Ever hit a Sub-Compact?

[Crash_AF]

The reason they won't be allowed to do this is simply because the HMV'rs that are writing the legislation, and the senators that are sponsoring the proposed bills, don't find these activities to be important. They only want to be sure that they can still do their veteran's parades, and re-enactments. That the senators aren't calling for a blanket exemption for HMV's from FMSS certification is proof that they too believe that HMV's are too dangerous to be on the road for general use. Something you guys are helping to prove.

See, this is the problem with any 'non-enviro' groups. Nobody bands together to make sure that all user's rights are preserved, the 'factions' all fight for their little niche and to heck with everyone else. Gun rights enthusiasts do it with hunters vs sport shooters vs "EBR" owners vs collectors. Off road enthusiasts do it with ATV'ers vs mtn bikers vs jeepers... the list goes on and on... and we do it with the reenactors vs collectors vs enthusiasts vs commercial users If everyone would work together to fight these legislative restrictions with one voice, the measures would be harder to pass but everyone wants to sacrifice someone else's rights to keep their niche until everyone loses through 'one piece at a time' divide and conquer legislation.

The Senators who are supporting the bills don't find those uses important because the people who have their ear are the ones who don't care about those uses. I don't know how active all of the different users have been in addressing their state legislature, but I would urge everyone with a dog in the fight to actually participate in the process instead of just posting about it on internet forums. I'm not saying that there aren't lots of active people (and kudos to those that are), but I'd bet that there are at least 1 in 3 who are vocal in public but have never contacted the legislature about their views.

Later,
Joe

 

[moleary]

Voting is not how you get action from your legislators, money, and showing that your position represents the will of a lot of voters is.

Tell that to the folks in Massachusetts. Every vote counts equally in this country, and while you can certainly use a media blitz to sway voter opinion, if I put horse dung in a pie crust and repeatedly tell you its delicious with enough flash and pomp, are you going to eat it?

If you tell enough people about how unsafe HMV's are, and give them enough examples of unsafe activities using HMV's, and tell about the unsafe things you will be doing if such and so happens to cross you, it will become "common knowledge" that HMV's are unsafe, and that people who like them are unreasonable and dangerous. You are in effect lobbying against your own self interests.

In my opinion a thread about stupid drivers and the frustration they cause isn't akin to spreading dis-information. I seriously doubt that this thread will ever contribute to, or be the basis for, anti-HMV legislation.

Legislators legislate things that they think will attract voters. If great blocks of voters believe (even falsly) that HMV's are dangerous to them and their families, legislators are going to do what they can to alleviate their fears, and attract their votes.

HMVs ownership isn't an issue that attract great blocks of voters and nothing you put on this website is going to make it become so. If the voters were to take an interest in the hobby it would be more important to produce an informed voter than it would be to hide and hope no one notices you. Just ask the folks in Wisconsin how well that worked out.

Just because someone in the WI DOT thinks HMV's are mean killer machines that put everyone on the highways at risk, ALL Wisconsin HMV owners will have their use of their HMV's limited to parades.

Wisconsin HMV owners aren't limited to use of the vehicles in parades because of someone at DOT. They'll be limited to use in parades because they didn't have enough public support or enough of a compelling argument to back DOT off. Don't blame one mis-informed guy or department for their woes - you're giving way to much credit to people that don't deserve it.

Don't you think it might be a better use of these forums to promote the wholesome nature of our activities, and what a benefit our owning HMV's is to our communities?

-Chuck

Informed voters make better decisions and are less susceptible to campaign rhetoric or the whims of a bureaucracy. I know it's in vogue to think Americans are stupid. I don't agree. Further, I think that this is a great venue to address concerns about use of the MVs on the roads. As a case in point, this thread has prompted further discourse on the perception of our vehicles as being "unsafe". Ignoring this perception doesn't make it go away. As we are all interested parties in our hobby perhaps we should be doing something about the issue proactively and not attempt to hide from the fact that our vehicles and mini-coopers may not play well together all the time.

So I guess we disagree on this one.

 

[stumps]

Wisconsin HMV owners aren't limited to use of the vehicles in parades because of someone at DOT. They'll be limited to use in parades because they didn't have enough public support or enough of a compelling argument to back DOT off. Don't blame one mis-informed guy or department for their woes - you're giving way to much credit to people that don't deserve it.

WI code currently is silent on the registration of HMV's.

Paul Underwood did back WI DOT off through a legal challenge to their policy.

WI DOT responded to the challenge by writing a bill to restrict HMV's to parade only status, and by continuing to deny registration.

The interpretation that HMV's are dangerous is coming down from someone in WI DOT. WI DOT's lawyer stated his organization's reasons for revoking previously registered HMV's, and disallowing future registration.

-Chuck

 

[surewriting]

Anyways, back to green iron hitting tiny iron.

As the driver of an old vw beetle, and cyclist I have a healthy respect for darn near everything else on the road. Haven't hit anything yet (except on my bicycle- some guy cut me off and I took off his passenger side mirror with my face, but thats unrelated), and I hope to keep it up.

 

[Tanner]

Whatever it is, we in the fire service call it "job security". Keep up that sort of brilliant behavior and you will eventually end up in the back of my box.

... or hosed off of the pavement...

'Tanner'

 

[roscoe]

If they want the info they will get it whether it is from this thread, .MIL documentation, make up a number in their head or wherever they are going to get it.

I would love to see the ACTUAL numbers of accidents in our trucks as compared to the active forces.

I would almost bet, there are less accident with our trucks then any other vehicle on the road.

You can believe that insurance companys know this. This is reflected in the low cost to insure these trucks. Check out the cost to insure a 1000cc plus motorcycle or comparable sports car.

 

[decodeme2]

Yep i got one..! He was trespassing..so...
he wont do that again!..

 

[Mass Ownage]

Our trucks are not dangerous, little cars that can stop on a dime and crumble like a beer can, with retards behind the wheel are dangerous. I think my Deuce is prolly one of the safest vehicles on the road! Atleast for the driver.

 

[Varyag]

Had this happen driving a M1A1 across town after a parade. Had a chick pull right in front of me in a grand am when I was doing about 30.

I locked up the track and about tossed the TC out of his hatch. The loader got pretty messed up too, he bounced off the breach. We stopped just short of her and I think I did more money in damage to the road then her crappy car was worth.

Nobody really got hurt... but if I hadn't seen her comming that car wouldn't have even flexed the track at that speed.

 

[saddamsnightmare]

January 26th, 2010.

Fellow Steel Soldiers members:

Strange to say, we all DO have a dog in this fight, and while I have refrained from saying too much out of deference to our friends in Wisconsin's sensitivities, I do AGREE we (all of us users of ex MV's, for whatever purpose), had better give some thought as to how we can create a proper public relations effort to save our vehicles from restrictions.....! Sarge down here in Texas has deserved beatification for what he did in Hurricane Katrina's aftermath, but we can do as well in little things like the Scouts, public history weekends or displays, and other such matters. AND I do hope R.Lee Ermey sees fit to weigh in on our side here, there and in Wisconsin, more importantly.
Our insurance companies recognize that most of these vehicles will never be involved in an accident, my rates reflect favorably on my Unimog and M35A2 versus my wife's 2006 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited or my sold Ford F250FWD (1989)... Why? Because so many unqualified drivers buy and drive, and ultimately wreck their civillian vehicles when they exceed the design envelope....
I still say that I would not join or back the MVPA because of their parochial outlook and their toothless stance in Wisconsin and just about anywhere else they operate. I say, paddle faster, boys, I hear Banjos (in Wisconsin)...... It was kinda like the private railroad passenger car owners association, few could direct repair work on their cars, but most of them had country club addresses and manners......... A working railroader and railroad car owner had no business among such elitists, and so, I for one, checked out. They wanted it set up so many of the working historic cars would be restricted unless we lived in their rule bound organization.....
Unless the MVPA , to use R.Lee Ermey's memorable line, happen to act like they got a pair, we all are gonna be up the creek without a paddle and listening for the banjoes..... The rest of us had better get organized and weigh in on our own accounts.


Just my worthless worth,

now let's really hear a persuasive rant WHY the working and daily driver vehicles are less worthy of legislative protection then the elitist hanger queens.......

Cheers,

Kyle F. McGrogan

 

[OPCOM]

I am not going to kill myself or destroy my vehicle to protect them from their own stupidity by running off the road.

...

I have noticed that the more expensive the vehicle, the more clueless and oblivious the driver is. BMW's, Mercedes and Caddy drivers tend to be the ones that think they own the road.

A lot of those fancy cars are leased. Sometimes leased by those who can least afford them because they are too stupid to keep a decent job. There is no hard work or pride of ownership. There is little brain activity there. Sometimes there are feeble thoughts of when the next "check" is coming, or how much is left on the food stamps card or the prepaid cellphone card. Beware..

My biggest fear of being involved in a a collision caused by an idiot is of rolling the 5-ton truck. It will only go onto its side due to the box, but the cab is insubstantial. I have noticed the deuce has the radiator and engine oil pan down there in harms way. The 800 series 5 ton has them higher up, exposing only the front axle. Much higher up now with 52" tires. You could park a smart car under the front of it.

I have to agree with Wrecker - do not suicide, do not ditch. Regrettably the negligently driven vehicle may through its own acts and omissions fall victim to the laws of physics, but keep control of your truck because that is how the most lives will be saved. I have no intention of allowing a rotten driver to effect my death or destruction of property, half of them have no insurance, and I drive defensively.

 

[Trudge]

well i have not HIT any cars i did kinda drive half on a parked buick without even noticing LOL .........i had asked the guy to move his car out of my drive way, gues he thought i was kiding about my truck not fitting!!! made cool ripples in his fender door and trunk

 

[G-Force]

What it all boils down to is........when we ARE put in a position of potentially having an altercation on the road with another vehicle.........I believe we all would do our darndest to try and avoid hitting the person who has caused us to be in the predicament at that moment in time. Lets face it...no one wants to have an accident. And as much as we rant and rave about STOOPID people......I really don't think we would want to punch someones ticket with ANY vehicle. We're better than that....aren't we??? Yes....its fun to fantacize about what we'd LIKE to do when we aren't in that situation....but if ever the time comes I firmly beleive we ALL would have our foot pushing that brake pedal through the floorboard.
As for the Wisconsin situation.......there really isn't anything you can do to stop it unless you live in the state. But when it gets to your state you'd better be prepared to fight it....and not sit back and whine about it.

 

[hairba11]

not that this advances the discussion any....

but the 818 looks hungry, and my car looks nervous

 

[swbradley1]

Always thought it would be good to have a camera like a police windshield cam to capture it on film so you could sue the relatives.

I bought one of those for my Brother after a car cut him off in his International dump truck pulling his backhoe.

It stressed him out so bad he suffered a heart attack when he got home. By the time they got him under the knife it took 5 by-passes to fix him.

BrickHouseSecurity.com: Home Security Cameras | Wireless Camera Devices | Video Surveillance System

For cameras that will record continuously.

sw

 

[DeuceNewb]

 

[kennys@wi.rr.com]

I know my wife's Excursion isn't an MV but when a 17 y/o kid decided he could beat her to the intersection in his( mommmy/daddy) new 2009 Corrola it wasn't pretty. At 30 mph she attempted to swerve to miss him and laid on the breaks. Good thing she tried to miss because she put the right side tow hook of her truck through his left front rim. After she nearly tore the front of his car off she hit a block retaining wall. So she drove the truck home and I spent $500 for a bumber and fender and our truck looks new can't say the same for his car. I can only imagine what it would have been if it was a deuce.

 

[OPCOM]

The idea is to survive the collision. Brakes control the vehicle, but not all can stop quick. I try to watch out for idiots but they can sneak up on you and do things that become impossible to come out well.

 

[Flyingvan911]

Drivers need to be a competent in a car as a pilot is in an airplane. Pilots try to know what to do in every possible situation. Most drivers don't think about things until they happen.

Most lawmakers don't do practical research about the laws they make. If it doesn't affect them, it's good for everyone else.

It would be nice if we could get the word out about the positives of MV ownership and restoration. Most groups in the politicans' ears are fairly well funded. We spend our money minding our own business and making our small part of the world a better place.

I think the best we can do is drive our MV's responsibly and try to present them in the best possible light.