Cold starting a diesel engine

[kc8oye]

IS there any trick to be able to get a cold diesel engine to start w/o glow plugs?

my buddies son left the manual glow plug switch on and apparently has cooked all 8 glow plugs. the truck is currently situated where getting power to the block heater MIGHT be possible.. but how to get the thing to fire w/o glow plugs? Will starting fluid (ether) work on a diesel as it does with a gasoline engine? or am I gonna have stand knee deep in snow to change the glow plugs?

 

[maritimer]

DO NOT use ether in your cucv, you want pure silicone spray starting fluid, but change your glow plugs asap, remember to use the correct wellman 070's

 

[kc8oye]

I intend to change them... I just need to get the pig started and move it back onto the concrete to do the work :>

i've never heard of silicone spray starting fluid.. can you suggest any brand names I might be able to look for? (obviously, I can read cans once i'm at the store)

 

[maritimer]

just silicone spray, worse case put both batterys on seperate chargers on the boost setting and just crank an cran ktill it fires, if you got a couple of them little electric heaters fire one under the hood for about half an hour before hand to warm things up

 

[kc8oye]

ok.. sounds like a plan! another buddy of mine says to use a little shot of Tolulol (octane booster for gasoline engines)

i've only gotta do this once.. then it will have new glow plugs.

is it likely 30 minutes of on-time for glow plug would have cooked them?

I'm going to verify that the relay and plugs are working of course.. then once I know it's working on manual, i'm going to attempt to figure out why the controller was bypassed..

this CUCV came from the military (obviously) and then was used by a local police dept, and then sold to a private citizen who proceded to make a huge mess of everything electricaly.. and then my buddy got the truck , paying only scrap value for it, which I think was about $800 at the time :>
it came to him with two brand new alternators, and wouldn't charge either battery (someone VAOPRIZED both fusible links to the 24v alt, which also mean the 12v alt wasn't doing anything either)
fixed those.. ran like a champ.. till his son left the glow plugs on.. DOH! hehe

makes an awesome snow plow truck, small, nimble, torque out the yin-yang...

 

[motormayhem]

just silicone spray, worse case put both batterys on seperate chargers on the boost setting and just crank an cran ktill it fires, if you got a couple of them little electric heaters fire one under the hood for about half an hour before hand to warm things up

Don't forget to give the starter a break, or you'll burn it up too.

 

[allrevup]

If your heat/power source is insufitient or to far. OLD TIMERS with a lot "CAUTION AND PRECOUTIONS" placed HOT COALS on a metal sheet under the engines in extreme conditions.

 

[JohnnyReb]

DO NOT use ether in your cucv, you want pure silicone spray starting fluid, but change your glow plugs asap, remember to use the correct wellman 070's

Just curious.... Have started alot of diesels with starting fluid... I prefer not to use unless absolutely necessary...

Is the use of silcone spray sometime special with the CUCV or recommended for all diesels? What is the factual basis for this?

Thanks

 

[kc8oye]

I haven't seen where this truck is parked yet.. but they're talking about it beeing in the upper 40's saturday.. hopefully by sunday some of the snow will be gone and she'll fire :>
or it's not the glow plugs at all *Crossing fingers* lol

 

[doghead]

Change the glow-plugs where the truck is now, then start it. It will take less time to change the gp's than it will to start it without them working. Continual cranking with out any aids(gp's or spray) will not make it start, it will kill your batteries and starter though. It will not start at 40F without the gp's working either. Fix your problem, don't work around it. It

Maritimer, have you actually used silicone spray to start a 6.2 with no glow-plugs?

 

[M543A2]

A real help is to open up the intake in a convenient place and get warm air going into it while cranking the engine. The best warm air source is an electric heat stripper gun, next is a propane or acetylene torch and for the worriers and attorneys, the usual fire possibility warnings. A careful person can use a torch with no problem. Hold it far enough away from the intake opening that the hot air gets there, but not the flame. Works every time for us, no ether needed.
Regards Marti

 

[Armada]

I've used WD-40 before to start a 6.2l when the glow plugs were cooked. If you use starting fluid make sure NONE of the glow plugs are working. Introducing ether to even 1 hot tip will cause you greater problems than you already have. Also, if you have the older type glow plugs (AC13g's), they will more than likely be blistered and will not come out. Hope you don't have them. This is why it's better to have the glow plugs working with the factory controller so they cycle properly. Accidents happen with a manual switch. Good luck.

 

[hobie237]

WD40 works well as a starting fluid because it helps provide lubrication. Ether works just as well though.

What type of starting fluid you use isn't really relevant, it's the automatic glow plugs that are the issue. Starting fluid hitting a hot glow plug will explode, regardless of piston position and/or motion, and can create extremely high cylinder pressures that, in a worst case, can send a cylinder head flying.

So, just make sure the glow plugs aren't firing. Pull out the card, or disconnect the relay, or unplug them all- just make absolutely sure they're not doing anything. Then use your choice of starting fluid. Personally I use ether most of the time, because I keep it on hand for lawnmowers.

 

[doghead]

He should have a push button(momentary on) switch, a constant on switch on the GP's is just asking for trouble.

The reason I asked Maritimer about the silicone was, I keep reading peoples "suggestions", and it seems most of the time, the advice given is "I read it on the Internet" and not "real personal experience".

I believe it's the propellant in the silicone that actually aid in starting and not the fluid itself. I would never spray anything into an engine without disabling the gp'd first. and don't use ether on a hot engine, ever. Most ether spray have lubricants in them to help aid in cyl washing. It's the vapor not the liquid you want.

 

[JohnnyReb]

He should have a push button(momentary on) switch, a constant on switch on the GP's is just asking for trouble.

The reason I asked Maritimer about the silicone was, I keep reading peoples "suggestions", and it seems most of the time, the advice given is "I read it on the Internet" and not "real personal experience".

I believe it's the propellant in the silicone that actually aid in starting and not the fluid itself. I would never spray anything into an engine without disabling the gp'd first. and don't use ether on a hot engine, ever. Most ether spray have lubricants in them to help aid in cyl washing. It's the vapor not the liquid you want.

That was my point DH, if silcone spray is necessary for the 6.2 or just as good as starter fluid.... I want to know.... Also not interested in google info. That is why I stated that I had used SF for many years and had personal experience.

One note of experience...... ALWAYS take out the air cleaner and apply SF directly to the air intake. I have PERSONALLY seen air filters become soaked with SF and/or have little pockets of fumes be trapped in the breather housing...... After the engine is started and starts sucking air via the breather housing the fumes will be pulled into the engine. It will starting racing and the only hope is to get the breather...air cleaner off before it redlines....

 

[tjcouch]

If you think we have it bad - watch this: [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w4MjC1Ywofg&feature=related[/media]

 

[JohnnyReb]

If you think we have it bad - watch this: [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w4MjC1Ywofg&feature=related[/media]

That is really interesting, thanks for the video. The beginning of it reminds me of starting the big old CAT diesels with a pony motor...

 

[twright]

The TM manual no more than 2 min.so 30 min. cooked them

 

[Michael]

The TM would be referring to 13G plugs, 60G and 070 are current limiting and should last longer but 30 min is asking a lot of them.

WD 40 used to work because of methane gas in the propellant. The current product will not work because the propellant has been changed. I am guessing silicon spray works the same way.

I have used just the slightest whiff of ether with good results but wouldn't make a habit of it.

 

[mboswell]

i have used regular cheap starting fluid - mind you just a little spray is all that is needed, but it will get it cranked. I would first crank it over for 15-20 seconds to get oil around in the engine before doing the ether. I've done this a few times before on other diesels and recently on the m1008 I have. Not had any later issues from it, but you never know. In a pinch when the glow plug system fails this at least will usually work.

That said I agree with Doghead - The best thing for you to do is to change out the glow plugs right where the truck is. They are pretty easy to get to - if that is the problem.