HMMWV FNG--Looking for Feedback/Info

[RussMac]

New to the forum and looking for any input on the govplanet HMMWV auctions. I've got a couple friends that have purchased from them and have had great luck on their HMMWV's in regards to conditions and working capabilities. I am starting to search for one as well. I'm not looking for a perfect never been driven before but I am looking for basic non damaged function with the most reliable set up on engine/trans combo. I will be working on it, have access to any tools and parts needed, have a shop to work on it and store it. It will not be a daily driver. Used for nice "winter" days, heading to the coast/beach and running kids back and forth to sports. I live in Texas so titling and insurance is not a problem. A couple of questions on what they list:

1 Oil Analysis-How do you interpret the %'s? What's acceptable or bad. I have a 6.5L duramax and have had good luck with proper maintenance. Never had an oil analysis.
2. Reading forums it looks like the 6.5 is the best option of the 2 engines. What say you? Pros and Cons?
3. How do I tell if it's a 6.2 or a 6.5 from the pics? I have read that they have listed the incorrect motor/transmission on some auctions.
4. A post said to look for a "CARC" HMMWV. He said this means it has been updated/refurbed by the military/contractor. How can I tell if this has been completed?
5. Anything else I need to ensure?
6. Looking for a softtop 4 seater with minimal damage.

Thanks for any helpful info or insight you may have.

 

[Coug]

1) I've never done an oil analysis, and my truck didn't have one listed, so no idea. Most of these trucks spend a large portion of their life being started once a week and idled for 30+ minutes every time, with the occasional drive (or at least that was my experience with them in the Army)

2)6.5 is better than the 6.2 for certain. The later ones, post 2004 I believe, are an even better version (6.5 Optimizer, a non-gm made block that uses better alloys for the castings)

3)the biggest thing is looking at the back of the block, I don't have it handy but there are plenty of images of the differences if you do a search. Also the serpentine belt setup is more likely to be on the 6.5.

4) "CARC" is "chemical agent resistant coating" which is a fancy term for the paint like coating the military uses on pretty much everything. I hadn't heard anything about any HMMWVs being uncoated, but that doesn't mean they weren't.
Most military vehicles/engine operated equipment gets sent to rebuild on a regular basis (something like every 10 years or so) to have a complete go through and fix anything wrong. Even if it has no usage. My M1123 had 32 miles when I picked it up, and the rebuild plate said it was done at 26 miles.

5)Hopefully someone else chimes in on this one

6)they are out there, or you can do the conversion to 4 door soft top yourself, it's easy enough that even the Army can do it.

Just be patient, there are plenty of them out there for sale, so finding one with what you're looking for shouldn't be that hard.

 

[Crapgame]

welcome to the party, pal!

CARC, just because it has CARC paint doesn't mean it has been through a factory thorough overall. We had our active duty vehicles repainted by Post Support BN or the civilian maintenance shop every couple or three years. The Vehicle should have a rebuild/overhaul plate on the B Pillar web behind the driver's seat, showing date and organization performed the overhaul.

Attached tag happens to be for a 1995 M1025A2 that was overhauled at Letterkenny Army Depot (LEAD) as part of the GMV program.

The other is an M1123 Marine Corps Logistics Base-Barstow Overhaul tag on a GP 2004 or 2005 original mfg A2 series truck.

Seems lately Ritchie Bros have been slapping a fresh coat of tan, Camo Green or 3 color NATO camo paint on some of the auction trucks to help drive up the prices.

Since you want a rag top anyway not a slant/hard top, I'd shoot for a GP A2 series truck like an M1097A2 or M1123 with the heavier suspension, 6.5l NA engine, NP242 transfer case and the 4L80E 4-speed transmission. Its possible to upgrade an A0 or A1 truck to the 4L80E but it takes quite a bit of work and expense. You're better off getting it on a factory truck I've seen the M1123 and M1097A2 runners selling for $9000-12,000.

I just sold a 1987 A0 for $10,5000 last month, FL titled, so same price for the improved A2 series truck is worth the 3rd party titling expense if you have to go that route.

 

[RussMac]

Thanks for the info Coug. Where would I find the rebuid/refurb plate stating the date it was completed? I have only come across one that was obvious due to the plate being riveted to the B pillar door jamb. It also has CARC stenciled on the doghouse with a "Maine" decal on it.

 

[RussMac]

Thanks Crapgame. I've only come across one of those tags so far. If there is no tag is it safe to assume that this refurb has never been completed or does every military vehicle go through this reconditioning no matter if they tag it or not?

 

[Coug]

if it's been refurbed, there will be a tag on it on the pillar there, I haven't heard of any that didn't.
There's always the chance the trucks have been sitting in a field somewhere for a couple decades being ignored, but that's highly unlikely. Every vehicle should have gone through refurb at some point in it's life if it's over 10-12 years old. If it's not marked though, it never happened. There are a few safety updates they did over the years, so it will have some type of tag somewhere.

I took a quick look at some of the GP auctions. 4 different vehicles in 4 different locations had 4 different tags on them. One just said overhauled at XXX and the number of miles on it, another was a full data replacement plate showing the overhaul date, but the original data plate is no longer there (mine was like that) and the others are in between those amounts of info.

Okay, did find one with a 1990 build date on the tag, with no rebuild plate, and no MWO tags on it either (modification work order, just means they did an update/fix to it that wasn't necessarily at a rebuild center) so there are some out there.

If it's not documented, then it never happened. Even if it did happen, there is no proof of it, and someone would get their butt reamed if anything bad happened because of it, so safe to assume it didn't happen.

If you're planning on going onto the highway you definitely want the 4 speed transmission in it. The 1097 and the 1123 will definitely have that. The M998A2 should also have it, where the A1 and A0 will not unless it's been upgraded by someone because the original failed for whatever reason, or maybe it got upgraded at rebuild.

Downside of the 1097 and 1123 is they have the heavy suspension, which is extremely stiff. Plus side though is they have the upgraded seats, so it isn't so bad. Only difference between the two is the 1097 belonged to the Army and has the airlift bumper on it, where the 1123 was from the Marines and doesn't have the rear bumper, but has everything for the deep water fording kit installed except the snorkel, one vent line that goes on with the snorkel, and the exhaust pipe sticking up (and a different cap on the bottom of the air filter canister, instead of a duckbill valve to purge dust) Price difference between adding the bumper as opposed to the deep water fording kit is a toss up most of the time (though the fording kit complete can cost more), but most people will never have any use for the snorkel system, but the rear pumper is a lot easier to install than the fording kit.

So taking a look, I guess some of these really have been sitting for decades, I see a 998 in Kansas on GP with bias ply tires on it, which were phased out a long time ago.

 

[RussMac]

This is listed as a 2009. Is that because it was refurbed in '09? Also, this one has the 6.5 and 4 speed trans. It says only 49 miles. Can this be accurate? Vehicle looks to be really clean but a new coat of paint will do that. Looks to have the a/c mounted in the bed as well. I'm assuming if all this info is accurate it will be an auction that will price out pretty high.

 

[86humv]

This is listed as a 2009. Is that because it was refurbed in '09? Also, this one has the 6.5 and 4 speed trans. It says only 49 miles. Can this be accurate? Vehicle looks to be really clean but a new coat of paint will do that. Looks to have the a/c mounted in the bed as well. I'm assuming if all this info is accurate it will be an auction that will price out pretty high.

Thats not an 09...its a 2001, or 2002 based on S.N.
A/C is laying in the bed after they removed the armor package.

 

[Crapgame]

Russ, that truck has a broken Left Front Control Arm suspension spring, Photos 7 & 23, see it sagging on that front corner? Probably an PFC driving it like he stole it. You have to have a spring compressor to compress the replacement stout armor truck spring enough for the control arms to go back together with the shock inside.

The fording exhaust bracket has pulled through the wheelhouse side, too, probably from the same abusive driving style.

 

[Coug]

This is listed as a 2009. Is that because it was refurbed in '09? Also, this one has the 6.5 and 4 speed trans. It says only 49 miles. Can this be accurate? Vehicle looks to be really clean but a new coat of paint will do that. Looks to have the a/c mounted in the bed as well. I'm assuming if all this info is accurate it will be an auction that will price out pretty high.

Look at the rebuild tag. It says "Odometer reading at time of IROAN 13202. Speedometer probably failed so they tossed in a new one, no requirements to set a new one to the old reading or write the actual miles anywhere.

As 86humv said, it's an 09 rebuild, not an 09 build.

Aircon is just lying there, so take a couple extra straps to secure it if you buy one of these. System will be drained of coolant and fittings loose, as they went through the armor plates and got disconnected when armor was stripped off.

Not sure what they're going for these days, but in the spring when I bought mine there were a half dozen sold that day, odometer listings were as low as 10 miles on them.
The one I picked up had an odometer that said 32 miles. Tag on it was dated 2010 and said it was rebuilt with 26 miles on them (my serial number places it about 2000 for build date). Price I paid before fees and taxes and all that crap was a little under $16k, and most of the trucks went in the $17-19k range that day, and they were all pretty much identical.

 

[RussMac]

Thanks for the info. I forgot that that coil spring is extra HD and not a common truck coil spring. This one was the first one to catch my eye and meet my needs. Is there a way to see what MWO those #'s correspond to what was completed? Nothing on the Googles or any other SE. I don't mind the 41K. I would think that means it was a reliable and maintained and available unit. Keeps the seal/gaskets from drying out and getting brittle. Minimize the fuel going bad and all the other diesel items from sitting. What say you?
This one is th 6.5 with the tach mounting bolt on the passenger side of the block.

 

[RussMac]

Tho only negative on this one is the oil leak. I'm assuming from the rear main. Can these be accessed easier in a HMMWV layout to change or are the a bear as well like in a commercial truck?

 

[Coug]

MWO list over on G503 website

https://forums.g503.com/viewtopic.php?t=89631