Deuce rear axle brake lockup..... Help please!!!

[73m819]

Well myself and a couple of heavy line techs looked the brake system over and couldn't find any real issues with the brake system. When I purchased the truck it had been gone through by a very knowledgeable person on these trucks. He works on them plus sells them. I know that no one else should be trusted in the issue of the safety of the vehicle that I am driving and that's why today when I had some time to actually check things out, I did! Thank you guys for all of your input! This site has been great so far!

DID thay LOOK at the RUBBER hoses, look inside for DETERIATION, because from your first post, that is WHAT you DESCRIBED, when you rocked back and forth and at the same time stomped on the brakes, you FORCED the blockage to give, With bad RUBBER hoses, IT WILL DO AGAIN WHAT IT DID AS DESCRIBED in the first post , only maybe this time one of KNUCKLE hoses will block causing a front brake lockup with the corresponding pull to one side, this would not be good in dry weather, let alone wet, snow, ice

COMMON sense would be not to drive the truck TILL you found out WHAT CAUSED the EVENT, just because ALL looks good DOES NOT answer the cause, till that CAUSE is found and fixed, the EVENT can and most likely will happen AGAIN

SORTA like this.
Just because my X looked good, does not answer the 1000 reasons that CAUSE her to be a X

 

[bigreddeuce]

I think it's funny how I am getting blasted for DRIVING my deuce. I DO have COMMON sense and quite a bit of it at that!! I'm not driving it down the freeway or through towns. I live in a very rural area and also have 4600 acres with roads all through the land. I have also been in and around older trucks and cars my entire life. Yes, the deuce is new to me and I do not have very much knowledge on these vehicles, that's the reason that I joined this site! But in all seriousness, weren't these vehicles designed so 18-20 yr old kids without any knowledge or mechanical ability could operate and maintain them in any combat situation?

I appreciate the help that I received and I have looked into a couple of different areas trying to find some answers as well, the TM's on here are fantastic and there is a wealth of information that is very easy to access and find.

I drove the Deuce around the ACREAGE yesterday, and guess what! A few of you guys were right!! Brakes locked up AGAIN! Who would of thunk it, huh? So I let off the air pressure and they unlocked, drove it to the barn and parked it. Checked the air lines once again and started thinking, if I let the pressure off but had a line holding the pressure back then there should still be a brake locked up somewhere?!?! Now I will be honest, air assist breaks are new to me. So tonight I will be pulling all the wheels of the truck and checking airpacks but what do I need to look for? How can I tell if one's bad? Dumb question I know but I am trying to learn the VERY MOST that I can about these trucks. Will it be obvious?

 

[bigreddeuce]

I'm also going to try replicate the problem and back off bleeder valves one by one to see what I get with that..

 

[73m819]

Did all lock up OR just the rear axle, if all then check the air pack first, before pulling the wheels because it does not make sense that all 6 wheels lock up because of a wheel brake issue, if just the rear axle lock up again both sides, replace the rubber brake hose

 

[bigreddeuce]

I'm thinking about replacing all the hoses just to head off any problems that could be caused from them. The truck was refurbished is '87 and has 2300 miles on it, it was a brush fire truck and with 2300 miles over the last 24 years it's done some serious sitting around!

It is just the rear axle so I'll try that 73m819! One thing that I found a little troubling, when I got the truck home and drained the air tanks the inboard tank (closest to the driveshaft) was completely filled with water! The water was very clean, no rust color or smell but I was still kinda surprised to see all the water that was there. Yesterday when I bled the air the truck was running and that tank started dripping oil..... I left the vavles open for a couple of minutes to see what else could would come out of that tank. I shut the valve let her pressure up and then opened it back up with a white rag underneath it and just a very small amount of clear condensation came out.... So now I'm stuck wondering about the oil

 

[Bob USNR]

brake lockup

Ok, well I took the deuce for about a 30 mile drive and pulled into a parking lot and as I was inching through the parking lot my brakes locked up on the rear most axle??? But the other 2 axles were fine.. Kinda stumped as to why just the rear locked up. They were locked up tight enough the truck wouldn't move at all. So after letting it sit in the middle of the parking lot for about 20 mins, all while the Christmas were having to drive around this huge road block, I got back into the truck pumped the brakes a couple of times then something popped and I started rolling!?!? The drive home was about 5 miles and the brakes worked great........ I'm stumped, but I don't know much about these trucks yet, any ideas??????


The only reason I say the most rear axle is because those were smoking and the only brakes with any heat in them....

If the brake shoes are adjusted so close to the drums that they drag on the drum they will lock up. The lining material will expand from the friction and they will act like you are stepping progressively harder on the brake. Until they stop you. I have seen this 100s of times since I work on cars and trucks for a living. Even experienced mechanics make this mistake once in a while.
When you let the truck sit for a while the brake linings cooled off causing the linings to shrink thus releasing the brakes.
Carefully readjust the brake shoes and see if it happens again.

I have had a rubber brake line collapse on the inside and cause this same event. However it did not release till I bled some fluid out.

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[73m819]

I think it's funny how I am getting blasted for DRIVING my deuce. I DO have COMMON sense and quite a bit of it at that!! I'm not driving it down the freeway or through towns. I live in a very rural area and also have 4600 acres with roads all through the land. I have also been in and around older trucks and cars my entire life. Yes, the deuce is new to me and I do not have very much knowledge on these vehicles, that's the reason that I joined this site! But in all seriousness, weren't these vehicles designed so 18-20 yr old kids without any knowledge or mechanical ability could operate and maintain them in any combat situation?

?

If in the first place YOU had said the you were driving on your 4600 acres, and not endangering others by driving on the highway with QUESTIONABLE brakes, nobody would have BUSTED you, but instead said "BE CAREFULE" till you find out what is causing the problem

The MEMBERS on this site take SAFTEY very SERIOUSLY, and will ERROR on the side of saftey every time, It is EASIER to say "I'm sorry, I miss read you" then it is to watch someone get hurt or killed because something was not said.

 

[bigreddeuce]

Your right, sorry for the confusion on that, that was my bad!!

 

[Heavysteven]

When's the last time you lubricated the air pack? Or Power bled the brakes.

 

[bigreddeuce]

That sir, I do not know! I just got it last monday

 

[Mike929]

It looks like a cool truck, mind throwing up some pictures as you dig into your problem?

 

[bigreddeuce]

Oh pics are sure to come. I'm in the car business and work a gazillion hours so I'll be taking pics just to remember how it goes back together....... Lol


---
I am here: http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=36.008820,-96.065116

 

[DeucesWild11]

Yeah I would like to see pics too as I want to see what looks good and what does not when I take mine apart... I thought the same thing when reading the posts about how you should know how to take apart your brake system or pay someone to do so.. I know how messages can become misunderstood especially in a post and I know the guys here on SS just want to help and make sure everyone is riding safe... but I DO want to learn how and KNOW how to take apart and fix my deuce... If I knew of a mechanic in my area that has experience with a deuce I would take it to him ASAP for a once over but there is no one in my area that I know of who has that experience, so I am left with myself and this great website to figure out how..

 

[bigreddeuce]

That's my exact same problem. I learn so much quicker if it's hands on instead of reading! I've got 2 semi shops within 5 miles of where the deuce is parked but when I talked to them or the techs it's like I was speaking Hungarian.... I would much rather work side by side with someone and learn all the ins and outs. We also have a heavy line shop at work at those guys also don't know anything about these trucks. So I guess for now it's just me and my wrenches and camera going at it! With good pics I can usually put anything back together, or at least up to this point I have been able too.... Keeping my fingers crossed. I have trust in this site too if I end up getting stumped, post a pic then sort through all the comments and hopefully an answer comes from it. I'm on a ton of forums from atv sand drags to sand rails then rock crawling and they've all been extremely helpful. It's just a huge community with the same interests!!!

 

[DeucesWild11]

I guess I'll figure out my brakes the same way I did learning how to plumb and run electric in my house.. take it apart figure out what's wrong and put back together.. looks like we're on the same track.. to bad NY is not closer to OK.. That would be a fun "team teardown"!

 

[spicergear]

Sooooo...how cold is it outside Tulsa this time of year? You mentioned water in your air tank which can translate into water into your brake system. If you happen to have a small area of water droplets that have gathered into one in your brake system and frozen into a blockage, you could be seeing these problems as everytime you just touch the brakes, you're pushing that blockage further down the line in effect holding more pressure on the brake lines on the other side of that ice blockage.

Last winter I ran across something interesting with the Mog as the it started to air up (air over hydraulic) then had no air assist. Water collected in the seperator enough that it wouldn't allow the pressure to build correctly. The water had frozen in one area.

This may be a good time to park in a warm garage and power bleed flush the system on your deuce.

 

[bigreddeuce]

Well this is a crazy year for our weather. Today mid 50's and up to over 60 this week! Been under freezing a few nights but only one hard freeze earlier on, not very cold yet..

@DW11, you are correct sir, this would be a great team work tear down. It would be nice to have 2 trucks sitting side x side to reference both vehicles. You can learn quite a bit with one tore down and looking over at one sitting 5 ft away that's still intact. Take a vacation and just head on down! I've got plenty of food and room. We'll save the beer for when we're NOT working on the brake system

 

[DeucesWild11]

That would be cool but it would be a heck of a drive.. only 1,397 miles.. That's more miles than my truck has on it all together! Would be fun adventure though.. Have a beer for me when you're done with the teardown..

 

[DeucesWild11]

OK, just had mine lock up again.. now I haven't driven it much since the original time it happened as I want to tear down everything and have a look. So as I was adjusting my new parking brake and testing in the driveway the brake pedal went rock hard.. Now I have a major leak in the front right brake hose that I am now in the process of replacing since I have the lockup. Not sure if that is what caused the lockup but the whole system seems a bit "jimmy rigged" as you will see in the pics below. After the lockup I head a spitting sound and there was a copper line next to the MC that was not connected and hasn't been for a while as to the looks of it (See pics) That was spitting out brake fluid. Is that supposed to be connected to the MC? Looks like it's supposed to go in that hole that I moved it to in the second pic.. Any help here is much appreciated. No I won't be driving it till all fixed..

 

[bigreddeuce]

Certainly evident where the leak is! I'm going to start my tear down this afternoon. I've been on the phone for a few days in between holidays and working a million hours!!!

I do not have ANY leaks that are visible and diagnosing the problem with a military mechanic seems mine is pretty simple.... Lube the airpack! Hopefully it'll be that simple anyways. Mine finally locked up again saturday, the ENTIRE truck this time instead of being confined to an axle. I bled the air off, it unlocked, let the air pressure build and my brake lights came on and what do you know, truck locked up! I bled air and pressured back up several times and the exact thing happened over and over again.... So I limped it back to the house ( I was in my pasture, was NOT on a public road ) and parked it. I left it alone the rest of the night, had plans for New Years Eve. Sunday afternoon I started the truck and let it build pressure, same thing happened again. The mech that I have been talking to says the grease in the airpack will or could harden up and cause the airpack to stick... He says to spray some penetrating oil into it and pump the brakes too see if it'll unlock it. Seems pretty simple so I'll try that first and see what that does...........

All my brakes are new and in factory tolerances... Checking air hoses tonight as well. Can someone tell me the easiest way to check the cyclinders? They have not been replaced as far as I know. Then is it better to rebuild or replace them? I have been considering pulling all 6 and replacing and keeping the old ones and spares. The brakes are the only problems that I'm having with my truck and with my limited time I am looking and hoping that my issues are simple so I can enjoy my truck as much as possibe....