Everything new, still wouldn't start on it's own - SOLVED!

[Av3fire]

66 M35a2, new to me
Starts on either and runs/drives good.
Idles around 900 rpm
when turned off, will not restart without more either.......
I have done the following:
Drained and cleaned fuel tank.
new in-tank fuel pump
all new fuel lines and filter relocate kit
new injectors
Fuel shut-off moves freely and is in the 7 o'clock position

Suggestions on what to check next?

thanx in advance

 

[coreyphillips123]

Check to see if fuel shut off lever is in the 7 o clock position

Sent from my SM-G998U using Tapatalk

 

[Av3fire]

Check to see if fuel shut off lever is in the 7 o clock position

Sent from my SM-G998U using Tapatalk

I forgot to include this in my first post.....
i did and it is.
will edit original post

 

[Guyfang]

I am not a truck guy. But when you turn it over, and it will not start, do you smell fuel? Have someone else turn it over, and you stick your honker into the exhaust pipe. No fuel smell? Then have your partner crank it over, and you eyeball the IP. The fuel shut off may be at 7 o-clock, but is the arm opening the valve? Push/pull it a bit. One of the few times I had a A2 not start, the fuel shut off was not on the shaft right. It was misaligned.

 

[Av3fire]

I am not a truck guy. But when you turn it over, and it will not start, do you smell fuel? Have someone else turn it over, and you stick your honker into the exhaust pipe. No fuel smell? Then have your partner crank it over, and you eyeball the IP. The fuel shut off may be at 7 o-clock, but is the arm opening the valve? Push/pull it a bit. One of the few times I had a A2 not start, the fuel shut off was not on the shaft right. It was misaligned.

OK exhaust is 10' in the air, so hard to tell.... but will try moving the shuoff while some one else trys o start it

 

[Elk1111]

Are you sure the pump in the tank is working?

 

[Av3fire]

Are you sure the pump in the tank is working?

Yes, just tested.... steady stream from the 2nd filter into thee hydraulic head

 

[Elk1111]

It really sounds like it’s losing prime somewhere. Did you replace the return line?

 

[Av3fire]

It really sounds like it’s losing prime somewhere. Did you replace the return line?

i replaced the front section from the HH to the main copper line under the drivers firewall (the section that came in the kit)

 

[Elk1111]

I’m stumped on this one...It’s weird that the the truck runs great once it’s started but won’t start in the first place. I phoned a guy that’s worked on these for many years and he says it’s got to be something really simple...fuel pick up, air, battery amps etc.. otherwise it would be running poorly also.
Please keep us posted on the outcome.

 

[Av3fire]

I’m stumped on this one...It’s weird that the the truck runs great once it’s started but won’t start in the first place. I phoned a guy that’s worked on these for many years and he says it’s got to be something really simple...fuel pick up, air, battery amps etc.. otherwise it would be running poorly also.
Please keep us posted on the outcome.

Batteries are fairly new (less than a year)..... in tank pump is brand new, air filter has been checked (physically - not just the dash indicator) and looks newish. If it sits a while like multiple days between starts, it may need 2 blasts of either...... once running, it only takes a little shot to restart....... I am not a mechanic and i have asked everyone i can think of and they do not have an answer either

Will report any findings

 

[frank8003]

66 M35a2, new to me
Starts on either and runs/drives good.
Idles around 900 rpm
when turned off, will not restart without more either.......
I have done the following: ~new injectors~Fuel shut-off moves freely and is
in the 7 o'clock position. Suggestions on what to check next?

Ether is not recommended for your very high compression engine even though it does not have glow plugs.
You do not want to hurt Her, not many left.
Perhaps the hydraulic head is simply wearing out and doesn't pump good at cranking speed? That is a guess.
Did you go thru the TM on troubleshooting no start condition?
Do you need the TM?

 

[Av3fire]

Ether is not recommended for your very high compression engine even though it does not have glow plugs.
You do not want to hurt Her, not many left.
Perhaps the hydraulic head is simply wearing out and doesn't pump good at cranking speed? That is a guess.
Did you go thru the TM on troubleshooting no start condition?
Do you need the TM?

i have a TM, but it appears to be a copy that tells what edits were done.... they are in red and it does not appear to be complete, but it was the only one i could find.
if you have a link, that would be awesome

 

[frank8003]

read

 

[fleetmech]

Did you buy it with this issue, or did it crop up after you've been running it for a while?

I can attest that, when correct, these fuel systems are self bleeding. Even when I had pulled and drained all six injectors, it only took a few rotations to purge them and start right up. If your lift pump is pushing fuel at any sort of pressure to the HH, you'll start even if theres air in the low pressure side.

Perhaps low boost pump pressure is causing an issue? Are you getting any signs of fuel in the engine oil?

I have also once seen this exact scenario (via the forums) on a B series Cummins. In that case it turned out to be a fractured timing drive gear on the crank that had shifted on the crank and thrown the pump/ valve timing off a bit. Shutting it off even momentarily would cause a crank/ no start, but a quick shot of sunshine and it would go all day. I don't mean to scare you with this story, but if you keep coming up empty, check the pump timing, and perhaps the gear timing (especially if it sat before you got it, or someone has been in there...) Perhaps it was installed incorrectly either by accident or an attempt to hot rod it by over advancing the timing. Maybe, just maybe the pump drive key is fractured?

 

[Av3fire]

Did you buy it with this issue, or did it crop up after you've been running it for a while?

I can attest that, when correct, these fuel systems are self bleeding. Even when I had pulled and drained all six injectors, it only took a few rotations to purge them and start right up. If your lift pump is pushing fuel at any sort of pressure to the HH, you'll start even if theres air in the low pressure side.

Perhaps low boost pump pressure is causing an issue? Are you getting any signs of fuel in the engine oil?

I have also once seen this exact scenario (via the forums) on a B series Cummins. In that case it turned out to be a fractured timing drive gear on the crank that had shifted on the crank and thrown the pump/ valve timing off a bit. Shutting it off even momentarily would cause a crank/ no start, but a quick shot of sunshine and it would go all day. I don't mean to scare you with this story, but if you keep coming up empty, check the pump timing, and perhaps the gear timing (especially if it sat before you got it, or someone has been in there...) Perhaps it was installed incorrectly either by accident or an attempt to hot rod it by over advancing the timing. Maybe, just maybe the pump drive key is fractured?

Thank you for the ideas.... at this point thats what im looking for.... things to chase down.
I bought it like this about a month ago.
I got the TM's in the post just prior to this one, so now i have a reference for where to start and a procedure to follow

 

[INFChief]

66 M35a2, new to me
Starts on either and runs/drives good.
Idles around 900 rpm
when turned off, will not restart without more either.......
I have done the following:
Drained and cleaned fuel tank.
new in-tank fuel pump
all new fuel lines and filter relocate kit
new injectors
Fuel shut-off moves freely and is in the 7 o'clock position

Suggestions on what to check next?

thanx in advance

Is this the dirty air engine or does it have a turbo?

 

[Av3fire]

Is this the dirty air engine or does it have a turbo?

has a turbo

 

[INFChief]

66 M35a2, new to me
Starts on either and runs/drives good.
Idles around 900 rpm
when turned off, will not restart without more either.......
I have done the following:
Drained and cleaned fuel tank.
new in-tank fuel pump
all new fuel lines and filter relocate kit
new injectors
Fuel shut-off moves freely and is in the 7 o'clock position

Suggestions on what to check next?

thanx in advance

Can you feel or hear the fuel pump working? Have you “cracked open” the fuel supply line to the filter to see if it is flowing?

 

[Elk1111]

When you replaced the pump did it come with a new pick up hose?