the K8 relay. Do You get an idiot light When You ran it it Battle Short?

like jamawieb Wrote, Check the connections on S8.

 

[CapePrep]

jama, thanks for the suggestion. Will try to identify the reconnection switch and check the connections. There are only 15 hours on this unit.

Dirty connections on the reconnection switch are the problem 90% of the time. How many hours are on the unit?

 

[Haoleb]

You don't really need to check the connections as much as you need to get some electronic contact cleaner and douche the inside of the switch while you work it back and fourth a bunch of times. (power off of course)

I recommend Deoxit in spray form. The 5% stuff will work fine. I used the better part of that can on my switch when I had the same issue. Worked like a charm

https://www.amazon.com/DeOxit-Clean...8&qid=1516832076&sr=8-2&keywords=deoxit+spray

 

[Light in the Dark]

Have you snagged all of the different manuals for this set? They all are used for different things. There is a -10, a -24, a -24P, as well as a -24 and a -24P for the engine itself.

The -10 is basically operating instructions. The -24 is is for diagnosis/testing/maintenance. The -24P has all of the exploded parts diagrams you could ever wish for (and when you get good with them, you can determine all the info you need on how to source parts from the info in it).

So to help you out now, the S8 is the voltage reconnection switch. S-8 Circuit Schedule is listed on Page 279 of the 9-6115-641-24 manual I have a copy of (and probably grabbed from the manual section here on SS).

It can be overwhelming, if you let it be. The search function here is immeasurably helpful in not only diagnosing issues that arise, but also to figure out technical terms tossed around. We were all new once ourselves. The nice (well nice once you figure it out) thing about SS is the guys here will help anyone as much as they can, if they know you are putting in the effort on your side. Take the time, look over the various manuals, and get an idea of how they work, and how they are used.

 

[Light in the Dark]

Here you go: https://www.steelsoldiers.com/showt...-802-5KW-Generator-and-MEP-803-10KW-Generator

 

[jamawieb]

Did you replace the connection board that had the mice nest on top, from one of you other threads? You're running 3 threads and its getting confusing; try to keep it to one and run off of that.
So since the unit only has 15hours make sure all your wires on S8 and the av/vm (on the front panel) are hooked up correctly. I did a thread about 3 months ago about a unit that had 10 hours from a rebuild at a base in Oregon. I was having the same issue, tripping with about the same load, finally found they had 1 wire on the S8 reconnection switch hooked up wrong. Get the wiring diagram which is in the TM and each wire has a number on it, then compare to the wiring diagram. It took me about a week to trace it down. If everything is okay, then clean the reconnection switch and av/vm switch with contact cleaner, while rotating the switch. Finally, check the Burden resistors and K8. This can be the most aggravating problem because it could be so many things, so be patient and we are all here to help.

 

[CapePrep]

Jana, thanks very much for the helpful post. I am new to all of this and trying to interpret the military jargon and abbreviations for everything can get confusing. But, I am trying and downloading TM's(see, I am getting it!)every day. Glad to hear others have had the same issue. And yes, I did replace that terminal board and that alone helped with reducing the amperage being used on the heater and that part seems to be resolved. I will go thru the schematic on the S8. Will post back with results.

Did you replace the connection board that had the mice nest on top, from one of you other threads? You're running 3 threads and its getting confusing; try to keep it to one and run off of that.
So since the unit only has 15hours make sure all your wires on S8 and the av/vm (on the front panel) are hooked up correctly. I did a thread about 3 months ago about a unit that had 10 hours from a rebuild at a base in Oregon. I was having the same issue, tripping with about the same load, finally found they had 1 wire on the S8 reconnection switch hooked up wrong. Get the wiring diagram which is in the TM and each wire has a number on it, then compare to the wiring diagram. It took me about a week to trace it down. If everything is okay, then clean the reconnection switch and av/vm switch with contact cleaner, while rotating the switch. Finally, check the Burden resistors and K8. This can be the most aggravating problem because it could be so many things, so be patient and we are all here to help.

 

[CapePrep]

Light, thanks for your helpful response. The information you provided is exactly what I was looking for. I am trying to follow the manuals and will put some more work into that. I will get back to you regarding the PM you sent me. Thank you.

Have you snagged all of the different manuals for this set? They all are used for different things. There is a -10, a -24, a -24P, as well as a -24 and a -24P for the engine itself.

The -10 is basically operating instructions. The -24 is is for diagnosis/testing/maintenance. The -24P has all of the exploded parts diagrams you could ever wish for (and when you get good with them, you can determine all the info you need on how to source parts from the info in it).

So to help you out now, the S8 is the voltage reconnection switch. S-8 Circuit Schedule is listed on Page 279 of the 9-6115-641-24 manual I have a copy of (and probably grabbed from the manual section here on SS).

It can be overwhelming, if you let it be. The search function here is immeasurably helpful in not only diagnosing issues that arise, but also to figure out technical terms tossed around. We were all new once ourselves. The nice (well nice once you figure it out) thing about SS is the guys here will help anyone as much as they can, if they know you are putting in the effort on your side. Take the time, look over the various manuals, and get an idea of how they work, and how they are used.

 

[jamawieb]

If you getting your TM (technical manual) from this website, then there is a specific TM just for the wiring schematics which is what you need. You'll have to familiarize yourself with the codes of each item (i.e. S8 for the reconnection switch). After you have looked at the TM's a few times, while standing at the generator, you'll get it. It's not difficult just time consuming but after you master it, you'll know exactly how to find the problem the next time. And the unit I was referring to in a previous post with 10 hours, it was my own fault that it took a week to find the problem because I didn't take Guy's advice not to trust they put it back together correctly. In my mind it had to be something else wrong and it wasn't until I exhausted everything else is when I found it. LOL! Good learning experience.

 

[CapePrep]

Gentleman, I have verified the wiring of S8 is correct. I have rotated the switch many times. I have not douched it with contact cleaner yet. Waiting on that to arrive. I am running said 4KW heater as a load bank. I seem to be able to run it for between 8-9 minutes and than it will trip the overload and disconnect the AC Circuit Interrupter. I reset lights, turn CI back on and all good. I am pulling about 55% load. I go to turn the other heater on, same size and it trips the overload. I was just watching a youtube where the guy really loads the 802 up and it just chugs along. Is my problem as simple as a dirty S8??? I just want this thing running like the guy in video has his. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=36xym0cBOjw

 

[jamawieb]

Yes, dirty or loose connections cause the safety system to overstate amperage. Trust us, we have all been there and thought it can't be a dirty connection but it normally turns out to be the connections. You can also try electrical cleaner from Wal-mart, that is what I use 90% of the time unless I see a lot of corrosion, then I use Dexoit.
Also take your time with load testing and be patient. You have a brand new engine so I hope your using break in oil until you hit 100 hours. I would run it at no load for a few hours, then set it up to 2kw, 4kw, 6kw, and then finally 8kw. In my experience anything over 8kw will trip the overload. I usually load test the 802a with a 7kw load for at least 6 hours before putting it up for sale. I like to do 8kw for at least 2 hours too.

 

[Guyfang]

I thought that it looked like Daybreaks farm!

 

[CapePrep]

Jama, not sure what this thing is that you call "patience"??? Can I get that at Walmart??? I hear you on all fronts. I am running break in oil. I read that is very important. I am going to go thru the connections again and see if there is anything obvious that is going on. Maybe look at that TB that I replaced and all of those wires. Also, since you seem to have lot's of experience with these, when I used the battle short switch the other day, both of my indicator lights for that switch and the AC interrupter stopped working. I took them out, used an OHM meter to test them and also put 24 volts to them. Nothing. Just think it is odd that they both blew/stopped working at same time. Trying to source new ones now. Your thoughts?

Yes, dirty or loose connections cause the safety system to overstate amperage. Trust us, we have all been there and thought it can't be a dirty connection but it normally turns out to be the connections. You can also try electrical cleaner from Wal-mart, that is what I use 90% of the time unless I see a lot of corrosion, then I use Dexoit.
Also take your time with load testing and be patient. You have a brand new engine so I hope your using break in oil until you hit 100 hours. I would run it at no load for a few hours, then set it up to 2kw, 4kw, 6kw, and then finally 8kw. In my experience anything over 8kw will trip the overload. I usually load test the 802a with a 7kw load for at least 6 hours before putting it up for sale. I like to do 8kw for at least 2 hours too.

 

[Guyfang]

Describe, "stopped working". As soon as you flipped up the S7? Or did they light up a while, then flicker, before going out? Did they both stop working at exactly the same time?

 

[CapePrep]

The load bank shut off and I had tripped the overload. When I tried to turn the S5 switch back on, it would activate K1(?)but not stay connected. I would see a bump in % gauge and than it would shut down. All along the DS7 would light when that the switch S5 was activated. Since it wouldn't reset, I hit the S7, everything worked, but then the lights both went out on both indicators. The push to test on S7 worked momentarily, but nothing now. A coincidence? And S5 does activate the K1 since I do have power to the main lugs, until it trips.

Describe, "stopped working". As soon as you flipped up the S7? Or did they light up a while, then flicker, before going out? Did they both stop working at exactly the same time?

 

[jamawieb]

Jama, not sure what this thing is that you call "patience"??? Can I get that at Walmart??? I hear you on all fronts. I am running break in oil. I read that is very important. I am going to go thru the connections again and see if there is anything obvious that is going on. Maybe look at that TB that I replaced and all of those wires. Also, since you seem to have lot's of experience with these, when I used the battle short switch the other day, both of my indicator lights for that switch and the AC interrupter stopped working. I took them out, used an OHM meter to test them and also put 24 volts to them. Nothing. Just think it is odd that they both blew/stopped working at same time. Trying to source new ones now. Your thoughts?

The indicator lights on the S7 (battle short) and S5 (Ac interrupter) are actually linked together on TB6-6 so a spike could have taken them both out. Look at R15 on the burden resistors because the battle short indicator DS6 goes through there. DS7 which is for the AC interrupter goes to K8 (overload / short circuit relay).

Just for fun make sure the connections on K1 are correct also. Look more at the small leads on top.

 

[Suprman]

If it had mice in it you need to look over ever inch of wiring and see if anything is chewed thru.