M35A2 or M35A3? Pro's and Cons of each

[L1A1]

The gov't works in mysterious ways. Is the A3 out of production? What is it being replaced with or are all of the 2.5 tons being omitted altogether?

From what I'm to understand, the M35A3 was a remanufactured earlier M35 not a brand new truck. They are being replaced in service by the FLTV (Family of Light Tactical Vehicles) which is a 2.5 ton 4X4. believe one designation for the cargo truck is M1081(?)

thanks

Are the A3's multi fuel vehicles, like the A2's???

No, the cat engine in them runs on diesel/ JP8(?) .
Matt

 

[kimbilly]

If your starter goes bad on a a3 you cant push start it. You can the a2. If the a2 leaks out the trans fluid you can still move it. You cant the a3. You can burn any type of fuel in the a2. You cant the a3. The bigger tires on the a3 are a bumpier ride. But same ride if you put them on a a2.

 

[Hoefler]

I have both an A2 and an A3. Also have a 5-ton. The one that gets driven the most is the A3. I live in a city with lots of traffic and lights. This may be the reason-its easier to drive. The automatic makes city driving easier. When properly lubed, the A3 power steering is great-the A2 is armstrong steering. A3 has a modern dual curcuit brake system-A2 does not. The A3 cab is quiter, wipers are better. The A3 comes with nice thick rubber flooring that keeps it a little warmer in the winter. Heater in the A3 actually heats up the cab. My A2 is a cold ride in the winter. A3 has a good drivers seat-the A2 is more of a buckboard! The CaT engine in the A3 sounds great and gets decent mileage. As far as a bumpier ride-have not noticed. When properly aired up, mine rides pretty good. The A2 is a simpler machine-honest and basic. I use her in my woods and love driving her too. Its a Ford or Chevy choice! Its a fun deal though.

 

[jaymcb]

I like my A3, but I'd sure like a 5th gear. 2700 RPM @ 49MPH will eventually set your teeth on edge. I know, I drove it home 400 miles in a single day.

 

[WillysNut]

I'm new to the M35 arena and am researching on which is the better way to go - A2 or A3. Up until a few days ago, I didn't even know there were different A2 or A3 models. (This is the same reply I've posted in a couple threads.)

Having read several threads regarding this debate, one thing seems to be strikingly appearent - it is an issue of the haves vs. the have nots. Those with the cash prefer the A3, those without the A2's. I did not find one A3 owner regretting their purchase saying they wish they had bought the A2. The same goes for those who own, or have owned, both; they all have said the A3 is their perferred overall truck, except for maybe highway driving - though they enjoy driving both. These are the people whose opinon I respect and value the most. Yes, I am sure there are those dual owners who don't like the A3, I just haven't run across any.

By far, the biggest arguements for the A2 are that it is cheap to buy and that the parts are plentiful/cheap (which are valid) - and, oh, that it looks cooler (not so valid). Obviously, the A3's are the more expensive purchase. Yet given the required A2 upgrades in which to make it safer and more driver friendly (i.e.: more like the A3), the costs in the long run are very comparable, if not the A2 being more expensive.

Being a Jeep and Willys guy for over 30 years, I've come to the realization that, while they certainly look cool and and have character, the old Jeeps and Willys suck to drive. They're underpowered, uncomfortable, loud, handle and stop like crap, and are cold in the winter. But, they're cheap and I love 'em. However, that being said, I also spend thousands upgrading engines, steering, drivetrain, brakes, and suspensions (and on the resulting headaches) to make them feasible daily drivers in the real world. Fact is, on a daily, year round basis, I much rather drive a new JK Rubicon than a '54 M38A1.

From what I'm reading, the A2's fit into that "cool with character" camp, where as the A3's fit more into the real world daily driver camp. Guess it comes down for what one is using the truck. A2's seem to make better farm/ranch vehicles, while the A3's better daily drivers.

 

[sandcobra164]

I'm new to the M35 arena and am researching on which is the better way to go - A2 or A3. Up until a few days ago, I didn't even know there were different A2 or A3 models. (This is the same reply I've posted in a couple threads.)

Having read several threads regarding this debate, one thing seems to be strikingly appearent - it is an issue of the haves vs. the have nots. Those with the cash prefer the A3, those without the A2's. I did not find one A3 owner regretting their purchase saying they wish they had bought the A2. The same goes for those who own, or have owned, both; they all have said the A3 is their perferred overall truck, except for maybe highway driving - though they enjoy driving both. These are the people whose opinon I respect and value the most. Yes, I am sure there are those dual owners who don't like the A3, I just haven't run across any.

By far, the biggest arguements for the A2 are that it is cheap to buy and that the parts are plentiful/cheap (which are valid) - and, oh, that it looks cooler (not so valid). Obviously, the A3's are the more expensive purchase. Yet given the required A2 upgrades in which to make it safer and more driver friendly (i.e.: more like the A3), the costs in the long run are very comparable, if not the A2 being more expensive.

Being a Jeep and Willys guy for over 30 years, I've come to the realization that, while they certainly look cool and and have character, the old Jeeps and Willys suck to drive. They're underpowered, uncomfortable, loud, handle and stop like crap, and are cold in the winter. But, they're cheap and I love 'em. However, that being said, I also spend thousands upgrading engines, steering, drivetrain, brakes, and suspensions (and on the resulting headaches) to make them feasible daily drivers in the real world. Fact is, on a daily, year round basis, I much rather drive a new JK Rubicon than a '54 M38A1.

From what I'm reading, the A2's fit into that "cool with character" camp, where as the A3's fit more into the real world daily driver camp. Guess it comes down for what one is using the truck. A2's seem to make better farm/ranch vehicles, while the A3's better daily drivers.

You make some valid points in you're argument. I commend you on that. My A2 is lacking the air assist steering but I don't miss the power steering that much, it actually steer's pretty easy. I do enjoy being able to drive 62 MPH if I desire to, I enjoy being able to burn most any filtered petroleum product new or used available, I enjoy having a simple to work on motor and trans and lastly, I enjoy having a truck that can be repaired with "bailing wire and duct tape" to make it to it's destination. The A3's are fine trucks but trying to convince someone that one is better than the other is a losing battle. I've not owned an A3, I've seen them and driven them, I'd rather have my A2 but I'm sure there are other's who would agree, Why in the World own either. It all comes down to what you like and there really shouldn't be a thread like this when it all comes down to personal preference. High Dollar guys don't necessarily have the A3's and Low Dollar guys don't necessarily have A2's. I could buy an A3 Deuce with a blank private party check for whatever amount. You won't see one in my yard and I had an M936A2 for quite a while and made quite a pile of money when I let it go. Money right back into the play money pile to buy something else. Again, it comes down to personal preference.

 

[Al Capone]

found an A2 jeep kaiser 1971 on GL in MN, but its a non turbo and I was really hoping for a turbo. Wonder how big of a deal it would be to turbo a non turbo M35 lol.

I had both turbo and non turbo trucks and the non turbo had more pep or power off idle .

 

[HDN]

Sometimes I'd prefer non-turbo so I don't have to wait five minutes for the truck to cool down when parking it. I love the sound the turbo makes, though!

 

[tobyS]

The A3 makes a good 4x4 and if you have the money, gears (I think 4.90) can change everything on that 1-1 final drive Alison. Add in air lock differentials and front hub locks.

From what I read, they can back up in low range any not explode the TC like my 5 ton will.

Brakes are a 50/50 system with larger 11/2" on front. The 1 1/2" brake cylinders will fit the back to compensate for bigger tire wheel torque. Makes a great 4x candidate for brakes alone.

 

[tobyS]

The A3 makes a good 4x4 and if you have the money, gears (I think 4.90) can change everything on that 1-1 final drive Alison. Add in air lock differentials and front hub locks.

From what I read, they can back up in low range any not explode the TC like my 5 ton will.

Brakes are a 50/50 system with larger 11/2" on front. The 1 1/2" brake cylinders will fit the back to compensate for bigger tire wheel torque. Makes a great 4x candidate for brakes alone.

Replying to our old thread. I see fuzzytoaster has two M35A3 listed for sale in Texas and just want to confirm that I think these are great 4x4 candidates. He says they run and drive. They look a bit rough with bad tops.

That wouldnt matter to a builder that starts with the frame .....and plans for gears plus air locks front and rear.

Face it, the military missed on the gearing of the A3. One to one final in the Allison and the deuce A2 OEM gear makes for the slowest vehicle on the road. And the locking torque converter is a source of 4th gear stress that causes clutches to burn up. But the Allison can be fixed.....it' final 1/1 is the issue.

That's where the (I think) 4.90 gears for the deuce Rockwell axle comes in. It puts a reasonable rpm on the cat into highway speed like 65-70.

But it really wouldn't be safe if it couldn't stop. The dual circuit brakes of the A3 are 50/50 and the front wheel cylinders are 1 1/2" compared to the A2 with 1 3/8" brake cylinder pistons on all axles. The A3 rear can be changed to 1 1/2" with only push rod change, matching to the split MC. The larger tires like 395 have much more torque for the brakes original design.....but is perfect for 4x4.

That is my thought on seeing fuzzy's pair.

 

[HDN]

where the (I think) 4.90 gears for the deuce Rockwell axle comes in. It puts a reasonable rpm on the cat into highway speed like 65-70.

If anyone wants top speeds like that, I'd make sure the truck not only has brakes to tolerate stopping, but also tires with the proper speed rating. The surplus Michelin 395s, for example, are rated for a top speed of 55 MPH - and that was when they were new!

I think 395s are a nice and relatively easy speed upgrade for the M35A3 and its stock rims. Going from the 43" 365/80R20 to the 46" 395/85R20 adds about 8% to your road speed, so you can do about 50 MPH while your speedometer reads 46 MPH. My tires, while they are in good condition and have no visible dry cracking, are still over 10 years old, so I don't dare push them faster than that.

After all, if I wanted to go fast, I'd take my Chrysler 200 or Town and Country

 

[tobyS]

If anyone wants top speeds like that, I'd make sure the truck not only has brakes to tolerate stopping, but also tires with the proper speed rating. The surplus Michelin 395s, for example, are rated for a top speed of 55 MPH - and that was when they were new!

I think 395s are a nice and relatively easy speed upgrade for the M35A3 and its stock rims. Going from the 43" 365/80R20 to the 46" 395/85R20 adds about 8% to your road speed, so you can do about 50 MPH while your speedometer reads 46 MPH. My tires, while they are in good condition and have no visible dry cracking, are still over 10 years old, so I don't dare push them faster than that.

After all, if I wanted to go fast, I'd take my Chrysler 200 or Town and Country

Fast is relative. Stopping must be sure, that is why going to 1 1/2" wheel cylinders on the rear is necssary because of the 50/50 MC. Otherwise, when braking, the rear requires less fluid to move a given distance but cannot exert as much pressure. So the front would actuate slower but with more pressure.

Myself, I want them to move equally and have larger force of the 1 1/2"....because 395 has more torque.
Thus first consideration is a proper brake system for these larger tires and 4x4..

Speed....sorry but I want to take it on highways that 50 is simply unsafe. The Goodyears are rated to 65....yes the XZL Michelin begins to hum fairly well at 55... and is rated 55. With the reduced weight of the axle and trunion, I see no reason the little cat cannot cruise at 60-65 with bursts to 70. Gears are way better than turning the driveshaft faster, like an OD.

Most of my off road can use the low transfer case.....happens to be a TC you can back in low and not self destruct, yet still have air engagement. Then the 4 speed with 1/1 fourth gear works fine and the locking torque converter does what it's supposed to do.....lock at high speed.

I would bet with differential lockers, a 4x4 can outpull a 3x6 (6x6 without lockers).

I'm just saying that the A3 has many advantages for a 4x4. Unfortunately my bank account isn't going to get me there. Things like a new top for the 929 are way up the line....got drenched.

 

[montaillou]

Driving a truck this size, on the highway, I don't see it as unsafe. Just stick to the right lane. I've put about 3k hwy miles on mine. I like to do 60 as that's the truck speed limit in my area and I don't like to feel like I'm holding people up unnecessarily. I've never had my truck very loaded and 60 is just above the 55 limit range for the super singles so I never felt it was much of an issue. I've switched tires now though, back to dualies, more rubber on the road.

I've crossed mountain ranges 5 times with this truck, best top speed going up hill was maybe 30. But lots of trucks do low speed going uphill, though they're carrying a load. I wouldn't mind going a little faster, just to shave time off my trips.

My views on the A3 (and I've never owned one), but it just seems more things to go wrong. Higher cost to get into one.

I hope my next truck will be HEMTT, not as a replacement, in addition to.

 

[HDN]

I hope my next truck will be HEMTT, not as a replacement, in addition to.

Those seemed to be designed for both the highway and off-road, being able to do 60 and above all day long. I'd love to add one to my stable, but my wife insists upon either an MTV or a HMMWV first

I think I'm lucky with my A3 as it was a mail truck at Fort Totten in Queens. I don't think it went off-road often, or ever had a heavy load put in the back, or towed so much as one, so I expect a long life from the original transmission parts. At least I know what I need to fix it for good in case I do manage to burn out the 4th/reverse clutches.

From my reading here, the transmission seems to be the weakest link of the truck that's the most expensive to repair (if you pay someone to do it, that is). The air-assisted steering exhaust hose seems to be destroyed really easily, which can cause engine damage if you drive through really dusty environments, but I swapped my destroyed section for a flexible clear drainage hose mating it with the part of the original hose/duct that wasn't damaged. Everything else that needs TLC is normal for all deuces, like wheel bearings and the tandem axle spring seat.

 

[montaillou]

I'd love to add one to my stable

I'm designing my next house. Don't know when I'm gonna build it, but it's gonna have a 1500 sq/ft garage and capable of housing a HEMTT (along with my other vehicles) just in case I can swing one.

 

[NEIOWA]

M35A3. Stock/good condition 5000lb load. What MPH will one do on level paved highway?

 

[HDN]

M35A3. Stock/good condition 5000lb load. What MPH will one do on level paved highway?

About 50 mph. I don't go higher than 50 in mine even with 395s mounted.