Fuel sticker violation in NC

[panshark]

That ifta faq listed says something about operating in 2 or more jurisdictions. That may be the "out" many are looking for.

 

[nk14zp]

The op is posting about NC fuel stickers not ifta.

 

[Oldvw2]

Is not a Personel MV considered a recreational vehicle? If you are not making money with the vehicle, then what are you doing with it? Personal transportation? Are you having fun driving your MV? Is that not recreational? I know that I have a smile a mile wide after driving my M814, just ask my wife! I still think that IFTA stickers, or any fuel sticker, is just for folks that make money with their vehicles.

I know what you mean - as Jay says above each state is different. I'd bet he and I could both go ask enforcement the same question and get two different answers.

At my work we have both commercial and non-commercial vehicles plus farm and other heavy non-road equipment - so as part of dealing with that these are the answers I have gotten.
FWIW,
Chad

 

[zout]

https://etax.dor.ga.gov/motorfuel/mf_rules.aspx

See paragraph 2.
Fuel sticker is an IFTA fuel sticker and a license.
(International Fuel Tax Agreeement)

Interstate is the key word here not Intrastate.
Commercial is the other key word as many mentioned.

no comment on CDL.

I went back and read post 1 - I have no idea if our member was traveling Interstate and only that he was followed home. Not making a stink.
Another good reason my 109 was turned into an RV motorhome to travel Interstate.

 

[paulfarber]

Every State is going to be different. IFTA publishes a 'standard' set of rules, then each state makes changes as appropriate for their specific state.

So you have to look up the reg for the state you live in and ignore all the stuff people are posting unless they live where you do.

In PA an IFTA decal has two flavors - Intra State and Inter State.

I will not be getting an IFTA sticker in PA as I do not need one... or at least I think I can beat the ticket in court.

This is a double edge sword... the fines for NOT filing quarterly (forgetting to, filing late or improperly) can add up to more than a citation.

Most of what has been posted is correct.. but again, it will vary from state to state.

Can NJ hit a PA licensed vehicle for no IFTA sticker? Who knows... one would think that they would have to recognize PAs law of not requiring one... but I doubt you would talk the nice officer out of a ticket.... the court would have to be convinced.

 

[OldDominionIron]

I've done some looking into IFTA, and have talked with a man at the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration. IFTA controls the taxation of motor carriers between states. Any vehicle other than an RV with 3 axles is considered an "eligible vehicle" as far as IFTA is concerned. I was told since I'm not a motor carrier (described as using eligible vehicles for commercial use) I'm not required to fill out IFTA paperwork. The problem is IFTA doesn't distinguish between a commerical/privately owned vehicle in its definition of eligible vehicles.

NC is getting a bad reputation for events just such as you described, it's an easy way for the state to make money. I will never drive my truck into NC for just this reason. I've spent thousands of $$$$ in NC in the past, renting cottages in the outer banks, fishing trips out of Oregon Inlet, etc. but will certainly minimize my spending in NC in the future because of the state's attitude towards MV's.

I'm registered in Virginia, and after talking with the Virginia IFTA office, if I never drive outside of Virginia, no IFTA decal is required. By the way, IFTA stands for "Interstate Fuel Tax Agreement." Even applying for the "free" decal, if you don't submit the paperwork required you can get fined for that as well, and that could be thousand of bucks.

Too much hassle. It makes me wonder if it is one officer causing all the trouble. Time to start writing my congressmen.

 

[zout]

http://www.in.gov/dor/files/manual.pdf

 

[LanceRobson]

A few years ago I was thinking of buying a used "freight expediter" style box cargo truck with a big sleeper and was looking for information the least expensive way to register it for use at shows and was given this explanation by a NYS Trooper who was a sergeant on a commercial vehicle enforcement team. In another state your mileage may differ but he stated that these were the rules for interstate travel, too.

To call it an RV it must have a place to sleep, a water supply, a toilet and a way to cook. It must be registered as an RV and can weigh, in combination, up to 54K.

You can have a camp stove or microwave with a generator or inverter, a suitcase style chemical toilet, a 5 gallon can of water (or gallon jug), a cot etc but it must have RV plates.

I can't speak to NC law but the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration, on it web page, states that the determination of whether you are a "motor carrier" and what type you are is is made by: "This determination is based on self-classification of a company's planned business operation...."

If you are not a business company looking to transport items in interstate commerce you are NOT a motor carrier in the eyes of the feds. Just don't get caught hauling anything that even smells of commerce including anything for sale to or from a swap meet.

If I got caught in that case I'd likely try to say I was relocating some of my private military vehicle collection and let them try to prove otherwise.

I'm under no obligation to help them by answering any questions.

If I got stopped with someone else's truck in tow or with a truck load of someone else's stuff I'd say that I was helping out at no cost to them. The burden of proof would be on the cop.

Is the NC law quoted above in a section of law that refers to commercial vehicles?

Lance.

 

[m-35tom]

ok, sorry to disagree, but most of the opinions here are wrong. IFTA is federal and applies to everyone with 3 axles regardless of weight unless it is an RV. a deuce is most certainly not an RV and this has been tested in court. in PA you likely will get a ticket with a big fine. this has also gone to court and the fine was upheld. in most other ststes you will also get a ticket, it has nothing to do with commercial, historic tags, etc. if you have 3 axles, you will be violating the law if you do not have a sticker. same goes for any fuel other than taxed pump fuel. all these mixes people like to use to save fuel are illegile and eventually you may get caught.

now the thing to do is contact the revenue dept of your state as individual states can dictate how IFTA is enforced. for instance in maryland they have agreeded not to include historic tags under the program. in md you can also get a free pass good for 15 days to travel in other states and those states are supposed to honor it.

IFTA has been around for a long time and just has not been enforced. now with revenues low and states hurting for money i think you will start to see more of this.

tom

 

[k4vem4n]

Seems as though the law is just too vague on its specifics. There is no personal use classification in the law and therefore MV's have no place except in the wrong. But doesn't that go against innocent 'til proven guilty "show me where im wrong"
I say this detail needs to be addressed and an exception needs to be documented. Write a letter to your state representative! If they could only see this thread, and see how unclear these laws are for this group of recreational driver's. We only want to do right, but can't if the law isn't clear.

I was talking to a cop friend of mine and gave what little details I know about tagging and such.....he was absolutely clueless. I told him to read the statutes, he came back to me and said "ya learn something new everyday"
Now correct me if I'm wrong, an uninformed officer CAN become irate if he is told he is wrong. Now I respect my police, but there a few knuckleheads out there.

 

[westfolk]

Older thread.

http://www.steelsoldiers.com/politi...d-10-6-10-pa-mv-owners-aware-new-tactics.html

It is all in the wording of the law. As of today's date there is NO EXCEMPTIONS in PA for a vehicle with 3 or more axles. Having antique, classic, etc. plates DOES NOT matter. There are exemptions to the RULE though, i.e. camper, motor home. Even there you have to look up the PA vehicle code definitions, not Webster's. A motor home is a vehicle designed or used as a mobile dwelling, or OFFICE. I carry a laptop and breifcase with me these days. I have solid ground to argue mobile office.
I am still doing what I can to get the words of the law changed. Up hill battle and can see no summit yet, I try though.

People............this is their new way of getting money. Some of you may know what I mean when I say for years they didn't pay any attention to the "bridge law". As you know now even though the law didn't change they decided to use it......and now make a lot of money because of it.

 

[westfolk]

I failed to mention. In PA.........a motor carrier is anyone operating a "qualified vehicle". So if you are driving something with 3 axles or more(which is a "qualified vehicle") then you are a motor carrier.

Again, it is ALL in how they word it.

 

[doghead]

I know this thread is about NC law, not NY law but maybe some things are the same.

In NY you need to be a business to apply for an IFTA sticker. That conflicts with. MV hobbyist ownership. http://www.tax.ny.gov/pdf/2009/motor/ifta1_409.pdf

In NY a recreational vehicle is described as,

​

A recreational vehicle is a vehicular unit which is designed and constructed to be used as a temporary dwelling for travel, recreational and vacation purposes. It may either be selfpropelled (a motor home), or non-self-propelled designed and constructed to be drawn by a motor vehicle (a travel trailer) or placed upon and attached to a motor vehicle (a truck camper).

In NY a motor carrier is any operator of a vehicle.

 

[1995USAFRetE6]

Hmmmm... "Bobber with a cab-over camper," What do you think? No IFTA needed? Or am I... well...

 

[Flyingvan911]

We need a federal exeption for MV's that are not being used comercially. An exemption that no state can change.

 

[DieselBob]

We need a federal exeption for MV's that are not being used comercially. An exemption that no state can change.

IMHO there should be an exemption / rule change so that IFTA or any state sticker and or fuel license covers only vehicles engaged in commerce regardless of weight or number of axles. But then again that would make sense and not place a burden on the common citizen. So much for that idea.

 

[paulfarber]

If you get a non-IFTA PA decal you only have to do a filing once per year, instead of the IFTA quarterly. BUT if you fail to file you still get fined for not filing... so you have two ways to lose.

PLUS if you want to go out of state (PA) you need a 'trip ticket' thats $50 and only good for 5 days.

Nothing in the PA code has changed.. and unless Frank Brenneman | Revenue Research Analyst
PA Department of Revenue starts showing up at your hearings to 'splain it all to the nice judge you have a decision to make:

Register PA non-IFTA and 'shut up and pay your taxes'
OR
Run without an hope the LEO has bigger fish to fry.

It does seem that other states do have more sane definitions of the law.. but unless the few dozen (maybe a hundred?) MV owners get together and lobby (OH NOES!!! You filthy lobbiests!) for an exemption (like the farmers have) PA is SOL.

 

[paulfarber]

Some google fu:

2010 Pennsylvania Code
Title 75 - VEHICLES
Chapter 96 - Motor Carriers Road Tax
9602 - Definitions.


"Recreational vehicle." Vehicles such as motor homes, pickup trucks with attached campers and buses when used exclusively for personal pleasure by individuals. In order to qualify as a recreational vehicle, the vehicle shall not be used in connection with any business endeavor."

Seems like 'SUCH AS" gives some wiggle room. I think this would get you out of a citation if properly framed.

 

[73m819]

Somewhere in this thread, someone QUIOTED the IFTA regs., it gave the exemptions, one of them was TOW COMPANIES, does that mean those of us that own WRECKERS are exempt ???????

"Tow trucks or wreckers designed and exclusively used in the business of towing or otherwise rendering assistance to abandoned, disabled or wrecked vehicles"

 

[mistaken1]

A. When do I need an International Fuel Tax license and decal?
You are required to have an IFTA license if you operate in two or more jurisdictions and the power unit:

• Has two axles and a gross vehicle weight or registered gross vehicle weight of 26,001 lbs. or higher;
• Has three or more axles regardless of weight; or
• Is used in combination and the said combination is 26,001 lbs or higher.

What is the definition of operate? Operate as in operating a motor vehicle aka driving or operate as in operating a business as a motor carrier for hire?