Best gen set for home backup.

[DD58]

Hey everyone. I’m looking to add on to my garage an extra storage room and while planning the foundation I figured I’d add a gen set to it. Now the garage is 3/4 into my hill of my property so the entire. Side wall on all 3 sides in concrete. It’s a separate addition to the garage so no worries about causing any I’ll effects on the garage or the house.

What’s the most reliable mil gen set to install to cover 15kw. I don’t have giving alittle over the 15kw my whole home should be around 12kw at full tilt in the summer. I’m currently using the well lest reliable mep831 to just cover the basics fridge and oil boiler. The foundation and walls will go in in the late spring and I want to install the genset before the roof goes on. Thanks for the help.


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[Evvy Fesler]

Do you plan on running the generator inside the new garage or are you thinking about pouring a slab outside? Typically, garage slabs are not part of the foundation so you've got me wondering. Also, your building department is likely to squack if they think you'll run a source of CO continuously inside the structure. As for 15kW... members take notice and correct me, but I believe this is 3-phase territory and you'd be better off going with 10-kW to get single phase, which is what a typical residence runs on. Members????

 

[Mullaney]

Do you plan on running the generator inside the new garage or are you thinking about pouring a slab outside? Typically, garage slabs are not part of the foundation so you've got me wondering. Also, your building department is likely to squack if they think you'll run a source of CO continuously inside the structure. As for 15kW... members take notice and correct me, but I believe this is 3-phase territory and you'd be better off going with 10-kW to get single phase, which is what a typical residence runs on. Members????

.
Homes are single phase.
At least here in the states.

Building the foundation with "air" between the foundation for the garage and the foundation for your generator room is a good plan. Helps isolate (vibrations) the generator from the rest of the house.

You don't want to die in the event of a carbon monoxide leak.
Separated building to help keep you alive

Might be really smart to also add a carbon monoxide detector or several to the house too.
They are very cheap insurance.

 

[DD58]

My garage currently is a single car, I can fit my 2014 4Runner all the way in with the doors closed and I have 5 1/2 foot on the driver side and 3 foot on the passenger side when the lawn equipment isn’t on the passenger side. Its sunk into my hill so the walls are 8 foot of concrete on 3 sides and a low pitch roof over. The outside hill tapers off at the front of the garage.
What I’m planning on is the same size next to the existing garage and adding an expansion off the back. The generator room will be pored totally separate from the we bay and have the proper intake and exhaust system to accommodate a running gen set. The exhaust will be vented through the roof. My concrete guy is drawing up the addition and hopefully in the coming weeks send me a copy to submit to the city for my permits.

The only reason I like the military equipment is it has clean power coming off for all the electronics and it’s well over built. Plus military stuff is way cooler!!! I could get away with a 10kw so it’s still a 110-220v unit. I don’t mind having the ability to have 3 phase. I’m not sure there than the mep803 or 802 to switch between the two. But 5k isn’t much.


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[Evvy Fesler]

.
Homes are single phase.
At least here in the states.

Building the foundation with "air" between the foundation for the garage and the foundation for your generator room is a good plan. Helps isolate (vibrations) the generator from the rest of the house.

You don't want to die in the event of a carbon monoxide leak.
Separated building to help keep you alive

Might be really smart to also add a carbon monoxide detector or several to the house too.
They are very cheap insurance.

Agree homes are 1P. That's what I meant, but I wasn't clear. I believe 15kW military generators are 3P so that's a mismatch in @DD58's requirements. Yes, one can use 3P, but he wants 15kW and a 15kW 3P will only deliver 10 kW using it in a 1P application. I strongly support CO detector mounted in accordance with manufacturer's directions. Many peeps think CO is heavier than air and mount them lower than higher... not true (someone argue with me and I'll give out a chemistry lesson!). LOL - I was once a licensed inspector. I'd go with a roof over a slab with no walls or open air walls, like louvers, if your climate is favorable. Mobile Electric Power (MEP) wasn't designed for indoor use.

 

[Evvy Fesler]

My garage currently is a single car, I can fit my 2014 4Runner all the way in with the doors closed and I have 5 1/2 foot on the driver side and 3 foot on the passenger side when the lawn equipment isn’t on the passenger side. Its sunk into my hill so the walls are 8 foot of concrete on 3 sides and a low pitch roof over. The outside hill tapers off at the front of the garage.
What I’m planning on is the same size next to the existing garage and adding an expansion off the back. The generator room will be pored totally separate from the we bay and have the proper intake and exhaust system to accommodate a running gen set. The exhaust will be vented through the roof. My concrete guy is drawing up the addition and hopefully in the coming weeks send me a copy to submit to the city for my permits.

The only reason I like the military equipment is it has clean power coming off for all the electronics and it’s well over built. Plus military stuff is way cooler!!! I could get away with a 10kw so it’s still a 110-220v unit. I don’t mind having the ability to have 3 phase. I’m not sure there than the mep803 or 802 to switch between the two. But 5k isn’t much.


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If you go with 3P you can consider a transformer in your slab square area just in case you decide you want to use one later on. Transformers won't make 1P out of 3P, but they will help balance the 3P generator. The 10kW MEP-803 is a nice unit. You won't miss the 2kW of the 12kW that you specified. Just cut something out to spare it.

 

[DieselAddict]

The question I would ask is what is your "base load"? How much power are you drawing 60% of the time? I doubt its anywhere near 10kw.

The reason I mention this is if you aren't loading these generators up enough you will have problems with them. I have a 10kw here at home and its WAY TOO BIG for my all electric home because my base load is only around 500w.

What that has meant for me is if I'm not running the heatpump I run the MEP831. If I need to run the 3T heatpump I can run the 803 or better yet, the 802.

Your generator will be happier if its run above 60% load the majority of the time. Otherwise you'll need to have time to put it on a load bank to clean out the exhaust. Over time running it under-loaded will cause the exhaust to clog up and gunk up the exhaust valves.

 

[DD58]

It all depends on the season. Summer is my biggest draw with the ac that 3kw alone. Electric range and electric dryer are my other big draws. So in the most demanding times I’d say 5-6kw in the fall maybe 3kw. All my lights are led at at 325w so that’s nothing. I see your point now.


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[DD58]

Agree homes are 1P. That's what I meant, but I wasn't clear. I believe 15kW military generators are 3P so that's a mismatch in @DD58's requirements. Yes, one can use 3P, but he wants 15kW and a 15kW 3P will only deliver 10 kW using it in a 1P application. I strongly support CO detector mounted in accordance with manufacturer's directions. Many peeps think CO is heavier than air and mount them lower than higher... not true (someone argue with me and I'll give out a chemistry lesson!). LOL - I was once a licensed inspector. I'd go with a roof over a slab with no walls or open air walls, like louvers, if your climate is favorable. Mobile Electric Power (MEP) wasn't designed for indoor use.

I would do a slab and have considered it. I just wanted a cool under ground area. As childish as it is. What will end my decision is the extra cost to poor that area.


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[DD58]

So let me ask this mep803 is that the answer best in reliability and I’m thinking 10kw is more than enough now.


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[Evvy Fesler]

I would do a slab and have considered it. I just wanted a cool under ground area. As childish as it is. What will end my decision is the extra cost to poor that area.


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Not childish... adult fun!

 

[DieselAddict]

An 802 or 803 are pretty much interchangeable in regards to reliability.

Based on the info provided so far I'd steer you towards an 802. It should cover you for the vast majority of your backup needs with more reliability than a 831 and burn less fuel than an 803.

 

[Light in the Dark]

Clearances to consider, no matter the machine.

 

[Light in the Dark]

The 803s on the whole are better machines from an ownership standpoint. The 4 cylinder is a smoother runner than the twin, and its slightly quieter to me. There is more room in the engine bay to perform maintenance, and its generally just easier to access everything. That said... I have an 802, because I just can't use what an 803 makes.

How much fuel do you anticipate keeping on hand, and for what duration are you looking to fuel a diesel box? Key details in the actual decision making process, because some folks want a diesel set for a weekend outage... some want sets for the end of the world and enough fuel to convection roast a chicken after 6 years of continuous running!

Whats your average outage? Do you really need to run your AC, or other high draw appliances during this time frame? Do you want life completely uninterrupted, or? Only things you can answer. The answers to the questions normally guide you to the right answer, instead of what your brain feels like it wants. Dollars and cents, diesel isn't getting cheaper... neither are these machines. Especially if they are starting to redirect equipment to the European front.

 

[Guyfang]

These are Minimum clearances.

 

[Evvy Fesler]

So let me ask this mep803 is that the answer best in reliability and I’m thinking 10kw is more than enough now.


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Ha! I'll stand back now and let the barrage fly! In my opinion, talking about the main generator, not the means to turn it. If the generator has a cast iron housing (stator) and runs within its parameters, particularly heat, it will last forever. It's just cast iron, steel laminates, copper wire and a bearing or two. Military generators are robust, but they don't always run within parameters. Tactical situations are what they are. Then they break and someone attempts a repair. This is where the problems arise... or maybe best said, where the opportunity to take something reliable and make it less reliable. My generator had a substandard part installed by a maintenance activity. That part failed and now I own a problem. I'll replace it with an OEM part.

Engines are not my area of expertise, but I do have command experience with all kinds of things powered by engines. They run great when maintained properly. They don't run at all sooner or later when not maintained properly. They too are subject to tactical conditions and good old fashioned wear and tear. Still, a diesel engine is not all that complex to run and maintain. They're highly reliable. Use quality lubricants and parts.


Hours of operation... I see a lot of this posted in the forums. You'll see posts, let me exaggerate to make a point, you'll see posts like, "Hooray, I just got the deal of the century. I bought a military generator with just 50-hours on the meter. The dumb knuckleheads DEMIL'ed a brand new generator." Yeah... it may be an exaggeration on my part, but the point is that the meter reflects run time on that set since it was last overhauled. It doesn't mean that the generator set has just 50 runtime hours over its lifetime.

Would I buy a military generator? Sure! In fact I did. It was a lemon... someone miss-wired its internals and put in a substandard diode board. The engine smokes worse than my Uncle Charlie ever did. It only had 1,000 hours on the meter, a mere babe in the woods. LOL - had I known it was a lemon, I definitely would have bought it! You may wonder why? Well... I did hydroelectric when I was in the Army Corps. The idea of a diesel powered generator set fascinates me - anything but water. I'm an electrical engineer and I love a problem just like a puzzler loves a puzzle. And... you said it first, I'm a child when it comes to big toys and I love all things military. I'll get it running and love every minute getting there. What I love the most? Everyone on this forum. They help with no strings attached.

I must end with what's fair is fair... Are all used military generators lemons? Absolutely not. Lemons appear to be rare and most get something that runs and serves them well.

I told you about my experience because I want to make one overarching point: Go into it with your eyes open. Know what you want and what's within your limits of mechanical and electrical capabilities. And then... stretch yourself! :0)

 

[Light in the Dark]

These are Minimum clearances.

Where is your sense of adventure??

 

[Guyfang]

Your load drives the train. Smaller the set, less fuel you use.

Fuel area is something to think about. Spill a little, and you will be smelling it a LONG time. Putting a drip pan under the set will save you problems later, should something floods out of the set. Fuel, oil or coolant.

The clearance diagram is the minimum, like I posted. I would not like to do any maintenance on a set in a room that small.

Also, don't forget, you may need to take it out at some point. I would put the set on a pedestal. Working on it is a PITA, when you are crawling around on hands and knees. But then you need a way to take it off the pedestal if you need to remove the set at some time. Better to set down and think about what you want, how you want, and how you can do it.

 

[Guyfang]

When you are 68 years old, sense of adventure has new meaning.

 

[Evvy Fesler]

When you are 68 years old, sense of adventure has new meaning.

And it redefines itself every year thereafter!