Colorado Bill SB19-054 RE: (Former) Military Vehicle Motor Vehicle Regulation

[Carmancraig]

sema has changed its focus again, for a little wile they were pro MV then not.... i have 6 (about to be 7) laws passed and they told me they are no longer working on the MV issue.... just like the mvpa.

My truck is currently licensed. I will sue the state if / when it is revoked for constitutional rights violation s.

 

[MightyMike]

I just read through this thread start to finish. MV enthusiasts in Colorado have truly gotten the shaft. I just have a feeling Colorado has taken such a hard left turn this law will never be undone.

 

[TMOMW]

I just read through this thread start to finish. MV enthusiasts in Colorado have truly gotten the shaft. I just have a feeling Colorado has taken such a hard left turn this law will never be undone.

it can be done, it could be done... would take time and lots of work... probably a 2 year job... but duable.. but not without 1. local boots on the ground, 2. a "expert" with the rules and regulations, and 3. a group that the state law makers can deal with ..... till then probably not and thats a shame.

 

[Carmancraig]

it can be done, it could be done... would take time and lots of work... probably a 2 year job... but duable.. but not without 1. local boots on the ground, 2. a "expert" with the rules and regulations, and 3. a group that the state law makers can deal with ..... till then probably not and thats a shame.

You're right. Do able. We need fund raising to hire attorney to sue. Any ideas? Crowdfunding? Anyone with experience!?

 

[MightyMike]

I hope so. There are so few MVs in Colorado, being driven so little of the time, that they are not a nuisance or really even visible to the public. This law was written by political activists to clear vehicles they believe are grand polluters off the streets and highways. To change the law, you're going to need find a state representative willing to sponsor a bill.

 

[MightyMike]

Yup, welcome to the Peoples Republic of Colorado comrades.

It's really sad it has come down to this. Long story I'll make quick, but the USAF brought my father and family to Colorado in the late 70s and we called it home. After I retired from the US Army I called Colorado home. Fast forward to today and I've left Colorado for my new home in South Dakota. The main reason I left is that the state no longer seems like home.

 

[SgtMajHarper]

It's really sad it has come down to this. Long story I'll make quick, but the USAF brought my father and family to Colorado in the late 70s and we called it home. After I retired from the US Army I called Colorado home. Fast forward to today and I've left Colorado for my new home in South Dakota. The main reason I left is that the state no longer seems like home.

I'm a native, grew up loving this state and all that was in it, went away to the Marines and far off foreign shores, returned home and made it my home by choice. "IF" I didn't have so many ties here still I'd pack my trash, pull my money and un-ass the area; my concerns are that wherever I could go, how long before the same politics show up and ruin another land?

 

[Carmancraig]

I'm a native, grew up loving this state and all that was in it, went away to the Marines and far off foreign shores, returned home and made it my home by choice. "IF" I didn't have so many ties here still I'd pack my trash, pull my money and un-ass the area; my concerns are that wherever I could go, how long before the same politics show up and ruin another land?

I think a class action lawsuit is the best bet on constitutional grounds.

 

[Ohiobenz]

Here's an update from SAN about Oklahoma....
Contact your lawmaker and demand support for HB 3179!!
This is showing that the trend is reversible.
I still encourage all to contact SAN/SEMA at the email address I posted earlier. This should show us that they ARE aware and involved.

Overview: Oklahoma has introduced SAN-supported legislation (H.B. 3179) to allow for the registration and titling of former military surplus vehicles. “Military surplus vehicle” is defined as a vehicle less than 35 years old and was manufactured for use in either the United States Armed Forces or any country that was a member of the North Atlantic Treaty Organization at the time the vehicle was manufactured. The bill requires the vehicle to have been authorized for sale to civilians and include seat belts or safety shoulder harnesses for each occupant. Under current law, former military vehicles are not able to be titled in the state. The bill passed the Senate Finance Committee and now awaits consideration by the full Senate.

 

[coachgeo]

@Carmancraig, @Ohiobenz and others... Suing is way way too risky. Courts will have no problem making a blanket decision for all MV's based on one Military vehicle type not meeting either EPA or a required DOT safety feature for year it was manufactured. (example Duck Boats, A1R's of various models may not meet some things for year they were made too) Thus WE CAN'T risk a suite.

This has to be fought thru a congressman to write supporting legislation. Likely coming down to state by state battle

 

[Ohiobenz]

@Carmancraig, @Ohiobenz and others... Suing is way way too risky. Courts will have no problem making a blanket decision for all MV's based on one Military vehicle type not meeting either EPA or a required DOT safety feature for year it was manufactured. (example Duck Boats, A1R's of various models may not meet some things for year they were made too) Thus WE CAN'T risk a suite.

This has to be fought thru a congressman to write supporting legislation. Likely coming down to state by state battle

The only time a suit may come to be an avenue is if they rescind our titles/licenses rendering our trucks into very expensive lawn ornaments...

Until then, making ourselves know and heard via SAN is probably the best steps we can take.
IMO everyone one on here should be contacting them, regardless of whether you own a historical or current conflict vehicle.

 

[coachgeo]

The only time a suit may come to be an avenue is if they rescind our titles/licenses rendering our trucks into very expensive lawn ornaments...

Until then, making ourselves know and heard via SAN is probably the best steps we can take.
IMO everyone one on here should be contacting them, regardless of whether you own a historical or current conflict vehicle.

agreed.... did that long ago when this was first posted.

 

[Carmancraig]

@Carmancraig, @Ohiobenz and others... Suing is way way too risky. Courts will have no problem making a blanket decision for all MV's based on one Military vehicle type not meeting either EPA or a required DOT safety feature for year it was manufactured. (example Duck Boats, A1R's of various models may not meet some things for year they were made too) Thus WE CAN'T risk a suite.

This has to be fought thru a congressman to write supporting legislation. Likely coming down to state by state battle

Depends on the application, suing for $ in civil court for constitutional right violations is not the same as challenging the "law". It merely represents a penalty for rights in liberty that were previously accessible to have been unconstitutionaly revoked.

 

[coachgeo]

Depends on the application, suing for $ in civil court for constitutional right violations is not the same as challenging the "law". It merely represents a penalty for rights in liberty that were previously accessible to have been unconstitutionaly revoked.

it likely will not be considered unconstitutional to block use of vehicles a bureaucrat deems does not fit into "existing/past" DOT or EPA standards.

 

[Carmancraig]

it likely will not be considered unconstitutional to block use of vehicles a bureaucrat deems does not fit into "existing/past" DOT or EPA standards.

Yeah, but up till 2019, you could easily license anything....they infringed on an already standing liberty.

 

[SgtMajHarper]

Yeah, but up till 2019, you could easily license anything....they infringed on an already standing liberty.

Just another thought on this, and don't quote me on all the steps involved from suing the state, just shooting from the hip here....."IF" you found a willing attorney to take the case (I know money talks...free stuff doesn't pay the bills after law school), you don't want a lousy lawyer to take your case, then you find a court that has a judge inside with hopefully a more "friendly to your cause" look at the world (not in downtown Denver, Boulder, etc.), even if you win at a lower level, count on an appeal; more money, more time and likely going up as far as it can with the current political trends here. Colorado is far from the conservative bastion it was 10 years ago.

As far as what was 10 years ago that has changed.....pot is now legal, wasn't then, "high capacity magazines" for scary AR black rifles, were legal, not anymore. You really want to get PO'd.....check and see what they have done with decriminalizing a long list of laws that just took effect in April. Drugs were felonies, now misdemeanors, can't charge people with possession of a firearm as a previous offender, on and on and on....all they have to do is a pass a law and it happens.

 

[Carmancraig]

Just another thought on this, and don't quote me on all the steps involved from suing the state, just shooting from the hip here....."IF" you found a willing attorney to take the case (I know money talks...free stuff doesn't pay the bills after law school), you don't want a lousy lawyer to take your case, then you find a court that has a judge inside with hopefully a more "friendly to your cause" look at the world (not in downtown Denver, Boulder, etc.), even if you win at a lower level, count on an appeal; more money, more time and likely going up as far as it can with the current political trends here. Colorado is far from the conservative bastion it was 10 years ago.

As far as what was 10 years ago that has changed.....pot is now legal, wasn't then, "high capacity magazines" for scary AR black rifles, were legal, not anymore. You really want to get PO'd.....check and see what they have done with decriminalizing a long list of laws that just took effect in April. Drugs were felonies, now misdemeanors, can't charge people with possession of a firearm as a previous offender, on and on and on....all they have to do is a pass a law and it happens.

My town sells 'high capacity' and standard 30 round capacity over the counter, as far a decriminalization, THEY SHO, most 'laws' are unconstitutional. Drug use for example on is perfectly okay, however, my tax dollars paying for your rehab etc.. is not. And as far as legal money, my original comment stands regarding a CLASS ACTION LAWSUIT. Which is why I was posting in the first place, looking for support. But most of the supposed freedom types "republicans" are just a bunch of coward lay downs anyway so why bother. Just let civil war 2 happen.

 

[Ohiobenz]

My town sells 'high capacity' and standard 30 round capacity over the counter, as far a decriminalization, THEY SHO, most 'laws' are unconstitutional. Drug use for example on is perfectly okay, however, my tax dollars paying for your rehab etc.. is not. And as far as legal money, my original comment stands regarding a CLASS ACTION LAWSUIT. Which is why I was posting in the first place, looking for support. But most of the supposed freedom types "republicans" are just a bunch of coward lay downs anyway so why bother. Just let civil war 2 happen.

I'm not in CO so couldn't join a Class suit against a CO law if I wanted to.
My beef, with the SS membership, from the beginning when I posted about these infringements is that most of the membership here was only interested in supporting legislation in favor of allowing/protecting "historical" military vehicles for on the road use. There should be no division between historical and surplus military vehicles and all should be unified because the fight is for freedom of ownership of whatever roadworthy vehicle we choose to own.
Being selective in supporting "milspec" vs my "civilianized" surplus truck is like supporting a '32 Ford vs a '72 Mustang... we're both enthusiasts.

 

[Ohiobenz]

Update:

The bill passed both chambers and is now pending before Governor Kevin Stitt for final approval.

 

[juanprado]

Article in Denver news about civy H1 bring sucked into this dilemma

Colorado legislators question DMV's targeting of historic military vehicles

When Dick Olmstead bought a used 1997 AM General Hummer in 2002, he never thought the Colorado Department of Revenue Division of Motor Vehicles (DMV) would send him a letter

denvergazette.com