Deuce no start, have gone thru a few steps already

[Malcador]

I've got a deuce that turns over great but doesn't wannabe start. I crank it religiously once a month. About a year ago, the infamous stuck injector / shutoff issue bit me. I had to totally disassemble the injector pump and clean it good and proper. Got the lever sliding nicely

Well fast forward to yesterday. No start. Grrr. I pulled the cover off the IP and found that the lever was freely moving. No problems at all. Puzzled, I checked the tank pump. Main power on, it was hard to hear with the air alarm buzzer running. But I didn't hear anything. Alright. So I pull the electrical plug. 25v to the pump. Clean and reseat the connection. Hit the switch and it starts running. Horray!

Still no start

So I crack the bleeder open on the fuel filters. Turn on power. Air comes out then a solid stream of fuel. Close the bleeder, and try once more.

STILL no start

Now I'm puzzled. I loosen one of the injector nuts and hit start. No fuel coming out at the injector. I try to pull the metal line out a bit to put it into a metal tin but I can't get the line loose. It seems seized or rusted in place. So I'm not sure if I've actually "cracked" one of the injectors or not.

So what do you try next?

 

[ToddJK]

I've got a deuce that turns over great but doesn't wannabe start. I crank it religiously once a month. About a year ago, the infamous stuck injector / shutoff issue bit me. I had to totally disassemble the injector pump and clean it good and proper. Got the lever sliding nicely

Well fast forward to yesterday. No start. Grrr. I pulled the cover off the IP and found that the lever was freely moving. No problems at all. Puzzled, I checked the tank pump. Main power on, it was hard to hear with the air alarm buzzer running. But I didn't hear anything. Alright. So I pull the electrical plug. 25v to the pump. Clean and reseat the connection. Hit the switch and it starts running. Horray!

Still no start

So I crack the bleeder open on the fuel filters. Turn on power. Air comes out then a solid stream of fuel. Close the bleeder, and try once more.

STILL no start

Now I'm puzzled. I loosen one of the injector nuts and hit start. No fuel coming out at the injector. I try to pull the metal line out a bit to put it into a metal tin but I can't get the line loose. It seems seized or rusted in place. So I'm not sure if I've actually "cracked" one of the injectors or not.

So what do you try next?

I'm guessing the truck did run after you fixed the stuck shutoff switch in the IP?
If so, read on, if not, I'd double check the timing of the HH if you completely disassembled it and reassembled it.

Pull the injectors out and hook the line back up, then fire over and see if the injector sprays/pops or not. Believe it or not, the truck will still start even if the intake pump isn't working.

Have you checked the air cleaner? When was the last time the fuel filters were changed? Running straight diesel or a blend of fuels? Any smoke from the exhaust when trying to start? When you popped the bleeder valve open to let the air out, was there a lot of air? Could be air getting into the fuel system and surprisingly, it doesn't take much air to stop it from running and it takes a while to clear the system if it's not bled off first, I usually end up with dead batteries before it's bled out by cranking. After bleeding the air out of the filters, it has to crank over enough to force the air out of the IP and fuel lines afterwards. Sometimes this may take a while, not every truck is the same in that aspect.

Have you tried a shot of starter fluid to see if it starts? Usually most advise against it, but sometimes it's needed but used very sparingly will not damage the motor.

If nothing works and with the injectors out and motor turned over, if none of the injectors pop, then the issue is within the IP, most likely the hydraulic head. If that is the case, I'd be reading all the threads you can find on here about the hydraulic head and rebuilding it or straight up replacement. If some injectors pop, the ones that don't are bad, plugged, ect, but they need to be rebuilt or replaced.

Keep us updated.

 

[Malcador]

I'm guessing the truck did run after you fixed the stuck shutoff switch in the IP?
If so, read on, if not, I'd double check the timing of the HH if you completely disassembled it and reassembled it.

Pull the injectors out and hook the line back up, then fire over and see if the injector sprays/pops or not. Believe it or not, the truck will still start even if the intake pump isn't working.

Have you checked the air cleaner? When was the last time the fuel filters were changed? Running straight diesel or a blend of fuels? Any smoke from the exhaust when trying to start? When you popped the bleeder valve open to let the air out, was there a lot of air? Could be air getting into the fuel system and surprisingly, it doesn't take much air to stop it from running and it takes a while to clear the system if it's not bled off first, I usually end up with dead batteries before it's bled out by cranking. After bleeding the air out of the filters, it has to crank over enough to force the air out of the IP and fuel lines afterwards. Sometimes this may take a while, not every truck is the same in that aspect.

Have you tried a shot of starter fluid to see if it starts? Usually most advise against it, but sometimes it's needed but used very sparingly will not damage the motor.

If nothing works and with the injectors out and motor turned over, if none of the injectors pop, then the issue is within the IP, most likely the hydraulic head. If that is the case, I'd be reading all the threads you can find on here about the hydraulic head and rebuilding it or straight up replacement. If some injectors pop, the ones that don't are bad, plugged, ect, but they need to be rebuilt or replaced.

Keep us updated.

Thank you for an excellent reply. Let me answer each of your questions

The truck ran great for about a year after I fixed the injector pump startup lever.

Will try pulling an injector completely to see what happens. Part of the issue with trying stuff is that the truck is in a grassy field at a friends house about 15 minutes away, so trying anything requires packing all the tools I think I'll need and driving down there. It's also nearly 100 feet from a power outlet and I have a single 12V battery charger, so if I deplete the batteries, I have to connect one to charge, drive home, wait 3 hours, drive back, swap cables to the other one, drive back home, then drive back down 3 hours later.

The fuel is.... Old. Very old. It looks like over-creamered coffee in the fuel tank. Its probably 95% diesel and a bit of used motor oil from a few years back. The truck has never been down on power or had difficulty starting on this mix but there's a first time for everything I guess

No exhaust pipe smoke to speak of when cranking

Bleeding at the fuel filter there wasn't a lot of air. Some, to be sure, but it only required maybe 10 seconds of power on to get a solid stream of fuel

A shot of starter fluid causes the motor to fire and sometimes even run for about two seconds or so but it always dies

Fuel filters are also very old. Possibly up to ten years. This truck gets very little usage aside from a monthly startup to keep it fresh. It belongs to a friend who is no longer physically able to work on it so I run it as and when I can as a favor to him.

 

[bprzyw]

I had the same. The fuel shutoff was all gummed up. Cleaned it then lubed it up. Still would not start. Changed all three fuel filters, no go but they were plugged up. My tank pump was non functional. Drained the the tank, refilled with fresh fuel, replaced the in tank pump and purged the air. It now starts up in a second!

 

[Floridianson]

Lets check fuel delivery valve. Not starting because no fuel? | SteelSoldiers

 

[ToddJK]

I would definitely change those fuel filters then. If it looks like over creamered coffee, there's a lot of water in that fuel and that alone can keep it from running. Add two to three bottles of HEAT or water remover to it and try your best to stir it to mix it in. I had an issue like that once. Water in the fuel was enough to kill my truck. Mixed in some water remover or Isopropyl alcohol basically, drained the primary with the in tank pump on until the fuel with alcohol started coming out, bled air from the secondaries, and used starter fluid to get it started. I had to keep spraying starter fluid in it to keep it running until the alcohol mixed fuel started to burn them it stayed running. With water in fuel like that,the longer.it sits in the engine,IP, the worse it gets.
You could also drain the tank and rinse out with brake clean. Once dry, refill with some fresh diesel. You'll still have to crank it to get the bad fuel out of the system. The latter won't require to run the truck for long periods of time to run the tank dry and is probably safer on the engine too.

You'll also want to change all the fuel filters once all the watered down fuel is drained and filled with fresh fuel.
For good preventative maintenance, I would add a bottle of water remover once a month and also some of that bio-fuel or algae remover for diesel. This would keep your fuel and fuel system in good shape for long time to come.

 

[Malcador]

I had the same. The fuel shutoff was all gummed up. Cleaned it then lubed it up. Still would not start. Changed all three fuel filters, no go but they were plugged up. My tank pump was non functional. Drained the the tank, refilled with fresh fuel, replaced the in tank pump and purged the air. It now starts up in a second!

I'll try that, filters definitely need to be replaced and the fuel is years old at this point. In Florida. So uhhh there's just a BIT of humidity around here

 

[Malcador]

Lets check fuel delivery valve. Not starting because no fuel? | SteelSoldiers

Thanks. That looks like a basic needle and seat valve like my Jeep CJ Carburetor has on it.

 

[Malcador]

I would definitely change those fuel filters then. If it looks like over creamered coffee, there's a lot of water in that fuel and that alone can keep it from running. Add two to three bottles of HEAT or water remover to it and try your best to stir it to mix it in. I had an issue like that once. Water in the fuel was enough to kill my truck. Mixed in some water remover or Isopropyl alcohol basically, drained the primary with the in tank pump on until the fuel with alcohol started coming out, bled air from the secondaries, and used starter fluid to get it started. I had to keep spraying starter fluid in it to keep it running until the alcohol mixed fuel started to burn them it stayed running. With water in fuel like that,the longer.it sits in the engine,IP, the worse it gets.
You could also drain the tank and rinse out with brake clean. Once dry, refill with some fresh diesel. You'll still have to crank it to get the bad fuel out of the system. The latter won't require to run the truck for long periods of time to run the tank dry and is probably safer on the engine too.

You'll also want to change all the fuel filters once all the watered down fuel is drained and filled with fresh fuel.
For good preventative maintenance, I would add a bottle of water remover once a month and also some of that bio-fuel or algae remover for diesel. This would keep your fuel and fuel system in good shape for long time to come.

Yeah the truck's kind of a mess. I remember when my friend got it it was in great shape. Sadly it's been out in the rain for about 10 years now and the rust is pretty extensive. Brakes are out too, but that's another issue.

I see a VERY rusted drain plug on the bottom of the diesel tank that I'm going to see if I can get loose. If not, I've got a squeeze bulb hand pump/siphon thing I can use to drain the tank mostly. Here's the order of the plan:

1. Drain the tank completely and do what I can to clean out gunk
2. Refill with a few gallons of fresh clean diesel
3. Run the tank pump with the bleeder open on the secondary fuel filter until I see clean fuel coming thru
4. Change all fuel filters
5. Bleed system again

Then I'll try to start and see where we get.

 

[ToddJK]

Yeah the truck's kind of a mess. I remember when my friend got it it was in great shape. Sadly it's been out in the rain for about 10 years now and the rust is pretty extensive. Brakes are out too, but that's another issue.

I see a VERY rusted drain plug on the bottom of the diesel tank that I'm going to see if I can get loose. If not, I've got a squeeze bulb hand pump/siphon thing I can use to drain the tank mostly. Here's the order of the plan:

1. Drain the tank completely and do what I can to clean out gunk
2. Refill with a few gallons of fresh clean diesel
3. Run the tank pump with the bleeder open on the secondary fuel filter until I see clean fuel coming thru
4. Change all fuel filters
5. Bleed system again

Then I'll try to start and see where we get.

That's what I would do. Hopefully that works.
If your friend wants to own it but does nothing with it, I wonder if he would be willing to sell it. The longer it just sits there,the more rust and rot there is and eventually,not much of a truck or anything of real value left.

 

[Malcador]

That's what I would do. Hopefully that works.
If your friend wants to own it but does nothing with it, I wonder if he would be willing to sell it. The longer it just sits there,the more rust and rot there is and eventually,not much of a truck or anything of real value left.

Yeah At the end of the day it's just a truck. But also it's super cool and I want to keep it running.

If he gives/sells it to me I'd want to bring it to my house where I can actually work on it with my tools and everything available. Right now he's too old to mess with it, but I can tell he doesn't wanna give it up for nostalgia reasons. The unofficial deal we have is that I get to use it whenever I want if I keep it cranked once a month. If something's wrong, he'll pay for the parts to fix it if I do the knuckle-busting work

It works but I'd like to get her out of the rain and stop the rot from progressing, then talk about reversing it. The plan is: If I can get it running and fix the brake issue, even temporarily, I'll drive it back to my house and store it there instead.

 

[Floridianson]

Thanks. That looks like a basic needle and seat valve like my Jeep CJ Carburetor has on it.

Yep just about just do not loose the little spring in the dirt. There are many things that are simple we check before we pull any major parts. Start with easy move on from there.

 

[williamh]

Pull the HH off the injection pump. I’ll bet the clip came off because the HH is gummy

 

[bprzyw]

Ospho will eat the rust. Just loosen up the rust and brush/spray it on. Stir up the fuel tank as much as possible then drain it.