FLU419 SEE HMMH HME Owners group

[mogsrus]

Hello Bob

I am new to this forum and have a Agricultural version of the 406 Unimog which I just fitted a FL-4 loader off an SEE.
You mentioned that you have done that as well and I wonder about the hydraulic connections on yours and how the loader works for you.

My cylinders were leaking and after rebuilding the cylinders for the bucket function I cannot get the bucket to "curl" back any more.
The entire unit seems to be acting a little weird, meaning that the bucket function seems to influence the lift function.

Is there anything you could share with me in about this, possibly some photos.
I speak fluent German and still have contacts over there in case you need any assistance.

The Schmidt website shows all the parts etc.but the US has changed a few things such as mounting brackets, called "Anbau Konsolen".
My 406 has all sorts of attachments and sadly I had to remove my Schmidt Quick attachment plate for the SEE FL-4 loader because, unlike the German version, it cannot be used together which is sad.

Besides all the frame reinforcements and stronger front coil springs on the front of the SEE there are also some more very important details for using the FL-4 loader on a civilian 406.
It is supposed to have an entire sub frame support mounted under the chassis so the frame does not break under laod and stays flexible for off road use. Very elaborate set up and I have never actually seen one installed. Please let me know if you could help me figure out what's going on with my bucket function.

Best Regards

Thilo Kass / Prescott AZ / www.mogsrus.com / www.prescottbackcountry.com

 

[AZBrian]

FLU farm,
Can you please explain what you mean by "loader in float", regarding the loader lever being in the wrong position and hydraulic tools not working?

My hydraulic tools will not work. I get a very slow movement (if at all) of hydraulic fluid through the tool circuit. My SEE is in OR and I am in AZ now but as soon as I get back there, I am going to troubleshoot this issue. If the loader lever / loader position can cause the circuit to not work properly, I'd like to understand that better. Right now I was assuming that either I wasn't getting 24v at the solenoid valve (from a faulty tool switch or upstream electrical issue) or the solenoid valve itself was bad. Perhaps it is as simple as the loader position? It sounds like there is an air pressure switch in there somewhere too? I have good air pressure but that doesn't mean that the related air pressure switch/valve isn't bad as well. I didn't see that in the troubleshooting guide - just the tool switch and solenoid as possible root causes to the non-working tool hydraulics.

Thanks!!
Brian

 

[peakbagger]

With respect to the Schmidt Loader
If you haven't already done so it may help to download the various military technical manuals for the SEE. The parts breakdown manuals are sometimes quite handy in figuring things out.

 

[The FLU farm]

Can you please explain what you mean by "loader in float", regarding the loader lever being in the wrong position and hydraulic tools not working? Brian

Brian, the loader lever has four positions. Normally it sits in "neutral", then there are the up and down positions. If you push the lever down some more from the down position you'll feel that there's a fourth notch. It's kind of the opposite of the neutral position and lets the loader move freely.
I had put it in float a while back due to leaky front tires and forgot that I did.
I don't know the hydraulic system anywhere near well enough to say what's really going on, but suspect that the float position creates an "open loop", leaving very little pressure in the system.
Of course, it's fully possible that in your case the loader isn't in float but for whatever reason, the system thinks it is.
Or, you unknowingly pushed the lever all the way down while removing or reinstalling the doghouse, for example.
As far as I know, all the air pressure does is enabling the high idle circuit. The tools should run anyway, just not as effectively, I would think.
I'll post a photo later of the official "lever position" decal.

 

[The FLU farm]

My cylinders were leaking and after rebuilding the cylinders for the bucket function I cannot get the bucket to "curl" back any more. The entire unit seems to be acting a little weird, meaning that the bucket function seems to influence the lift function.

Thilo, my first thought was that the levers physically affect each other, but the fact that you had the cylinders off makes me rethink that.
Air in the system, maybe?

 

[mogsrus]

FL-4 Front Loader Problems

With respect to the Schmidt Loader
If you haven't already done so it may help to download the various military technical manuals for the SEE. The parts breakdown manuals are sometimes quite handy in figuring things out.

I am working on getting the SEE manuals downloaded but have already found the German manuals. They show a schematic for the hydraulics and show two valves which are supposed to be pressure valves in order to slow down the fluid flow for safety reasons when lowering the loaded bucket.
The bucket function was working a little bit before it started leaking a lot so I wonder if after rebuilding the cylinders if I just have a bunch of air trapped in the system and need to bleed it ?

Thanks for any advice !

Cheers

Thilo

 

[mogsrus]

The levers actually do feel like they are affect each other but I also tend to think about the air issue simply because it was sort of working before I had the cylinders off.
Might crack the lines to the cylinders today one by one and carefully apply a little pressure until fluid come out, then close them again and try.
If that does not work I am thinking that those weird pressure valves might have air trapped or such so I may bleed them too. The Schmidt diagram shows two of those valves with two different PSI ratings while I find only one of those on my SEE loader.

Thanks for the input and I will update as soon as I have more info.

Cheers

Thilo

 

[AZBrian]

If you push the lever down some more from the down position you'll feel that there's a fourth notch. It's kind of the opposite of the neutral position and lets the loader move freely. ...
... As far as I know, all the air pressure does is enabling the high idle circuit. The tools should run anyway, just not as effectively, I would think.

Thank you, Sir! I learned something new about the SEE front loader from you. My SEE doesn't seem to have decals remaining - like someone went around and removed them all. It is otherwise in good physical shape.


My tool switch does kick the RPMs up so I'd assume that the air pressure isn't a factor then. Likely electrical or the solenoid. I'll pass on what I find when I get to it. I was lucky to get all the standard hydraulic tools plus a brand new Stanley impact wrench. I've been wanting to put that chain saw to use and suspect that the impact wrench is going to be the only thing that will loosen those lug nuts...

 

[peakbagger]

One of the tech tips for the SEE is that the rear switches that control the remote throttle, loader and power tools all are subject to shorting due to water leakage into the wiring. I would start with running the electrical diagnosis to make sure its not a wiring issue.

 

[The FLU farm]

Brian, here you go. Float is a useful feature that I use on the tractor somewhat frequently, good for spreading/back dragging and such.
Don't think I ever used it on the SEE, except to allow the loader to conform to the leaky tires, but that's because I'm less bad at loader work with the tractor.

 

[Another Ahab]

Hello Bob
I am new to this forum and have a Agricultural version of the 406 Unimog which I just fitted a FL-4 loader off an SEE.
Thilo Kass / Prescott AZ / www.mogsrus.com / www.prescottbackcountry.com

Welcome to you from here in Virginia.

I had a cousin who went to school in Prescott AZ, before he died, sadly in an agricultural accident working a tractor on a slope.

Is there still a Prescott College in Prescott?

 

[burquedoka]

While I am in no way trying to discount Big Bison's issues with purchasing Unimog's, I have been a long time unimog owner and member of of Benz World and the unimog community as a whole. I feel compelled to step in here and state for the record that Couch is a well respected and trusted vendor, mechanic, seller, etc. I have no idea what went wrong with your transaction, but I know these things can get emotionally charged quickly, on both sides. Like I said, I don't discount that something is a miss with your deal dude, but I will not allow the **** talking to continue without stating my opinion, and many others for that matter, that Jay is a stand up dude and does not deserve to be ran out of town because something happened with your deal. I'm sure you'll be more than happy to attempt to **** down my throat now, go ahead.
Jays buisness is solid and he is not a swindler.

 

[FOD]

While I am in no way trying to discount Big Bison's issues with purchasing Unimog's, I have been a long time unimog owner and member of of Benz World and the unimog community as a whole. I feel compelled to step in here and state for the record that Couch is a well respected and trusted vendor, mechanic, seller, etc. I have no idea what went wrong with your transaction, but I know these things can get emotionally charged quickly, on both sides. Like I said, I don't discount that something is a miss with your deal dude, but I will not allow the **** talking to continue without stating my opinion, and many others for that matter, that Jay is a stand up dude and does not deserve to be ran out of town because something happened with your deal. I'm sure you'll be more than happy to attempt to **** down my throat now, go ahead.
Jays buisness is solid and he is not a swindler.

I'm not sure who runs this thread but I can say that I'd prefer that we try to keep this thread focused on helping idiots like myself solve our mechanical, electrical, hydraulic, etc..problems. Maybe another thread can be started for issues like Bison's. Can we please try to keep this thread moving in a positive direction to further our obsession? Caveat, I have been drinking this evening but I can say that the first 160ish pages of this thread have been mostly great, the last few not so much...

 

[Go Go Gadget FLU 419]

Ehh, he's kind of right there. ^

Anyone willing to measure the dipstick length and oil level yet? I'll mail someone a gob of the ceramic fuses in return!

 

[Andyrv6av8r]

Ehh, he's kind of right there. ^

Anyone willing to measure the dipstick length and oil level yet? I'll mail someone a gob of the ceramic fuses in return!

I just read this post; I'll get it for you today.

 

[88FLU419]

Long time no see folks. I was down with the sickness for a while, still haven't gotten caught up with reading this thread. I'm pretty depressed about my SEE. Anyone able and willing to give me the over all length of their motor oil dip stick, and the distance their full mark reads from the tip, and what their oil level is? What a headache...she ate all my money, now I'm broke, and too scared to use it until I know she is ok.

Just went out and measured oil dipstick. Overall is 19". Full is 1 3/4" from bottom. Low is 1/4" from bottom. Is your dipstick missing?

 

[Andyrv6av8r]

As requested

 

[The FLU farm]

Jubilations! After creating a berm with the plow, there was just enough snow to try out the snow blower. It worked.
While far from a real test, it did fling the little snow it could consume. Enough so that some of it ended up back on the roof it had fallen off of.Sorry, no action photo - the run was far too short for that.
Not only did the snow blower work. So did the windshield heaters, the heater, and the windshield wipers. None of which I'd tried until today.
This makes me feel comfortable enough to finish the job by making a mount for the connectors on the loader, and run the wiring for the chute's operation so it can be aimed as needed.
You didn't think I put the snow back up on the roof on purpose, did you?

 

[peakbagger]

Looks like its going to be mean snowblower. Nice build. Make sure you remember to add alcohol to the air brake system.

 

[The FLU farm]

Make sure you remember to add alcohol to the air brake system.

I thought about doing that yesterday. Honestly, I did.
Thanks for the reminder, peakbagger.