002 or 003 for 3.5 Ton A/C Unit?

[Olympus]

Does anyone know anything about those 7KW Kubota generator/light towers? They look to be military. They are built inside a paneled trailer with 4 wheels. The trailer is not meant for being pulled on the road though.

Here is one local to me: http://stlouis.craigslist.org/grd/4625596265.html

They tend to run about $300-$500 less than a 003a. They are liquid cooled Kubota diesel engines with Kohler gen heads.

 

[Isaac-1]

These are roughly comparable in output to the MEP-002a, I think the generator model may be Kohler 7CCE commercial series unit built in the 1990's. From what I have researched on this style light tower in the past is that most are 1970's production originally equipped with gasoline generators which were retrofitted with Kohler diesel (mostly 10KW 10CCE's, this may be a model 7CC or 7CM and I think are single phase only brushless generator ends) as part of a life extension program much like the repowering of the MEP-016C with a Yanmar diesel turning it into the MEP-016D. Personally I have sworn I would never buy another Kubota diesel engine after owning a couple due to their insanely overpriced parts and supplies (think $20 per quart special hydraulic transmission fluid, or $700 PTO universal joint).

p.s. for pdf of generator service manual see http://www.fileswap.com/dl/ycqcsKgM8/TP5595_7-10_cco_serv.pdf.html use "slow" download for free access it appears to use a brush type exciter, not brushless after all

 

[Olympus]

Thanks for the info. Just wanted to consider other options. Worried about buying an MEP unit and having problems with it. I'm not much of a mechanic and don't know if anyone in my area could even work on one. At least with the Kubota engine, I know I could at least get service at a dealership even if it was expensive.

And the 12v vs 24v battery system is a plus for me as well as being liquid cooled, it should be more quiet than the MEP. I was thinking that I would use the gen to power a small workshop I have to do woodworking. I read that it takes 4 hours to recharge the batteries on the MEP units and I would not be working in my shop that long. So I'd constantly be charging those batteries.

I actually like that the MEP units are on skids as that eliminates a quick theft and I have a tractor with a bucket and forks that I can use to move them around. But I noticed that the empty weight of the 003 is just about max lift for my loader, so I think the 003 is definitely out of the running. It was on the high side of my budget anyway and then I'd have to buy or have a trailer built to move it around.

 

[Isaac-1]

The slow charge rate on the MEP-002 can be overcome with the use of a Solargizer 24V solar charger (some are already equipped with one). While you are likely to get a bit better commercial support on the Kohler don't expect it to be great, these are 20 year old designs and not a popular model at that, chances are most Kohler generator repairmen would have never seen one before, and most Kubota mechanics would have no idea about potential generator specific concerns.

 

[Olympus]

After talking to some people and reading through the forum, now I'm a little concerned the MEPs may not be for me. I'm not mechanically inclined and have zero electrical knowledge. I'm afraid now that I may get an MEP that either has or develops issues that I can't fix and I would have no local support in which to pay to have it fixed.

I love the idea of having a gen big enough to run my whole house and that would outlast me, but people keep asking me if that's really necessary. People want to know why I want a gen big enough to run my central air when I could just buy a small window unit and put it in the bedroom and use a much smaller size gen.

They want to know why I would buy an old military gen with countless "unknowns" when I could buy a brand new 3600rpm diesel for the same money and probably have a warranty and service.

I make the argument that the MEPs are better built units, operate at lower rpms, and are built to run continously for hours and hours. Their reply is why does that matter to me when I'd likely never put more than 100 to 200 hours on a unit in my life anyway.

I'm just so dang conflicted because I see points to both sides. An MEP is big gamble, especially for someone who couldn't troubleshoot or repair any issues that come up.

 

[DieselAddict]

If you aren't one to work on your own stuff then I would agree that a MEP isn't for you.

You can also get one of the Honda inverter based generators and enjoy low noise and low fuel consumption with gasoline. I have two of them and they are my first choice for lower power needs. One has over 2000 hours on it and still runs perfect.

If you can get by with 120v I would recommend buying 2 EU2000s. You can connect them together and run in parallel for larger loads such as window AC units. Depending on its size of the AC you may be able to run it off of a single EU2000. I run my camper AC on an EU3000 with no problem (13kbtu). A pair of EU2000s would also run it easily with more total power available.

During the ice storm we had in March of this year I ran the fridge, TV and computers on the EU1000. I burned about 1.5gal of gas PER DAY. My neighbor burned 15 gal per day on his large gas generator. If I had owned my MEP003 at the time I would have run it some and used it to heat and pump the water. I had to make due with less but survived it just fine. We were without power for about a week.

There are also other options depending on what your power goals are. I have solar power in my workshop. For about $1000 I installed a solar pannel, inverter, and batteries. I'm not out there every day so if it takes a few days to recharge the batteries I'm OK with that. I suspect that setup could easily run my fridge during the day if the power was out. Just yesterday I sharpened a few mower blades with the bench grinder and had the music playing while I tinkered in the yard. That barely knocked the surface charge off the batteries.

Anyway, if a MEP isn't for you there are still options that are quiet, fuel efficient, and won't break the bank.

 

[Olympus]

I think diesel is the key factor for me. I keep 100 gallons on hand at all times and have access to just about 5000 gallons at any time. And since it comes from my family's farm, they let me have all I want for free. So fuel economy isn't super important. But being diesel is important.

 

[Ray70]

I'd agree too. You need a fairly good mechanical and electrical aptitude to run these generators safely and reliably and you definitely don't want to depend on a hired hand to maintain or repair it for you. It sounds like you have a 3500W gas unit, so I assume you are at least comfortable enough to hook up and run a generator in an emergency. You should probably decide exactly what you absolutely have to run in an emergency. ( fridge, lights, heat etc. ) and size a generator accordingly. Then just decide if you want gas or diesel. By the sound of your farm, you'd probably be better off with a diesel, if you go with something large enough to be available in diesel. I think you can get other 1800 RPM quiet diesels for a fairly reasonable price. It will cost more than a gas model but it will fit your situation better. It will cost more than the MEP lineup and not be as stout a machine, but it will be new, under warranty, easier to run and safer for someone with less electrical and mechanical knowledge.

 

[DieselAddict]

For a diesel unit in the 5000-7500w range budget $4500-$8000. That will get you a new unit with a warranty. Below the 5kw range you get into an area where I wouldn't recommend a diesel at all. I don't think they are as well made or reliable. In my opinion that is because no one wants to spend $3500 for a well made 4kw diesel generator when you can buy a gasser of a similar size for $600.

I would suggest researching the cost of repairs for Kubota engines. They tend to be more expensive to repair if something breaks outside of the warranty.

I know you want diesel but I would offer this.. If you were to buy 2 EU2000 generators assuming that you could get by with about 3.5kw at 120v that would run you under $2k for the generators and the parallel kit. You could buy a lot of gasoline for the $2500 you would save over the lower priced but decent diesel generators.

Consider what that free diesel fuel could really cost you.

 

[Olympus]

Diesel is definitely the way I'll be going. And I want to run as much as I possibly can. Yes, I'm comfortable hooking up a portable gen with the 4 prong plug. Most of the other diesel gens I'm seeing are 6500 to 7500W and I'm assuming that's surge watts since they are residential/homeowner units.

 

[Olympus]

I'm thinking that in the event of a storm or power outage, gas will be hard to find and there will be lots of other people trying to get it also. A diesel would take advantage of my stockpile and there will be fewer people trying to buy diesel than gas.

I won't need to be driving to an area that has power to refill gas cans every day or so along with hundreds of other people. With any luck, the 100 gallons that I have might be enough to last the entire time we might be out of power.

 

[DieselAddict]

Sounds reasonable.

Whatever you do don't buy one of those cheap chinese diesel generators. They are total crap.

 

[rosco]

I'm aware of all the pros & cons BUT when its crunch time, the 003 is going to shine!

 

[Olympus]

There's no question that the 003 will outperform most every other unit. The concern is whether I'll be able to maintain it up to the point when the times comes for me go use it. It's not going to shine much at all if it has a problem that I can't fix.

 

[DieselAddict]

Thats a tough question that we can't answer for you.

If you read the forum here you'll see what the common failures and how to fix them. I've not seen much here that a decent handyman can't take care of with regular tools.

Even if you buy a new one it too can break. The warranty periods are 1 to 5 years for the various parts. Then there is the question about the service network itself. Can you get service when you need it? A new generator waiting to be fixed does you no good either. Even if it is under warranty.

The main thing regardless of what you get is to run it regularly under a reasonable load. Watch oil levels and on occasion have an oil analysis done. That can help you see any engine issues before they cause a failure. Open covers and make sure you don't see evidence of arcing or heating of connectors. Make sure critters aren't making their homes in any of the nooks or crannies. These are simple but important things to keep whatever generator you buy running.

In the case of a MEP in my opinion the weakest link due to their age are the switches, relays, and VR board. Running it regularly with a load is the thing to do so you see a problem coming.

The MEPs are a bit more complicated with their wiring than a civilian generator will be. If that is a concern it can be simplified with some effort. Mechanically they are very robust. Parts for the 003 and 002 engines will become harder to find as those engines move more into history. Buy a few of the right spares now and you'll be good to go for a long time.

Personally I feel more comfortable with my MEP and this forum than I would buying many of the commercially available generators out there.

 

[Olympus]

Another option someone pointed out to me was that I might consider a pto generator. I can get a 12 kw or 13 kw for about $1500 and just use it on the back of my tractor. Problem with that is I'd probably be needing to use my tractor in the event that power went out, either for snow and ice removal or storm damage.

 

[Isaac-1]

They want to know why I would buy an old military gen with countless "unknowns" when I could buy a brand new 3600rpm diesel for the same money and probably have a warranty and service.

I make the argument that the MEPs are better built units, operate at lower rpms, and are built to run continously for hours and hours. Their reply is why does that matter to me when I'd likely never put more than 100 to 200 hours on a unit in my life anyway.

I'm just so dang conflicted because I see points to both sides. An MEP is big gamble, especially for someone who couldn't troubleshoot or repair any issues that come up.

The problem with so many newer commercial generators is that they are JUNK, and that warranty means nothing if they go out 4 hours into a 7 day power outage since the repair man likely will not get there for two months. This is not to say that there are not good newer diesel generators, just expect to pay upwards for $5000 for a lightly used example and well over $10,000 new.

 

[Ray70]

Your post indicates you have natural gas available, anyone here have any experience with natural gas back-up systems?
Probably equally costly to a new diesel, and still need professional installation and service, but just throwing it out there if you feel an MEP is out of your league....
You'd be surprised what an 002A can handle. Maybe you should take a shot with one? Like DA said, there are a lot of knowledgeable guys here waiting to help others. I bet you'll be surprised just how much mechanical ability you really do have once you start messing with a green monster.... and MEP's are probably much simpler to work on than a new civilian model loaded with electronics. Not to mention you could by 10 MEP's for the same price as a good civilian unit.... Some times you can score a good running model off CL or ebay for a little more than GL, just try to find one you can pick up locally to avoid shipping costs!

 

[Olympus]

I've looked into the standby units and they are more than I want to spend. Looking at close to $10k for everything done and ready to go.

 

[jamawieb]

Olympus, have you considered just using window units instead of running the central air. You can pick up a couple of used window units cheap and the mep-002a will run a couple without a problem and run whatever else you want.