816 Jakes and Turbo !!!!

[wcuhillbilly]

So no dice on the pt pump book. I called the shop that I use for my pump rebuild and they are hunting as we speak.

Any chance that you have the pt pump code?

Will look and see what I can come up with, the NTC350 is on my bench (in 8 or 10 peices) and the NHC250 is over the river and through the snow, but not quite to grandmas house.......

 

[dieslesaint]

Well, lock the diffs and pull cable till ya get there lol.

 

[Jakelc15]

Yours is probably the same as mine. Fuel pump code 3135 and pump part number 3005728

 

[dieslesaint]

Pump shop just called back, no luck on the engine SN. Will call Cummins in the am.

 

[wcuhillbilly]

Pump shop just called back, no luck on the engine SN. Will call Cummins in the am.

i have run the 250 number through Cummins before and they have no record of it. Thus it was something proprietary to the contractor that was rebuilding them for the military.. I forget the specs on the tag, but its some offshoot of Cummins under a Mil contract.

 

[dieslesaint]

OK, will keep looking.

 

[wcuhillbilly]

Yours is probably the same as mine. Fuel pump code 3135 and pump part number 3005728

Likely it is, the 250 pumps dont vary much. the PT pumps dont vary much either, as they were essentually just a giant fuel lift pump to maintain pressure to the valve/cam timed injection.

 

[wcuhillbilly]

Ok, couldnt see the number very well on the 250 as the throttle trave nuts were in the way but i think i got it all. Line one is NHC -6C08208527 line two is 3135-C FP153

The scrap NTC 350 pump is a mess as it was stamped over. Line one os ???0 14835 10215557 line two is AFC 10 ?70 (i think as 400 was stamped over) 21?C with 2944 stamped over

 

[dieslesaint]

OK the stamp over is from the pump being rebuilt with a different spec. I'll pass on the pump info to Cummins in the am.

 

[Jakelc15]

I don't know if this will help or just add to the confusion but Cummins superseded cpl26 with cpl170 some years ago. Maybe they have more info for that cpl.

Need to put a guage on that pump and see what it's putting out. Should be around 160 psi stock. If the gear pump is wore out and it can't keep up, they are easy to replace. The gear is a 3/4 RH. Also a sign of the pump going bad is cranking a long time to build enough pressure to start the engine. I'd drive it with a guage before condemning the pt unit. It will also show where the governor is set to defuel.

 

[wcuhillbilly]

I don't know if this will help or just add to the confusion but Cummins superseded cpl26 with cpl170 some years ago. Maybe they have more info for that cpl.

Need to put a guage on that pump and see what it's putting out. Should be around 160 psi stock. If the gear pump is wore out and it can't keep up, they are easy to replace. The gear is a 3/4 RH. Also a sign of the pump going bad is cranking a long time to build enough pressure to start the engine. I'd drive it with a guage before condemning the pt unit. It will also show where the governor is set to defuel.

Yup, thats pretty much whats going on. Long cranks unless its been run or really hot weather. I will put a gauge on it when nature cooperates but at this time of year it can sit for a little longer

 

[Jakelc15]

Got that truck ready for this winter? I've been picking up Jake brake parts when I find them. Hope to get that done soon. Was just reading through your install again to see of I forgot anything!

 

[wcuhillbilly]

Well,,, sorta ready for winter,, blew the CV on the crane last nite. So the debacle begins,,, do I convert to the 936 hydraulic system and fabb up a mount for the drive off the existing power divider output? Re invent the existing CV shaft with agg PTO parts? get a new CV shaft for $2000 because its made of "Unobtainium"? or cry in my cheerios.........
Need to install an ether injection system, as it doesnt like to start below 60*F. Looking at installing an Eaton 10spd in the coming year, thus the T case and power divider will have to be moved back and ultimately I would like to go hydraulic for the ease of use.
The Jake has helped me immensly on the heavy hauls locally here with the short steep grades hauling my little dozer, foundation pilings, etc.
I am still running Jakes on the rear heads, as I have yet to fabbricate a Radiator support bracket off the front head compensating for the Jake deck height differance.
I passed up a whole log truck chassis with a cummins and 25B Jakes about a month ago, went for $30 at an auction, only because I didnt have time to strip it.,,, the 25B are better than my 25A, and the ultimate seem to be the 425 Jakes.
I have yet to wire up the switch for the PT pump, and continue to just reach over and turn it on and off when needed, and jockey between stage 2 and 3.
Either way,,,, I LOVE MY JAKES, and the Turbo is a life saver too.. now just need to get that 10spd in and road test....

 

[Jakelc15]

The 10 speed would be a great help. You could run a PTO off it and convert it all to hydraulic.
I'm glad to hear the Jakes work well. That makes me feel better about the $ spent and work to be done.

What is the hard part to find in the shaft? I have a shop I deal with at work to have PTO shafts made. They may be able to help.
Your truck should start without ether down to below freezing. I have over fuelled the crap out of mine and it still starts on its own at 30°. Below that I better have the block heater plugged in or it's a fight.

 

[red]

The crane PTO shaft uses CV joints that are discontinued

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

 

[73m819]

The 10 spd if not a older spicer, there is a good chance it will not clear the front driveshaft on the left and the winch pto will not fit on the right, I have been looking for a 8 or 10 spd spicer for my 819, I found a older 16 spd spicer but that would be WAY over kill, also about 36,000 lbs is awful hard on a single disk clutch, that is another thing that I have been looking for, a double disk clutch to replace my single.

As far as the cv joint goes, just go agg., or just make a close fitting double single u-joint joint, I do not see the need for a must have cv joint, I see a lot of ways to work around that issue, just because the military did it does not mean that there is not a simpler way to get the same results .

 

[wcuhillbilly]

The 10 spd if not a older spicer, there is a good chance it will not clear the front driveshaft on the left and the winch pto will not fit on the right, I have been looking for a 8 or 10 spd spicer for my 819, I found a older 16 spd spicer but that would be WAY over kill, also about 36,000 lbs is awful hard on a single disk clutch, that is another thing that I have been looking for, a double disk clutch to replace my single.

As far as the cv joint goes, just go agg., or just make a close fitting double single u-joint joint, I do not see the need for a must have cv joint, I see a lot of ways to work around that issue, just because the military did it does not mean that there is not a simpler way to get the same results .

yes the front driveshaft will have to go if the Eaton goes in, Someone mentioned a two peice shaft with a carrier bearing off a,,,,, 921a2 ????? that I would have to find in order to rout around the twin countershaft Eaton. and the front PTO shaft for the winch would have to be converted to Hydraulic. The T case can be moved back and or swapped out for the 939 version air shift, which would be nice considering the trans would be air.
Dropping the extension housings on the power divider and going with U joints, or better yet a hydraulic setup would aid in the Eaton install as the T case has to be moved back about 8-10" to allow for the Eaton. 10spds do not have the extra housing on the rear like 13,15,18spds do. thus a little shorter. I have a 13 laying here which would be nice,,,,,, but its hooked to a detriot and I have no idea of its condition as its been in a barn for 30 years.

 

[red]

I have a front driveshaft from a m939 series truck available, they all have the carrier bearing

 

[wcuhillbilly]

Thanks Red,
Reading back over this thread to update some testing yesterday. IF the 10 goes in soon- aka 2018 then I will be looking for a 939 shaft to torture myself with.

UPDATE:::: I got my RPM back.... had to seal up the crane rotary motor as the bolts on the top cover backed out and was leaking all over the place. Not bad to pull off, real pain in the rear to reach in and work on. Note the cap plate has a recess that cups the internal roller bearing for the vertical shaft, So it will be tough to pull/pry up but the tolerances are loose enough to allow you to pop it off and re seal it,, then gently thump it back down and re tighten the bolts.

Secondly,,, Im back to 2300rpm...... Dumped the primer pump elbow on the bottom of the PT pump, in hopes of eliminating an air leak via the primer pump.... seems to have worked, Next I pulled the filter in the top of the PT pump to clean it for kicks and giggles... actually wasn't bad, but I did find that the cap wasn't really tight like I thought it should be... With the big intake it is a pain to tighten. Next I have been suspicious of the crane governor for some time as to causing my tach out problems.... Sure enough, I pulled the cap off the governor adjust and backed the allan screw under it off and re routed the spring on the arm to fully pull the governor off, and tested it with a couple revs,,, Tach out at 2300 RPM and no bucking.... WHOO HOO!!!!! Now to re install the 2nd dual line for the rear and see what happens......

Being that all the trouble started with the install of the dual line mod,,, I will still have the PT pump rebuilt, but Im just happy to have it taching out normal again.

 

[red]

Nice to hear that you're workin on it again and that the RPM's are back.