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74M35A2

Well-known member
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Livonia, MI
Degreased the trans, drained the oil, and pulled the SAE #1 clutch housing with mechanical linkage off. Will soon install the SAE #2 clutch housing with hydraulic release. Want to size up the clutch and flywheel on back of the engine before final assembly. Supplied shop air into the feed hose, and cycled the range selector and splitter valves, both responded with a deep mechanical thud inside, indicating something was moving/shifting inside as expected.

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74M35A2

Well-known member
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Location
Livonia, MI
Back to this. Pulled 6 bolt PTO off, purchased 6 bolt PTO cover. Traded some stuff around for an 8 bolt PTO and pump with dump bed valve on it. Need to remove bolt-on dump valve portion and add a simple output hose connection, or change out pump for conventional one. The PTO I acquired has a 6-to-8 bolt adapter plate on it. The RR trans has both 6 bolt side, and 8 bolt bottom PTO provisions. I don't think I will be able to use the side one, so I am protecting to use the bottom one, but we'll see once in place. Not putting either on until engine/trans is in the truck and we see what we have room for. Worst case, will use engine belt driven pump, or consider a wrecker T-case with a PTO drive from there?

Otherwise nothing exciting yet, replaced all the large clutch housing lock washers since some of them broke in half when loosened. Will soon paint trans, then remove shift lever and tower to prepare for install. Need to remove trans output yolk and get same type as existing driveshaft U-joint on the truck. Test fitting new SAE #2 clutch housing now, then will attach to trans. Want to reseal trans front input shaft. Does not look like a seal present in the Road Ranger parts diagram (model RTO-12513), if anybody has experience with these input shafts and how they seal, it would be appreciated. Maybe there is no oil in that area and I am making something out of nothing?
 
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jcappeljr

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Good work takes time....Your operation is a lot of trial and error...It will be worth it when your done..
 

Bandit02

New member
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Blind Bay, BC
There's no actual lip seal on those Eaton Fuller trans. There's a gasket behind the plate just make sure to line up the oil passage hole for the bearing that the input shaft goes into or it will have a bad day.
 

74M35A2

Well-known member
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Location
Livonia, MI
Thanks. I'll yank the input shaft retainer and reseal it then just to make sure it doesn't leak.

Sizing up pilot bearings, and clutch housing-to-flywheel housing bolts.

I am going to order an old 70's type rear support for it. Just scares me with that much weight hanging off an SAE #2 clutch housing and aluminum engine side flywheel housing.

IMG_3986.jpg IMG_3989.JPG
 
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grendel

Member
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Derry, NH
Thanks. I'll yank the input shaft retainer and reseal it then just to make sure it doesn't leak.

Sizing up pilot bearings, and clutch housing-to-flywheel housing bolts.

I am going to order an old 70's type rear support for it. Just scares me with that much weight hanging off an SAE #2 clutch housing and aluminum engine side flywheel housing.

View attachment 697812 View attachment 697825
Looks familiar... get the spring pockets for the frame rails.
 

74M35A2

Well-known member
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Location
Livonia, MI
I'm sitting in my chair with a plunger stuck to the floor, practicing shifting (Jbulach credit). If I ever get it figured out, I'll trade out the shift knob for something a little more difficult to understand, like this:

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Bandit02

New member
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I wouldn't worry about the weight. All the years I worked at Freightliner I never seen a single truck with a broken/cracked bellhousing because of the weight on the trans, includes the logging trucks and they bounce hard on those wash board roads. They just hanged off the back.
 

74M35A2

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Location
Livonia, MI
Does the situation still hold true if using a smaller SAE #2 setup and aluminum flywheel housing? Cast iron clutch housing on trans.
 

red

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Eagle Mountain/Utah
I've encountered a handful that have damaged the bellhousing/adapter that were run without the rear mount. Most on oilfield winch trucks and 1 on a dump truck. Never on a mostly pavement driven truck. There's a reason the rear mount is there and recommended for use with offroad driven trucks.
 

simp5782

Feo, Fuerte y Formal
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Does the situation still hold true if using a smaller SAE #2 setup and aluminum flywheel housing? Cast iron clutch housing on trans.
The SAE 1 bellhousing I have is aluminum with the CAT weighing almost 1600lbs The stock transmission rear mount in the M920s is just sitting on the frame. Not bolted down. Not much for support as it was flimsy steel with an arch.. When I bolted this thing up it was level the whole way the rear mount bushings I added didn't even raise it at all.

If the rear mount on the Allison fails though it will wear the rear output bushing out.
 

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74M35A2

Well-known member
4,145
330
83
Location
Livonia, MI
The one for a Road Ranger is about the same. I'm going to add it, just to be safe given aluminum fly housing and SAE 2.
 

74M35A2

Well-known member
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330
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Location
Livonia, MI
Did some test fits last night. Finally have right bolt lengths for clutch pressure plate and clutch housing. I wanted a lot of thread engagement for both. All bolts are hardened. Did the recommended 2 pressure plate install dowels also. These go top 2 holes, then slide plate on.
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74M35A2

Well-known member
4,145
330
83
Location
Livonia, MI
Amazing how much silly stuff can slow a project down. Could not find a Timken pilot bearing with Viton seals. Bearing ID 306 or 6306. 306VV is the Viton sealed bearing I am after. Timken offers it with rubber or steel seals. The rubber is low temp, the steel is not waterproof. Lot's of warnings out there to use Viton only now with more modern high output engines. The ISL is squeezed hard for power, so it probably runs hot. So, I ordered a Chinese bearing with Viton seals, and the Timken rubber one. I will pull the seals from the Timken one, flush the low temp grease out, and repack it with high temp grease, and press the Viton seals into it. Rubber is supposed to be good to 200F or so, and the Viton 400F or such. I do not want to pull this SOB trans out once in for some stupid pilot bearing noise, and I don't want to be scared to drive it through water. UGH !!!

bearing1.jpg bearing2.jpg

Ordered clutch housing clutch inspection port cover with release bearing grease tube extension.


Clutch Cover.jpg
 
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74M35A2

Well-known member
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330
83
Location
Livonia, MI
Well, I won't be the first, but I will have more gears and almost twice the engine power into it. And a shorter lever!

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74M35A2

Well-known member
4,145
330
83
Location
Livonia, MI
I called him today around noon, but no answer, texted him also. Possibly does not answer unknown numbers, I don't. Since he does this for $, he may not share info? I'm doing this for myself in this case, as would most anybody else on this board I would think.

Matt, if you are there, can you share any notes or lessons learned for those that want to do it to their own trucks. I'm not on FB, so I can't check any info that may be posted there. Any dual counter-shaft trans should be about the same. I think I'm all set, but questions would be:

-What did you do for clutch/flywheel/flywheel housing, we believe the flywheel housing on the stock a2 to be 1" longer for the Allison trans, so may not work with manual trans input shaft and clutch?
-If changed to conventional 5" depth flywheel housing, did it alter any engine mounting alignment?
-How was clutch actuation accomplished? I'm going hydraulic, but if you did mechanical, what did you use for pedal?
-Where did the shift lever come through the floor at? Require any special bending to clear the dash?
-Did you need to swap rear output yolk, and lengthen the driveshaft slightly?
-How was front axle prop shaft clearance to trans?

I'll learn all this soon regardless. I had to use the crazy dish type flywheel to accommodate the dual disc clutch, to handle the ISL 1250ft-lb of torque. The stock mil 6CTA8.3L is like half of that, and you can otherwise use an easier to obtain and lower cost conventional single plate clutch setup. I chose hydraulic clutch release for ease of installation, plus an air assist option to make the pedal feel like a 5 speed Toyota Corolla. Once good, you only use the clutch pedal to get rolling anyway.

Thanks.
 
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