California Bobbed Deuce, legality?

[harmoniums]

Can I get away with a standard drivers license now that its only two axles?
Is it still possible to register it as a CA historic vehicle?
Does the brake system need to be inspected by a DMV person?

 

[dittle]

Can I get away with a standard drivers license now that its only two axles?
Is it still possible to register it as a CA historic vehicle?
Does the brake system need to be inspected by a DMV person?

I don't see how it would qualify as historic as it is not meeting original manufacturer's specifications with one axle missing. If there isn't that requirement then you may have luck however.

 

[yellobronc]

Yes

Mabye, can CA prove that the military NEVER built a 4WD Duece? Can they Prove they were never intended to be used as sleeping, cooking, etc inside? Hmmm.....

No

100dollarman.com has built many of these, mabye he will chime in.

 

[harmoniums]

Yes


100dollarman.com has built many of these, mabye he will chime in.

Yeah I talked to him yesterday (I'm going to have him do the work) he seesm to think its a gray area

 

[DUG]

Ask Phil (BarneysZoo). His bobber is running historic plates.

 

[Abert]

Post #117 in "Another way to Bob a Deuce" has the info you seek

 

[DUG]

Post #117 in "Another way to Bob a Deuce" has the info you seek

He means : http://www.steelsoldiers.com/deuce-modification-hot-rodding/44800-another-way-bob-deuce-12.html

 

[AaronHorrocks]

Can I get away with a standard drivers license now that its only two axles?
Why do you think having 3 axles is an issue in california? You're still under a HISTORICAL VEHICLE exception. I know that I couldn't keep Classic Car insurance if I change out the engine in my M38A1 to something more powerful. I've been driving my 5 Ton Tractor Truck for three years with only one minor hold up when I was getting on base. They delaid me two hours only to find out that I can drive my 3-axle 5 Ton, as a historical vehicle, as long as I'm not towing a (semi) trailer. (They told me "ANY" trailer, which I'm 100% sure they're wrong about. Any semi trailer, sure.. For that I'd need a Non-Commercial Class A, - which I already have a learners permit for!)

Is it still possible to register it as a CA historic vehicle?
It has to meet the qualifications, which most deuces do. If it's 25 years old? You're probably good. If you think a bobbed deuce is a Historical Vehicle, then do you think a "rat-rod" is? Why or why not?

Does the brake system need to be inspected by a DMV person?
No, the brakes are hydrolic. The fact is uses an air system to assist the brakes is not important. The M series vehicles air system is backwards in comparison to civilian trucks. If you loose air on a civy semi, it gets stuck!


Here it is in black and white:
http://dmv.ca.gov/pubs/cdl_htm/lic_chart.htm

 

[Seth_O]

I just registered my bobbed deuce in Sacramento last Friday. You can drive it with a class C license since you removed an axle - historic registration has no relation to the class of vehicle you are licensed to drive.

The DMV inspector came out, looked it over and said 'cool truck!' I went inside and handed them the paperwork and $116 and they gave me a temp registration and said I should get my historic plates in 60-90 days.

I believe there was NO CORRELATION between my bobbed deuce and my request for a historic registration. In CA the request is a paper-only transaction that gets sent to a committee to review. They'll look at what type of vehicle it is according to the title and make a determination if that vehicle qualifies. If they review the inspection report which states it's 2 axle vehicle I will tell them I am restoring it to an XM381 configuration which is quite rare and a highly desired collectible item.

Good luck with your registration.

 

[AaronHorrocks]

historic registration has no relation to the class of vehicle you are licensed to drive.

I've been told that too... Even by USMC Military Police. But after they were on the phone with the CHP, and got the specifics, they had to let me go. Because I was in the clear to drive a 3 axle 17,xxx lbs truck, registered as a historical vehicle.

It turned out a USMC officer (that has seen older military vehicle collectors before) saw my truck on the security camera, and overheard them on the radio stating it had a GVW of 80,000 - which we all know is incorrect. He came to the gate to clear things up. One of the MPs tried to also tell me that my truck had airbrakes, to which I had to immediately correct him.

 

[100dollarman]

Its not so much that I think its a gray area per se, but I just hate to tell a customer something, and then the DMV tells them something else! Seems like it sometimes depends who you talk to-

advice-- when you go to the DMV, give them the minimun info possible and dont ask any questions! ........and cross your fingers!lol

There is no inspection in Ca. that I know of. Only a VIN verification, and a weight cert if you are going commercial.

I have had customers get the truck registered, then bring them to get bobbed.

 

[yellobronc]

Can I get away with a standard drivers license now that its only two axles?
Why do you think having 3 axles is an issue in california? You're still under a HISTORICAL VEHICLE exception. I know that I couldn't keep Classic Car insurance if I change out the engine in my M38A1 to something more powerful. I've been driving my 5 Ton Tractor Truck for three years with only one minor hold up when I was getting on base. They delaid me two hours only to find out that I can drive my 3-axle 5 Ton, as a historical vehicle, as long as I'm not towing a (semi) trailer. (They told me "ANY" trailer, which I'm 100% sure they're wrong about. Any semi trailer, sure.. For that I'd need a Non-Commercial Class A, - which I already have a learners permit for!)

Is it still possible to register it as a CA historic vehicle?
It has to meet the qualifications, which most deuces do. If it's 25 years old? You're probably good. If you think a bobbed deuce is a Historical Vehicle, then do you think a "rat-rod" is? Why or why not?

Does the brake system need to be inspected by a DMV person?
No, the brakes are hydrolic. The fact is uses an air system to assist the brakes is not important. The M series vehicles air system is backwards in comparison to civilian trucks. If you loose air on a civy semi, it gets stuck!


Here it is in black and white:
http://dmv.ca.gov/pubs/cdl_htm/lic_chart.htm

Technically, the M35 Break system is AIR by definition in Ca. Air/Hydraulic is AIR per the commercial handbook.

I never had to have my truck inspected for anything other than the VIN.

 

[chess]

would it be possible somehow to get normal plates for a bobbed m923 5 ton?

 

[Hammer]

Technically, the M35 Break system is AIR by definition in Ca. Air/Hydraulic is AIR per the commercial handbook.

No, it is only air ASSIST.
Which is the same as vacuum assist.
Now, if you tow any trailer with the air brakes, then YES, it would be air over hydraulic.
Most people in CA get the Historic Vehicle plates (I had them on all mine while there,) and not being able to have any load precludes the trailer portion of the brake system.

 

[Jake0147]

Technically, the M35 Break system is AIR by definition in Ca. Air/Hydraulic is AIR per the commercial handbook.

I never had to have my truck inspected for anything other than the VIN.

I don't know California's code... Under Federal code, every state I do know, most of Canada, and the industry, there is a BIG distinction.

Air brakes are just that. Full air.
Air over hydraulic brakes are a full air system (you step on a air valve), and the full air system serves only to apply force to a hydraulic master cylinder. They are not "air assisted" as a whole chunk of them is full air. These are universally grouped with full air brakes.
Air ASSISTED brakes such as the deuce has are not air brakes. Air is only the power source for the assist mechanism. Whole nother ball of wax. If air assist was restricted, they'd have to relicense everybody with a vacuum booster, those are assisted by air pressure as well.

Again, I don't know the code for California specifically. Deuce brakes are NOT air-over-hydraulic in any way. They are simply hydraulic. Be sure to read the letter of the law, up to and including the definitions section. Air-over-hydraulic is often missaplied to systems to which it does not apply, however the state code has a section to clarify how they use any terms that they use.

 

[Autocar]

It is a two axle truck with a GVW of less than 26,000# so it falls under the catagory of a Class C. The Motor Vehicle Code doesn't address modifications for historic vehicles-the requirements are 25 years old and used for display type events only, which the truck would qualify for. The only sticking point would be the air brakes. I think that a class C truck with air brakes does not need an endorsement, but the documentation is a grey area. In describing air brakes, the commercial drivers handbook says "It also includes an air-over-hydraulic brake system", however, the definition of an air brake system doesn't match a deuce. The definition of an air brake system requires service brakes, parking brake, and emergency brake. "The emergency brake system uses parts of the service and parking brake systems to stop the vehicle in the event of a brake system failure". Then later, "For CDL purposes, a vehicles's air brake system must meet the above definition..." Since the emergency/parking brake is mechanical and does not use any of the service brake parts, it technically doesn't meet Calif definition of an air brake system.

 

[Hammer]

They are NOT air brakes.
The air ASSIST works in the same exact fashion that vacuum brakes do. So if you completely loose air pressure, you still have functional brakes, you just need to push the pedal a lot harder (just like vacuum brakes when the engine is off.)