Found metal in my transfer case

[Mike929]

Well, I was changing all the fluids on my new GL purchased Deuce and had to wait/order the 9/16 pipe fitting for the transfer case drain plug. It came in last week and I proceeded to drain the case.

First concern is that the case sounded pressurized when I removed the plug. I have had some leaking around the speedometer cable, so a clogged vent would explain that concern.

Second (and major) concern was when I actually pulled the magnetic plug and there was a chunk of modern art on the end of it. After washing the metal sludge off the bigger fragments, it looks like one of the bearing cages. I can see at least one of the bearing holders/separators. No bearings and not enough metal for the entire cage.

Case seems to work fine. Brother remembers some whining sound that may have been the transfer case but nothing I could hear with my untrained ear.

Obviously this may not be an issue today, but must be fixed in order to have a reliable vehicle.

Where could I find a second transfer case that I could rebuild and swap out (with the purchase of a monster truck transmission jack), and/or a list of bearings, gaskets, etc., that I would need to buy before I start the job.

I really don't want to pull it until I am ready to go. Although not road worthy, I can at least move it around the yard under it's own power. It actually works perfectly fine, I guess until I start throwing ball bearings out or more of the cage comes apart.

I have also thought about buying a second truck for parts, but hard to get it home without a working deuce to pull it home and obviously, it may have a bad transfer case as well. Wanted to get some advice from the group on the best route to take on repair/replace.

(also any recommendations on where to buy a good jack to remove this. i.e., right tool for the job. )

I will try to add pictures of the metal bits, but basically small pieces of metal less then half the size of a pea, with one pea sized rectangle bit with a grove in it that would hold a 1/4 inch or bigger ball bearing. Brother said it is definitely a cage and not gear teeth, and he has the experience that would know. Obviously no bearings are loose at present.

Thanks,
Mike

 

[Wildchild467]

I had the exact same experience with the transfer case in my deuce. When I drained my oil I found a small piece of a bearing cage also. I'm not sure what to make of it but the TC works fine and never has given me a bit of trouble in the 10,000 miles I put on it since i bought it. It would be nice to tear it down and see exactly where it came from in both of our transfer cases, maybe the same place? I wonder what the cause could have been to make a bearing cage come apart?

 

[Mike929]

Uploaded a picture of the metal found in post 1. This is all the major pieces that came out. About the same mass (at most) in smaller pieces and dust in the form of slim around the magnet. Looks like at least three bearing cages.

 

[chicklin]

http://www.steelsoldiers.com/deuce/72735-transfer-case-wont-shift-into-low-2.html#post900180

Stick your finger in the drain hole and feel around on the left and right of the hole. There are low spots there where "stuff" can collect. The "stuff" I found is pictured in the link above.

 

[Mike929]

http://www.steelsoldiers.com/deuce/72735-transfer-case-wont-shift-into-low-2.html#post900180

Stick your finger in the drain hole and feel around on the left and right of the hole. There are low spots there where "stuff" can collect. The "stuff" I found is pictured in the link above.

"The answer I was looking for was that they throw in an extra bearing cage in every T-case, to knock off all the sharp edges from the gears."

Sounds like this is a more common problem then I expected.

Any luck finding a spare T-case or what the going price is for one?

I assume I need to park the truck to prevent total failure of the T-case even if the ball bearings haven't fallen out of the bearing yet?

 

[gringeltaube]

............................
Obviously no bearings are loose at present.

I wouldn't be so sure about that. Most likely at least one of the four BL210 has started to disintegrate and is about to spit out its balls....

G.

 

[chicklin]

"The answer I was looking for was that they throw in an extra bearing cage in every T-case, to knock off all the sharp edges from the gears."

Sounds like this is a more common problem then I expected.

Any luck finding a spare T-case or what the going price is for one?

I assume I need to park the truck to prevent total failure of the T-case even if the ball bearings haven't fallen out of the bearing yet?

Prices are all over the place. I found a rebuilt unit in the crate from a fellow SS member here near KC. I've seen rebuilt units listed (not necessarily sold) for anywhere from $300 to $900. Take-outs are in the same range (which is silly).

I would shop around and find one for less than $400.

 

[clinto]

Transfers are easy to service. I'd pull it out, disassemble, inspect, replace what's necessary and reassemble/reinstall.

Otherwise................. you may go 10K miles without issue or you may be 300 miles from home with a dead cell phone and a blown up transfer.

 

[chicklin]

Can you service them "in the can"? I'm going to stick my old one back in the shipping container when I swap them out and put it in the bed of the truck for now since I have nowhere else to put it. But, I would like to get into it and fix what needs fixing and sell it to try and get a few bucks back.

 

[Mike929]

"Obviously" may be a little strong. Lets just say no ball bearing joined the party at the bottom of the case.

Rebuilding it is definitely high on the list and preferred so I know everything is good. Are all the bearings and seals available at Napa or equivalent, or will I need to find surplus parts?

I don't plan on driving it until I have gone through the entire truck. Still have the rear axles, all the hubs and brake system to go through, so not really a threat of it becoming a daily driver any time soon. Still have 3 week wait for the title to come through so I can register it before it is even an option.

I'm not a big gambler when it comes to risking damage to my toys. I only gamble at GL auctions.

 

[gringeltaube]

..................
Are all the bearings and seals available at Napa or equivalent..............?
................................

I would say yes, if you had all numbers or dimensions, since parts are pretty much standard sizes. Although, the heavy duty BL210 with 15 balls could be more difficult to find. Good news is that NSK still offers them in their catalog. So, if Napa only had the equivalent #6210 I would try at any of the stores in your area, listed here: Ball Bearings and Roller Bearings l NSK Americas | NSK

G.

 

[KsM715]

I had the exact same experience with the transfer case in my deuce. When I drained my oil I found a small piece of a bearing cage also. I'm not sure what to make of it but the TC works fine and never has given me a bit of trouble in the 10,000 miles I put on it since i bought it. It would be nice to tear it down and see exactly where it came from in both of our transfer cases, maybe the same place? I wonder what the cause could have been to make a bearing cage come apart?

Is it possible its just left over residue from the last rebuild and whoever did the service neglected to clean the case thoroughly? (sp?) (shoot, guess its time to download that spell checker)

 

[mcmullag]

parts is parts

I found a small hunk of metal in my transfer case too when I drained it. This 1987 M335A2C air force reserves truck only had 13,800 miles on it when I got it, no rebuild.
I am not going to worry about it. Ignorance is bliss.

 

[chicklin]

I found a small hunk of metal in my transfer case too when I drained it. This 1987 M335A2C air force reserves truck only had 13,800 miles on it when I got it, no rebuild.
I am not going to worry about it. Ignorance is bliss.

That's a booger.

You should be fine.

 

[70deuce]

Found the exact same thing on mine. It was the front input shaft bearing. It appears that location is not the best lubed area of the transfer case.

 

[x-ray]

If you rebuild, Please keep us posted with with what you find and it would be great if you took some pics along the way.
I'm replacing my transfer case in my M109, there is a ton of metal in it after a catastrophic failure recently. When I got it, it was drained, and no metal on the plug, filled it up, ran fseemingly fine and within 100 miles, it was toasted and now there is a lot of metal in it. Unfortunately when it failed, it failed hard and ground something good.

It is not a good way to be disabled - the truck essentially locked up.


For me replacing is just going to be more easy, I found a 1989 transfer case that looks like new, but for all of us who face the transfer case problem and as parts dry up, documenting the rebuild repair process and what you find and learn along the way will be valuable. I hope to do an analysis of mine with pics when I get the old TC out of the 109. I just hope its before winter (which in NY could be just a month or 2 )with all my other projects.

 

[Mike929]

If you rebuild, Please keep us posted with with what you find and it would be great if you took some pics along the way.

I have no problem taking pictures and documenting what worked and didn't when I change the bearings. Glad to contribute, but would prefer to find a rebuilt/new t-case that I can install the same weekend after taking mine out. I guess at minimum, I want to have a list of parts I need to have on hand so I can drop mine, rebuild it and pop it in within a weekend (or at least within two weekends).

I don't like static displays sitting in the driveway, and would like to get this one registered and on the road sooner then later.

 

[chicklin]

To that end, after tomorrow, I'll have my take-out t-case and a shipping container left over after the swap. If anyone wants both, I'd give them away for free if you'll just come take them off my hands. Then, you could go through the rebuild process and take pics at your leisure.

I don't want to scrap this stuff and I may not have the time to work on the rebuild. If somebody can turn it into a learning experience for the rest of us, you can have them for free.

 

[x-ray]

That's sort of my dilemma, I have a static display in the driveway.
I too would rather quickly change into a good replacement than work through the unknown taking weeks or months to do it. I ended up picking up a good take out transfer case semi-local to me.

Shipping on these is expensive so its worth it to scope out for local. There may be T-Cases closer than you think. There are some scrap yards that might have parts, Look on Craigslist for guys that list the military axles in your surrounding cities. Some guys that collect the axles for monster trucks have T-Cases or the guy where they got the axles from has one - Its like playing detective.

Once you got it, it looks pretty strait forward.

I scoped out replacing the case, and talked with some people that take them in and out often and the best and safest way is to hoist it up from above. This requires taking out the passenger seat and the tranny and T-Case covers that are in the cab floor. Believe it or not, that doesn't take too long. Its a few bolts (have them soaking with kroil to make it easier) and not complicated.


Now we are going to hoist the T-case from aqbove with a steel beam support thats going to be above the cab. If you have a soft top, this is pretty easy. Here is a pic of the stripped cab area and T-case top.

Note, the T case is oriented leaning to one side, But I learned you can remove one bolt near the top, and suspend it from this point and it is essentially oriented the way you need it. I have a heavy duty transmission jack and I can't see how you can orient it safely and lift it without welding a special bracket for a jack.

I have a Harbor Freight ATV lift to move the T-Case on the ground. You need to remove the spare tire, to have good clearance to get it under the truck after the other one is out.

Removing & installing the T case itself doesn't look complicated, just everything is very heavy.

Best of luck.

 

[chicklin]

Which bolt do you use to suspend it? Seems like there should be more than one. This is the only part of the process I'm a little unsure on. Also, it looks like it's going to want to tilt backwards if you hook up to it anywhere where it is exposed through the floor. Do you need to catch it back by the e-brake, as well? I think you could get to that between the cab and bed.