Georgia MV Title Problems

[glcaines]

I visited the Georgia Motor Vehicle Division last week to apply for titles for three MVs I just acquired from GL. I had SF97s and Bills of Sale for all three vehicles, a 1969 Kaiser Jeep M35A2, a 1968 M105A2 trailer and a 1992 M116A2 trailer. I was told that I needed to have the VIN numbers verified by law enforcement on a Form T-22B. I returned to my county ahd the Sheriff's office completed all three of the T-22Bs.

I returned to the GA MVD today and was told that I could not apply for Georgia titles for MVs with an SF97 because the VIN numbers were less than 17, the current standard for newly manufactured vehicles. I objected and requested a supervisor. The supervisor reinforced what the first person told me - no titles. This even applied to the 1992 trailer, which under GA law requires a title before a tag can be issued.

I contacted my county tag office and they told me that the GA MVD was wrong and that I can get titles for all three vehicles and that for the 1992 M116A2 trailer, they could not issue a tag for the trailer without a title since it was manufactured after 1985. Under GA regulations titles are optional for vehicles manufactured between 1963 - 1985 and mandatory for newer vehicles. This is clear from the MVD website: MVD | Is a Title Required for My Vehicle?

Has anyone else had these problems or have any ideas? I really want titles for the vehicles as it is much easier to sell them later if I ever decide to.

 

[papercu]

Under GA regulations titles are optional for vehicles manufactured between 1963 - 1985

It said IF you meet the requirements, do you?
I've never had a problem selling one later with just a bill of sale. Wayne

 

[jimm1009]

This is true but what if you needed to sell one quick for one reason or another.
You would not get any out of state buyers to bite without a title.

Food for thought but if your state says it is o.k. like that thenI say do what is right for you at this time.
My 1.7 cents worth.
Good luck & above all else, THINK O.D. Green!
jimm1009

 

[Peepaw]

.

I returned to the GA MVD today and was told that I could not apply for Georgia titles for MVs with an SF97 because the VIN numbers were less than 17, the current standard for newly manufactured vehicles. I objected and requested a supervisor. .

.

Why is you vin less than 17 digits? I have a 69 also and my vin is 17 digits long.

 

[jimm1009]

A deuce VIN is not really a VIN but a serial number in stead.

It should like this example; 0254-12367
This is the whole serial number but you may have one that has the registration number in the same line with a couple of spaces between.

An example of a registration number is NKO4J4.

jimm1009

 

[terrynash]

Gary, I just titled my M109A2 in Gwinnett county today with trailer and had no problems except for the fact that I insisted the clerk call the State office to clarify since she said it couldn't be done. The phone call cleared it all up and I walked away with a title number on the receipt and title will be mailed to me. Many times the clerks think they know and you have to be very persistant that they call in to the State office. She initially claimed that title not needed for a 1973 vehicle but I persisted Hope this helps.

Terry Nash, Lilburn, GA

 

[Peepaw]

A deuce VIN is not really a VIN but a serial number in stead.

It should like this example; 0254-12367
This is the whole serial number but you may have one that has the registration number in the same line with a couple of spaces between.

An example of a registration number is NKO4J4.

jimm1009

Mine taken directly off of the plate on the dash is 17 digits. That's what the cops sent out to verify mine copied down. I wasn't trying to get a title though.

 

[glcaines]

Terry,
Towns County is telling me the same thing you stated. It was the State office that I am having problems with. I went to the State MVD office in Hapeville where you can receive the title immediately if you have the correct paperwork. I'm going to write a letter to the head of the MVD department with a copy of their own regulations and see what response I get.

I have applied for Ga titles on older civilian vehicles in the past with less than 17 digits in the VIN. The last one was only six months ago, and I never had any problems.

 

[Shizzlemah]

17 digit VINs were not required before ~1978 or so....

What happens if you bought a 55 chevy with a shorter vin ? would they not title it, or force you to get a state-assigned 17-digit VIN?

 

[clinto]

I wish I could help you, I've titled 3 Deuces (well, clinto g/f and myself) in Ga. all with no issues.

Same thing as you.... SF97, LEO inspection, take paperwork to DMV, wait, title arrives, voila.

Me thinks your tag office is incorrect. Mine has never mentioned the issue w/17 character vins.

Also agreed that having a title makes selling easier.

 

[glcaines]

I haven't given up yet. I find it interesting that the Towns County tag people seem to know more about the regulations than the State MVD does.

I planned to go for another visit today, but had some unfortunate luck. I have a Cessna 152 airplane and I suffered engine failure on take off today. Luckily, I still had runway ahead of me although I was already about 50 feet in the air and I came down hard at the end of the runway in the grass. Not a scratch on the airplane or me, but I'm still thinking about it.

 

[appalachiantraildeuce]

I am waiting for my SF97. Requested it about 3 weeks ago. I called the Douglas County, GA tag office and was clearly told that I can not get a title because of the age and 15 digit VIN. I wonder if I were to give her someone else's tag or VIN that IS titled and have her look it up, she could see that it is okay in GA. Can't wait for that appointment. Like pulling a tooth.

How long do the SF97s usually take?

 

[TaylorTradingCo]

I live and work in Georgia and have sold many Deuces out of state without titles. The last truck I sold was to a guy in Texas and I have sold a couple to guys in Florida and one in West Virginia.

Sure it is a hassle getting a tag for them, but isn't it always a hassle when you go to the tag office? Their standard operating procedure is to tell you you don't have enough information the first time you come in no matter what.

Derek Taylor

 

[papercu]

I live and work in Georgia and have sold many Deuces out of state without titles.

That is the way it's been for me to. But if you think you really need a title, just go to any insurance co. that handles bonds and they will get one for you. Price depends on the value you tell them, the last time I checked the minimum amount was around 150.00. Wayne

 

[ida34]

Why is you vin less than 17 digits? I have a 69 also and my vin is 17 digits long.

If you vin is 17 digits long then you are either looking at the wrong numbers or the number on the dataplate is wrong. Sometimes the vin number on the data plate ends up being a combination of the registration number and the serial number. The serial number is the only one that should be used. Check your frame near the steering box for the serial number. This is the only number you should be using. Registration numbers on vehicles change if the vehicle goes through a depot rebuild or is transfered to another service. The serial number stamped on the frame is the only number that does not change. I have seen people that have gotten a title with the registration number on it instead of the serial number and this is not correct.

On another note, a true 17 digit vin can be decoded and had a "check" digit that is drived from an algorithm. The check digit is there to detect a fraudulant vin. Sometimes cucv's have problems because they do have 17 digit vins but they do not decode like a blazer or truck. The check digit still works. Only digits 12 -17 are unique. A like vehicle with the same equipment and built at the same plant will have the same first 11 digits except for the check digit. The 17 digit vins were mandated in 1981 and newer cars. Before this the vin was purely a serial number and the length and composition was determined by the maker of the vehicle. Vins or serial numbers were made mandatory starting in 1954. It was not a legal requirement to have a serial number or vin number on cars built before 1954 but most did have them for a way to identify them.

Back to the problem at hand. If you have a title and registration that is 17 digits long on a 1969 Deuce then you need to get the paperwork changed to reflect the frame serial number only.

 

[BugEyeBear]

IF one DMV/Tag Office can't handle an unusual title or registration you might be better served at ANOTHER DMV/Tag Office! Sometimes it is simply easier to find a smarter monkey than to attempt to educate the monkey you have!

I agree that the DMVs can easily confuse the contract number & the serial number. The serial number is the one that should be used.

GA can be tricky for getting a title on older vehicles.
They are not very flexible, and typically don't know how to handle anything that deviates from a "normal" car/truck. Military S/Ns can really boggle their mind. And not having an existing title that has been directly assigned to you (as the new owner) is a show-stopper!

I still have a place back up in Michigan, so I have been titling all of my "TOYS" in MI. They are MUCH easier to deal with, know how to handle vehicles w/o existing titles, don't even blink when unusual VINS (military vehicles, vintage cars, older imports) show up, and their vintage plates & regs are good for 10 years (with a one time fee!). Fortunately none of the GA cops in my area even bother to question the out-of-state tags!

All GA is accomplishing is lost revenue for the state!

OH & I agree that selling a vehicle w/o a title will usually result in a lower sales price because the lack of a title scares off many prospective buyers.
This has allowed me to pick up quite a few bargains!
& ALL of these cars/trucks now have valid titles! (Not difficult, you just need to know how...)

-Bear-

 

[glcaines]

I finally received a Georgia title for my Deuce! I went back a second time and was told the same thing I was told the first time. No title for MVs with less than 17 digit VINs. I went back a third time , each time seeing someone different, but the same manager, and when I was told the same thing again I lied and told them that DOD wanted the names of anyone at the state title office that was violating the agreement between DOD and the State of Georgia. They blinked and issued me a title! It took less than five minutes for me to get my title once they decided to issue it.

 

[ABN173]

I finally received a Georgia title for my Deuce! I went back a second time and was told the same thing I was told the first time. No title for MVs with less than 17 digit VINs. I went back a third time , each time seeing someone different, but the same manager, and when I was told the same thing again I lied and told them that DOD wanted the names of anyone at the state title office that was violating the agreement between DOD and the State of Georgia. They blinked and issued me a title! It took less than five minutes for me to get my title once they decided to issue it.

WoW I am sorry it came down to that, but I am glad to hear it worked out for you. When I registered my M1009 down in Columbus they let me register it but no title, they said I had to use a title service if I wanted one.

-Dale

 

[twright]

I was told that if a truck did not have a title from another state 1985 and back Ga. would not issue title just need bill of sale 1986 and above they would title.

 

[glcaines]

I read the Georgia regs on titles. The law says that titles are mandatory in Georgia for vehicles manufactured after 1985 and that before 1985 that titles are optional, back to 1963. No titles are ever issued pre-63. However, the law also says that a title will not be issued on a pre-1985 vehicle unless an existing title is in the name of the person applying for the title. This covers people relocating from other states with an out of state title. However, an SF97 form is supposed to serve the same purpose as an existing title when applying for a new title. The state also requires a Form T-22B to verify the VIN number and this can be completed by law enforcement or a county tag office. You also need the bill of sale. The problem is that they were not following their own regulations.