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M1083A1 Electrical Maladies Starting at the Disconnect Switches

Lugnuts

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I realize that given the current cost of fuels (we're looking at you, Brandon) that it's hard to imagine dumping 50 gallons of diesel (ie: retasking for other burning purposes) but there is absolute no chance I would risk my CAT engine tinkering with it to actually run as fuel. No friggin-ing way after saltwater contamination. *I live 12 minutes from "feet in the sand" in the Gulf

As far as clutch packs go, water is water. Clutches are basically flat discs with asbestos dust glued to each facing surface. There are literally dozens of them in an automatic trans. Water dissolves the asbestos and turns the fluid to a tan goo in the process. A tiny amount of water with only the hint of frothing tan will typically require a rebuild. If water is know to encroach a transmission, the only salvageable option is to not turn that transmission over (ie: don't run the engine). Immediately drain the fluid from both trans and t-case (all of it which requires pulling lines from the cooler, pulling all drains, pans, access ports (especially given that you are dealing with saltwater). A complete flush, filter change, and refill should be done immediately (like day after) and even then it can be very dodgy for the future of a water exposed transmission. You can flush out the water and clutch material that has entered the system, but that doesn't fix the clutches that are now slipping due to the lose of the friction coating.

The good news is that takeoff transmissions and transfer case can be had for under $2K +shipping. Of course shipping is bad news currently. And there is always a chance of getting another bad transmission/t-case. Be very leery of "used" LMTV transmissions on eBay, Craigslist, etc (deal with a known community member with a solid reputation). And if you see a used one on GP, assume the worst. Sadly, shipping will add another grand or so to the process.

And yeah, the t-case shares the same fluid source so it needs to be treated the same. It would be extremely unlikely that a trans goo'ed and didn't take the t-case with it. The only way to really inspect the damage is total disassembly and rebuild with fresh clutch packs, seals, all the stuff typically found in the rebuild kit.

Rebuild is an option if you have access to all the required tools to tear down a trans (lots of fancy plyers and Allison-specific pullers, tools, etc found typically only in transmission shops). The Allison's aren't any harder to work on than any other 7-sp trans (bigger is actually a bit easier to work with). The rebuild kits themselves are not cheap, but available (although I never did for one for the t-case when I was looking). I'd only pursue this option if you have a trans guy with a shop and the tools that can accommodate the 1500lb giant beast. As stated above, total disassembly and inspection is in order. We'll assume that there was no hardpart damage (ie: very expensive moving parts not covered in the rebuild kit).

A reman is an option but starting at about $10K + shipping often makes replacing the truck the better option.

I know this isn't a rosy picture I'm painting, but I've been there. This was what drained out of my third truck when I got it (with known "transmission not working" issues). I sold it as a parts truck after weighing all options.

View attachment 882196
Thank you for taking the time to write a long reply. It is much appreciated. I do not intend on using this diesel for anything except starting fires or perhaps cleaning very dirty trucks just prior to pressure washing. Mixes great with Gunk that needs to be cut/ You did make a point for me which I will verify and that is water dissolves asbestos. Never heard of that.
What this whole event has caused me to do is question the what ifs. So I threw it out there and I am really grateful for your response.
I have replaced one of these transmissions and I did not count it a bad job but it makes you well aware of the weight factor hanging over your head. Nope don't want to change one just for having fun.
Again, appreciate it.
 

Third From Texas

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You did make a point for me which I will verify and that is water dissolves asbestos. Never heard of that.
I think it's actually the adhesive used to adhere the asbestos to the clutch plate that fails when exposed to water but you get the drift. Easy enough to verify, just google "water in transmission fluid " and you should find no shortage of discussions.

A lot of people were puzzled as to how water could have gotten into my truck's transmission (no indication of submersion, no indication of cross-contamination at the cooler). The breather bolt not being put into it's proper place when fording is always suspect, but it's not the only potential ingress point for water to enter the system.

Curious, was the breather bolt secured before you guys go wet?
 
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Third From Texas

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Here's a good read. It's more for the non-mechanic car owner, but it covers most of the bases:


 

Lugnuts

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I think it's actually the adhesive used to adhere the asbestos to the clutch plate that fails when exposed to water but you get the drift. Easy enough to verify, just google "water in transmission fluid " and you should find no shortage of discussions.

A lot of people were puzzled as to how water could have gotten into my truck's transmission (no indication of submersion, no indication of cross-contamination at the cooler). The breather bolt not being put into it's proper place when fording is always suspect, but it's not the only potential ingress point for water to enter the system.

Curious, was the breather bolt secured before you guys go wet?
Actually I can not answer that question. The Fire Department had 3 standing in a row and they had just received these from Forestry so they grabbed one, Stenciled some numbers on the side, and put it into service. It got chosen because it started.
Please tell me the location of the breather bolt and what location it should be installed and really I thought they would be ready for anything when you got them. So I need to be educated also. Thank you
 

Third From Texas

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Actually I can not answer that question. The Fire Department had 3 standing in a row and they had just received these from Forestry so they grabbed one, Stenciled some numbers on the side, and put it into service. It got chosen because it started.
Please tell me the location of the breather bolt and what location it should be installed and really I thought they would be ready for anything when you got them. So I need to be educated also. Thank you
It's in the TM but it's easy to spot (assuming that it's on your model of Alison, but I'm pretty sure all LMTV have it). On the base of the trans there are two holes (both threaded, one will have a bolt in it). The first is a hole all the way thru that acts as a vent/breather. The second is not all the way thru and exists only to keep the bolt attached when not in the breather hole.

The gist is that if you are ever going to ford in water that might reach the transmission, you take the bolt out of it's retainer hole and use it to plug the breather.

*you also flip the "fording" swatch on the dash which stops the fan from turning and catching water (ripping the blades off)
 
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Ronmar

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Any water in the transmission is a death senten
why didn't they just plumb that up with a hose up high to area between cab and bed/box??
Thats actually supposed to be a drain for the bell housing. It has a vent port up on the top. Even full of water it cannot pass from there to transmission or engine. If it could oil would come the other way, and when you find oil here it is time for a teardown and rear main seal or torque converter replacement.

IMO the most likley place for water ingress into a transmission is either thru the filler hose, dipstick tube or the vent on top of the transmission housing…
 

Third From Texas

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Any water in the transmission is a death senten

Thats actually supposed to be a drain for the bell housing. It has a vent port up on the top. Even full of water it cannot pass from there to transmission or engine. If it could oil would come the other way, and when you find oil here it is time for a teardown and rear main seal or torque converter replacement.

IMO the most likley place for water ingress into a transmission is either thru the filler hose, dipstick tube or the vent on top of the transmission housing…
It certainly is at he bell housing but I swear I saw this as being part of the fording procedure. Plug it for fording, normal operation open (as pictured) to breath.

But it wouldn't be the first time I remembered wrong.

Of course I can't find a thing in the TM about fording procedures now...

;)
 
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coachgeo

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It certainly is at he bell housing but I swear I saw this as being part of the fording procedure. Plug it for fording, normal operation open (as pictured) to breath.

But it wouldn't be the first time I remembered wrong.

Of course I can't find a thing in the TM about fording procedures now...

;)
I seem to recall that as part of fording procedure too.
 

TomTime

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TM 9-2320-366-10-1

Section III. OPERATION UNDER USUAL CONDITIONS

2-26. PREPARATION FOR USE

g. Installing Flywheel Housing Vent Plug.

If vehicle will be operating in water 30 in. (762 mm) or of unknown depth,
flywheel housing vent plug must be installed. Failure to comply may
result in damage to equipment.
(1) Remove flywheel housing vent plug (1) from stowage mount (2).
(2) Install flywheel housing vent plug (1) in flywheel vent hole (3).
 

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Ronmar

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Yes, you plug it so the bell housig with spinning TC, flywheel and ring gear doesnt fill with water. It having such a large seal and the starter bolted up, the odds that it will leak when submerged are high, so they added a convient drain and storage point for it.

Therenis a vent point at the top of the bell housing also, I think.mine has a plug in it though...
 
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coachgeo

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Yes, you plug it so the bell housig with spinning TC, flywheel and ring gear doesnt fill with water. It having such a large seal and the starter bolted up, the odds that it will leak when submerged are high, so they added a convient drain and storage point for it.

Therenis a vent point at the top of the bell housing also, I think.mine has a plug in it though...
that might be a good place to install a generic duck bill drain. Put it on your personal maintenance schedule to open its mouth to drain/check for break down of rubber. THis way you dont have to worry about forgetting to swap plug it when you end up deeper than you expected.
 

Ronmar

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that might be a good place to install a generic duck bill drain. Put it on your personal maintenance schedule to open its mouth to drain/check for break down of rubber. THis way you dont have to worry about forgetting to swap plug it when you end up deeper than you expected.
If you put a duck-bill on it, you could put air to the top fitting and blow it down remotely with a shot of air after a fording:)

My bell housing vent actually has a vent line attached, it was zip tied up into the mid structure I removed.

E94683CD-B3FB-4BC5-8EB9-C69B67DF0D84.jpeg

It does not make sense though that they would remote the bell housing vent and not remote the little wobble-cap air vent located on top of the transmission about 12” behind it… if you have water in your trans it most likely came from here.

C2EA1E60-1CCD-4877-8634-0CD088C6C527.jpeg
 

Lugnuts

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All it's running. I figure I will run another flush on that transmission when I fully service it in a couple of months/ Brakes freed up with a great POP. I thanked you before but not enough, Thank you all/ Lugnuts
I will also run another post when I see about "Waterproofing" the truck. Y'all gave me a lot of information and it looks like to do it properly one just has to check each item and see for sure if you have a breather tube and where it is routed. I also recall in years past there were snorkel style breather that when you went under water the check valve would get pushed up into a sealing position. I haven't thought or seen about those in years.
 

Guruman

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All it's running. I figure I will run another flush on that transmission when I fully service it in a couple of months/ Brakes freed up with a great POP. I thanked you before but not enough, Thank you all/ Lugnuts
I will also run another post when I see about "Waterproofing" the truck. Y'all gave me a lot of information and it looks like to do it properly one just has to check each item and see for sure if you have a breather tube and where it is routed. I also recall in years past there were snorkel style breather that when you went under water the check valve would get pushed up into a sealing position. I haven't thought or seen about those in years.
I'm using a Gortex vent for a water tank in my Jeep. It lets air pass in and out, but stops water/mud/debris from getting in.
 

coachgeo

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If you put a duck-bill on it, you could put air to the top fitting and blow it down remotely with a shot of air after a fording:)

My bell housing vent actually has a vent line attached, it was zip tied up into the mid structure I removed.

View attachment 882283

It does not make sense though that they would remote the bell housing vent and not remote the little wobble-cap air vent located on top of the transmission about 12” behind it… if you have water in your trans it most likely came from here.

View attachment 882284
honestly I've not understood why more offroad type folk have not gone to something like this. Dont know if they make these larger but guess one could put a few on a manifold to accommodate something larger than a jeep hub.



Or even a tank that works like a radiator overflow bottle but with air. Or a closed overflow bottle *system where you put a little vacuum on it at install giving room for things to pressurize into it when needed then drop back to slight vacuum state when not hot and working.

*not sure I like the closed system. if a leak is in it when in water the vacuum might suck water in. Granted once it sucks in enough air to equalize instead of being at vacuum..... then the system is negated but at least it is not "sucking "water in
 

coachgeo

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honestly I've not understood why more offroad type folk have not gone to something like this. ......
more discussion on this concept can be found in an old thread here

 
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