12/24v confusion

[sgms18]

My truck came with a push button for both the glow plugs & the starter. I don't mind the glow plug button but I want to fix the ignition so it spins over with the key like it should, but that's not my immediate problem. The hot wire to the starter button ran straight off the positive battery terminal across the firewall & up & under the dash WITH NO FUSE AT ALL. That made me nervous so I unhooked it & ran it to the empty ignition + spot in the fuse box. Now it spins over slow & is hard to start. I have to hit the button several times to get it to spin over at all, the solenoid clicks but no spin & if you hold the button down it blows to 20a ignition fuse. I know the starter is 24v but is the ignition feed to solenoid 12 or 24?

 

[cucvrus]

WOW. I would find a complete uncut CUCV wiring harness and un cobble the current mess you have. That or get a stock truck and do a side by side comparison of what has been hacked and what can remain as it is. It sounds like a few things could be a mess and you could have a fire potential if you don't have things corrected. I am thinking that the trigger wire to the starter would be 24 volt on a stock CUCV. I have jumped the starter relays and noted a brighter light on the test light when doing initial probing for problems. Be Careful. Be safe and Good Luck. Wiring harnesses are out there. Not sure of the cost of a good used uncut one but I know they are available. I have an M1009 that has a 99.9% uncut harness in it.

 

[sgms18]

Well damn. I really hope I don't have to change the whole harness. Everything else seems to work correctly except starter & the glow plugs, my $ is on a bad glow plug card. As for the starting circuit, who knows why they put the push button in, bad ignition switch, stuck starter relay. I reckon I'm going to find out though. Like you said anything not fused is a fire hazzard & that's what got me going down this road to start with. Probably a good time to go head & do the starter relay mod. I'm still trying to understand this 12/24v system.

 

[Trailgator]

When I acquired my M1009, the PO had rewired it so the glowplugs would come on by holding accelerator pedal to the floor, he had by passed the interior starter relay and wired a push button directly to the starter solenoid, it was a mess. He had also disabled Gen 2, it was a mess. After reading several postings here, I replaced the glow plug circuit card, did the Doghead modification and returned it to Stock Military configuration, everything no works as it should. I would encourage anybody who has a CUCV to keep as original as possible. It’s a lot easier to repair/ maintain with all of the info available here IMHO.

 

[sgms18]

I agree 1000% I want to get everything electrical on this truck back the way it's supposed to be.

 

[Keith_J]

24 volt starter has a 24 volt solenoid.

 

[sgms18]

Ok, thanks. Yall can disregard that nonsense I said bout everything working but the starter & glow plugs. Now that I really look at it I got no gauge lights, no volt gauge & only 1 generator light. Awesome. More digging to come.

 

[MarcusOReallyus]

, I replaced the glow plug circuit card, did the Doghead modification and returned it to Stock Military configuration, everything no works as it should. I would encourage anybody who has a CUCV to keep as original as possible. It’s a lot easier to repair/ maintain with all of the info available here IMHO.

AGREED!

When you have a hack job, there is really no way to figure out what the hacker had in mind, or why he did what he did. Many people who chop up vehicle wiring only think they know what they are doing, and trying to figure out their mistakes can make you go bald from pulling your hair out.

The best thing is to just put it back to stock.

Your starter relay (under the dash) gets 12v to fire it (from your ignition switch), but puts 24v out to the starter solenoid. Check the -20, appendix F for the wiring diagrams. You want F1, "Starter Circuit (All Except M1010)", on page 854.

 

[sgms18]

Looks like the original problem was the stuck starter relay. It burnt the fusible link on the firewall by the battery.

 

[sgms18]

I temporarily hooked up the burnt end of the fuseable link and everything works correctly at the relay plug & my gen2 light works now.

 

[sgms18]

To make it even better the heat shield on the starter has cut into the battery cable & shorted out. Pretty sure the starters toast. Fixed the shorted cable, got good voltage at both starter terminals. Clack, no spin.

 

[sgms18]

Have yall ever heard of CME ARMA starters? They have a Miami address. Thought I saw somewhere they were made in the usa. I want a quality starter so it's not a reoccurring problem. Any experiences/opinions? I looked at the DB Electric starters, as cheap as they are it's tempting but I know you get what you pay for.

 

[rmesgt]

Wouldn't it be easier/cheaper/better to have your starter rebuilt? If it is an original starter, I would hesitate to part with it. I know that in many of the larger cities there are companies that specialize in repairing/rewinding electric motors and starters. Good Luck! I am sure that it will work out for the best...

 

[cucvrus]

Auto Electric Services | Leidy Repair | Lebanon, PA

We specialize in auto starter, alternator, and electrical system rebuilding services. Affordable prices.

leidyrepair.com

I have used this rebuilder for years. I also know that Fort Indiantown Gap uses them for rebuilding starters and alternators. Good Luck. I have had Chinese, Japanese, and no name brand starters and alternators. They either worked or they didn't I never had 1 that was better than the other. I do prefer the direct drive over the gear reduction starter. But also keep in mind you need a properly running truck that starts easily and don't require a few minutes of cranking every time you go to start it. Also good strong high amperage batteries and tight battery clamps and cables. Preferably not bolt on battery cable ends or loose connections. Make sure the starter support bracket is in place. Good Luck. Do it right the first time. It takes less time and cost less money the first time around.

 

[sgms18]

Well that's a thought. I reckon I'll check into the rebuild route. I could probably do it at the house if I can find parts. My starters not original. It's the gear reduction type. According to the previous owner it was rebuilt once before in 2014 by a shop in Barnwell SC.

 

[cucvrus]

A word of advise. There is much more to rebuilding automotive components than just opening it up and putting a few new parts inside. Moving forward I let competent people work on anything that requires special equipment and tools to do the job right. I like once and done. Good Luck. Armatures and bushings come to mind.

 

[rmesgt]

Auto Electric Services | Leidy Repair | Lebanon, PA

We specialize in auto starter, alternator, and electrical system rebuilding services. Affordable prices.

leidyrepair.com

I have used this rebuilder for years. I also know that Fort Indiantown Gap uses them for rebuilding starters and alternators. Good Luck. I have had Chinese, Japanese, and no name brand starters and alternators. They either worked or they didn't I never had 1 that was better than the other. I do prefer the direct drive over the gear reduction starter. But also keep in mind you need a properly running truck that starts easily and don't require a few minutes of cranking every time you go to start it. Also good strong high amperage batteries and tight battery clamps and cables. Preferably not bolt on battery cable ends or loose connections. Make sure the starter support bracket is in place. Good Luck. Do it right the first time. It takes less time and cost less money the first time around.

 

[sgms18]

Well I cut out the original starter relay & wired in a 12v 30a relay. Not the Ford starter solenoid type but it seem to be working. At least with the volt meter. I put an inline fuse on the 24v supply from the junction block just to be on the safe side. I know it has worked for a bunch of folks here but the exposed connections on the Doghead relay under that metal dash make me nervous. New starter should be here today but the crappie are biting right now so the trucks been put on the back burner.

 

[MarcusOReallyus]

You should be just fine. AntennaClimber measured the current through that relay at about 9 amps. 30 amps is plenty of headroom.

 

[cucvrus]

I have also used the cube style relay from Antenna Climber on several of my CUCV's. I never cut the harness. The spades were just configured to plug directly into the harness. Never had any failures. I wanted to use something that didn't require all that positive energy exposure in such a negatively surrounded area. And also really hate cutting into harnesses. Good Luck. I think everything will work out fine.