Danger sticker on tach

[cranetruck]

Anybody know when this decal was introduced?

Thanks,

 

[SierraHotel]

My 1970 Deuce doesn't have one...yet. I bought one at Aberdeen to correct that.

 

[Westech]

move that danger sticker up 500 RPM and let her rip!! I want to say I see alot of sticker dates in the early 70's. Like the good driver, buckel up, that sort of stuff.

 

[sailor2000]

What is the correct Max RPM for a Duece Multifuel????

 

[Westech]

3500 rpm O wait... NON Westech motor... 2600 RPM

 

[m-35tom]

correct MAX rpm is 2300

 

[cranetruck]

Re: RE: Danger sticker on tach

My 1970 Deuce doesn't have one...yet. I bought one at Aberdeen to correct that.

The year of the truck doesn't help, the sticker could have been added later as you just proved.

Tom, we are still waiting for TM references to back up your statements, please....

 

[OPCOM]

My sticker is much older than the 1992 rebuild. Can't say the year.

Tom,

I show that to be:

49.5MPH with 9.00x20's which are 42.0" tall / 131.943" circumference
51.3MPH with 11.00x20's which are 43.5" tall / 136.655" circumference
57.6MPH with 395/85R20s' which are 46.8" tall / 147.022" circumference

- but could be a off due to error with circumference..
It's reasonable anyway. Does that sound right? Someone please correct me if these are wrong, so we'll all be on the same page..

So you are saying that the dataplate and the warning decal limits are not for continuous use, but only for "passing" slower vehicles or the like.

 

[Westech]

My data plate shower a max speed of 56 mph. now thats at 2600 rpm. The 5 tons are rated to go up to 2800 rpm and I cruse at 2800 RPM all the time. I just went to Aberdeen and back at WOT for 2k miles (thats 2800 RPM) If that motor was set to a max of 2300 why can i cruse at 2800 all day? I would think that 500 RPM over redline for 2k miles would cause major problems. I know the HP rating is from 130 to 180 on the multis depending on who you talk to and who makes the report, but what I have seen the same is the MAX RPM for the 2.5 ton multi.

just my two $$

 

[jasonjc]

the -10 says that the operating speed(engine rpm) is 1500-2600

 

[OPCOM]

The only thing to explain that is a a drive ratio difference( trans, tire size etc.). -but the trucks are identical except for the engine. So identicality cannot be the case.

Do you mean an example case of the LDT-465-1C and LDT-465-1D ? But how can there be an RPM difference if the trucks are identical except for the engine and as is well known in the art the engines must turn at the same RPM in identical trucks. It is an impossible statement.

A typo in a TM?

Noting the table 1-3 in TM 9-2815-210-34-2-1 I do note that the LDS-465-2 is rated at 2800RPM. What parts are different from the LDS-465-1A to allow such high RPM? I think none, was it simply a matter of a spec in a book? The RPM difference is consistent with the HP diference within 3.36%. Does the truck with the -2 have a different drive ratio than the truck with the -1A? (but this is not a deuce engine and not identical trucks then, so I do not wish to deviate from the topic)

I don't think this one can be rolled over with logic.

 

[OPCOM]

... I just went to Aberdeen and back at WOT for 2k miles (thats 2800 RPM) If that motor was set to a max of 2300 why can i cruse at 2800 all day? ...

just my two $$

It's not a physical setting, but I believe what is being discussed is a limit for the observance of the truck operator.

 

[cranetruck]

Thanks Maccus, guess I should have checked the TM's, it should be mentioned somewhere if they were there from "day one" so to speak.
As usual, you have to know what to look for to find it.

 

[SierraHotel]

Westfolk, the transmissions are the same? The gauges both work the same? Is it possible one is 300 RPM off (naw!! That never happens!)

 

[clinto]

Aren't there a couple 3053's that have different 5th gear ratios?

 

[jasonjc]

speedo off a littel tac off a littel one set of tires worn more than the other

 

[houdel]

FACT:
The LD/LDT 465 family of engines have a max operating speed of 2600 RPM
The LDS 465 family of engines have a max operating speed of 2800 RPM

If you don't believe it, look it up in the TMs. That max speed is set by the calibration of the governor in the injection pump. The LDS 465 can achieve a sustained output of 190 horsepower +/- at 2800 RPM through a combination of stronger internal components, larger injectors, bigger turbo, oil cooled pistons and so forth.

If that motor was set to a max of 2300 why can i cruse at 2800 all day?

It wasn't set to 2300 rpm. Assuming you have a LD/LDT engine, it was originally set to 2600 rpm. If you are running at an indicated 2800 rpm, one of the following is likely true:
a. Your tach is off
b. You have a LDS injection pump
c. Someone messed with the governor setting on your IP before you got it
d. You have a LDS engine

The C truck runs 55MPH at 2,300rpm. The D truck runs 55MPH at 2,000rpm. Why the 300 RPM difference? I know, I know the D is "supposed" to have more power.

I don't know that the D is "supposed" to have any more power than the "C", the series upgrade is generally improved internal components. Furthermore, the road speed to engine rpm thing has noting at all to do with power, that is a function of the drivetrain gearing and tire size. I don't believe you are running an actual 55 mph at an actual 2000 rpm, not with a stock 0.71 OD ratio tranny and stock 9:00-20 tires, it just ain't going to happen. Look again at the photo in Bjorn's original post. He is running an indicated 52 mph at an indicated 2200 rpm, WITH 11:00-20 tires! One or more of the following is/are true:
a. Speedo and/or tach error
b. Tire condition - you can easily get a 5 or more mph difference between new tires and well worn tires
c. Incorrect speedometer adapter
d. Non standard tranny OD ratio (very unlikely)
e. Non standard axle ratio (extremely unlikely)

Check your speedo using a GPS. My Deuce's speedo reads 10% low. At an indicated 50 mph on the speedo, my GPS says I am going 55 mph (at an indicated 2200 rpm). I can believe 55 mph at 2300 rpm in your "C" truck, but not an actual 55 mph at an actual 2000 rpm in your "D" truck.

There is a great disparity in tires as well. My Deuce came with a set of 10 excellent used tires of various brands and a spare which had never been on the road - it still had the paint markings running up the middle of the tread. When I measured the circumference of the tires to match them, the used tires ran from 125" to 129", the brand new spare, a T-Hawk, was right in the middle at 127-1/4". That is a 3% difference in rolling speed from smallest to largest on a set of near new tires, there would probably be a 10-15% difference in rolling speed between new/near new and well used tires.

 

[FreightTrain]

It is physically impossible for 2 idential trucks(other than turbo) to run different RPM but at the same speed even if they are C turbo Vrs D turbo.Even a Non turbo would run the exact same.The ratio of Engine RPM to Driveshaft RPM to wheel RPM are exactly the same no matter what horse power you have.Even if you repowered the truck and used the stock tranny the RPM would never change.It is set in stone per gear ratios since there is no torque converter in the drive train so no lose of RPM from properly working clutch.

 

[houdel]

FACT:
The LD/LDT 465 family of engines have a max operating speed of 2600 RPM
The LDS 465 family of engines have a max operating speed of 2800 RPM

CORRECTION:
The LD/LDT 465 family of engines have a max operating speed of 2600 RPM
The LDS 465-1 engines have a max operating speed of 2600 RPM
The LDS 465-2 engines have a max operating speed of 2800 RPM

 

[OPCOM]

...Check your speedo using a GPS. My Deuce's speedo reads 10% low. At an indicated 50 mph on the speedo, my GPS says I am going 55 mph (at an indicated 2200 rpm). I can believe 55 mph at 2300 rpm in your "C" truck, but not an actual 55 mph at an actual 2000 rpm in your "D" truck.
...

The issue of guages being off -it's true.

The GPS agrees with the speedo with new-ish 11.00x20 NDT tires. That is 'wrong' and tells me I have an error whether it be the speedo or an incorrect speedo adapter but I know what the error is and fortunately I do not have to mentally correct for it since it balances out to zero with my incorrect 11.00x20 tires.

The tach-that is another matter. I have no way to check that, especially not at speed.

Perhaps I could tape a small magnet to the transmission rear driveshaft, put the truck in 4th at 2400RPM, disengage the transfer, and use a probe and a counter to totalize the revolutions over 10 seconds. The problem is the low RPM. My counters have no better than a 10 Hz resolution and one impulse per revolution is 40Hz. There might be another way to do it - use headphones - listen to the pulsations (hum) of the magnet as it spins, and run the engine at 1800RPM. one headphone channel goes to the magnetic pickup, the other listens to household 60Hz 'hum' when the shaft is at exactly 1800RPM, the beat will be zero. Close enough for government work anyway. but back to the transmissions:

One thing to bring up about the OD ratios, I believe the OD on the 3053A is 0.85, not 0.71. interestingly, there is a 3053B which is 0.75 but was not used in the M35.

I found this where cgarbee had posted it, and he said the 3053B, which he found evidence of in some old spicer documentation, is found only in some mid-50's school buses and the like, so it is rather rare. Here:
http://www.garbee.net/~cabell/transmission.htm