Hydramatic oil cooler question

[68FB]

Hi, I work at a military museum in Oshawa, Ontario, Canada, and I'm rebuilding the two Hydramatics that sit in front of two Caddy flathead V8's in a 1945 Chaffee tank. These trannies were specific to tanks but are similar to the ones used in the M135. I know the Chaffee uses the same oil cooler in the tranny pan as the M135, so it likely uses the same seals that stop coolant mixing with tranny oil. I badly need those seals. Anyone know who can supply them?

Malcolm

 

[DDoyle]

My suggestions would be to try Brian Asbury or Memphis Equipment Company.

Hope this helps,
David
www.DavidDoyleBooks.com

 

[NDT]

You are quite correct, the ORD9 G749 parts book for the M135 lists the part as a G200 part, ORD p/n 5342366. It is described as Seal rubber 1.25" ID, 1.875 OD, 9/32 thk. This is a McMaster Carr item. Maybe upgrade to Viton. Oh and welcome to Steelsoldiers, hope we can help with your Chaffee restoration. Brent Mullins Jeep Parts has a huge selection of Chaffee parts.

EDIT: Incorrect, McMaster Carr does not have this item.

 

[68FB]

You are quite correct, the ORD9 G749 parts book for the M135 lists the part as a G200 part, ORD p/n 5342366. It is described as Seal rubber 1.25" ID, 1.875 OD, 9/32 thk. This is a McMaster Carr item. Maybe upgrade to Viton. Oh and welcome to Steelsoldiers, hope we can help with your Chaffee restoration. Brent Mullins Jeep Parts has a huge selection of Chaffee parts.

5342366, and 5342367, are the parts I need. 5342367 is a simple, circular fibre gasket I can make if I have to, but 5342366 is an unusual u-shaped seal, like those used in valve stem packing. Is this what you saw in McMaster Carr? Do you have their part number?

malcolm

 

[m1010plowboy]

G749 trans cooler

Our Prairie M135 Goat team did a cooler R&R twice this year because that nut needs to be torqued correctly or....a guy will need to do it twice. Be careful and be sure to get it right the first time. I'm still on the learning curve so really appreciate the vid that you dropped on MLU on air pressure band changes. If you don't have phone numbers to Brian Asbury or Niagara truck they are in the MVPA Supply Line mag. or let me know and I'll dig one out of the loo.

Just checked the G749 parts list to see if we had a "New" replacement for 5342366 and didn't see it so put a call out to the Goat team. They kept receipts so will check on what they used. Here is the link to the parts list for future reference. I have complete transmission kits so if you're still struggling next week maybe on could fall off the shelf and spill those parts loose.

http://www.steelsoldiers.com/showthread.php?137722-G749-Parts-List



Here is the schematic.

 

[68FB]

5342366, and 5342367, are the parts I need. 5342367 is a simple, circular fibre gasket I can make if I have to, but 5342366 is an unusual u-shaped seal, like those used in valve stem packing. Is this what you saw in McMaster Carr? Do you have their part number?

malcolm[/QUOTE

Photo below:

]

 

[68FB]

Our Prairie M135 Goat team did a cooler R&R twice this year because that nut needs to be torqued correctly or....a guy will need to do it twice. Be careful and be sure to get it right the first time. I'm still on the learning curve so really appreciate the vid that you dropped on MLU on air pressure band changes. If you don't have phone numbers to Brian Asbury or Niagara truck they are in the MVPA Supply Line mag. or let me know and I'll dig one out of the loo.

Just checked the G749 parts list to see if we had a "New" replacement for 5342366 and didn't see it so put a call out to the Goat team. They kept receipts so will check on what they used. Here is the link to the parts list for future reference. I have complete transmission kits so if you're still struggling next week maybe on could fall off the shelf and spill those parts loose.
http://www.steelsoldiers.com/showthread.php?137722-G749-Parts-List
Here is the schematic.

View attachment 670494

Thanks, we get a lot of stuff from Brian. I'll see what he's got.

I see the nuts that clamp these cooler seals need 150 ft-lb torque, according to the M135 tranny manual. I'll give it my best shot but I'm not sure my spanner wrench is up to that, even with a cheater bar. I'll aim for red-faced tight - if I find seals.

I have that part list but I can't find anyone selling the 5342366 and 5342367 seals, so if you found them, or a substitute, that would be fantastic. The commonly available rebuild kits don't come with them because civilian Hydramatics don't have this cooler, it was military spec only.

I thought I was golden coming over here to ask the guys with the Hydramatics in their trucks, but I see from searching these trannies cause some grief and people struggle with rebuilds. I'm getting worried about finding these parts. I really don't want to reuse the old ones, although there is some leeway as there's a drain port in the cavity between the fibre washer that seals the coolant side and the u-cup seal that seals the oil side. So if one or both seals leak, the oil or coolant will just leak onto the floor.

Malcolm

 

[68FB]

Our Prairie M135 Goat team did a cooler R&R twice this year because that nut needs to be torqued correctly or....a guy will need to do it twice. Be careful and be sure to get it right the first time. I'm still on the learning curve so really appreciate the vid that you dropped on MLU on air pressure band changes. If you don't have phone numbers to Brian Asbury or Niagara truck they are in the MVPA Supply Line mag. or let me know and I'll dig one out of the loo.
Just checked the G749 parts list to see if we had a "New" replacement for 5342366 and didn't see it so put a call out to the Goat team. They kept receipts so will check on what they used. Here is the link to the parts list for future reference. I have complete transmission kits so if you're still struggling next week maybe on could fall off the shelf and spill those parts loose.
http://www.steelsoldiers.com/showthread.php?137722-G749-Parts-List
Here is the schematic.

View attachment 670494

The M135 manual says torque those nuts to 140 ft-lb! I'm not sure my spanner wrench is up to that. If not, I'll aim for red-faced tight. There is some leeway - the cavity between the gasket on the coolant side and the u-cup seal on the oil side has a drain port so if one or both leak, it ends up on the floor and acts as a heads-up (as you probably know).

We get quite a few parts from Brian. He has the cooler which we also need. I'll call him.

If you found a supplier of these seals or a substitute, that would be fantastic!

I've found the commonly available kits don't have these seals, as civilian vehicles didn't have these coolers. They were military only, Chaffee, M5, M135.

I found that parts list but I can't find anyone selling the 5342366 and 5342367 seals.

Malcolm

 

[NDT]

Sorry bout that, the picture in the manual looked like an O ring, McMaster does not have u-shaped parts that I know of. Now I understand your predicament.

 

[USMC 00-08]

I would also ask these guys if they have the seal.

http://www.fatsco.net/hydramatic.html

That rubber seal looks like some used in old style hydraulic cylinders. Maybe a hydraulic shop could help?

If you find a modern replacement that works, will you post the part number so I can add it to our parts list that plowboy posted the link to?

 

[68FB]

As Dave Doyle suggested above, I contacted Brian asbury. He has a Hydramatic seal and gasket kit specific to the G749 that includes these cooler seals. One is on its way. The bonus is he is not that far away from me so no long waits and no hassle with customs.
Malcolm

 

[USMC 00-08]

Could you post up some measurements of those seals so we can try to find a modern equivalent?


Does it look like this? I can't tell from the picture.

https://www.grainger.com/product/GRAINGER-APPROVED-5-16-Hydraulic-U-Cup-with-2HZV3?s_pp=false&picUrl=//static.grainger.com/rp/s/is/image/Grainger/2HZU3_AS01?$smthumb$

 

[68FB]

No, not that type of hydraulic packing, but very like the "Vee Packing" shown on this site:

http://www.veepacking.com/

The shape the diagram shows as, "Female adapter (top)" is actually machined into the wall between the coolant compartment and the oil compartment.

The part shown as "V ring (centre ring)" is the seal I need.

And the part listed as "Male adapter (bottom)" is a shaped steel ring that is pressed hard into the v-ring by the nut on the cooler nozzle.

I'll post some some more pics and dimensions.
Malcolm

 

[68FB]

Here's a sketch of the setup, with the chevron seal sizes, which are as NDT posted above.

It also shows the dimensions of the steel expanding ring and the gasket on the cooler side of the pan wall.

Note the leak-off port drilled in the pan wall. This allows any oil or coolant leaking into the interspace to leak out onto the floor, rather than pressurize the interspace and leak through the other seal.

Malcolm

 

[68FB]

I checked out the v-cup packing i got in the g749 seal kit from Brian asbury. They had " AN6225-25 moulded into the rubbber which is a standard v-cup packing part number. Looks like a few companies sell these.

Malcolm

 

[m1010plowboy]

Oil Cooler Seals

I checked out the v-cup packing i got in the g749 seal kit from Brian asbury. They had " AN6225-25 moulded into the rubbber which is a standard v-cup packing part number. Looks like a few companies sell these.

Malcolm

This just keeps getting better, thank you! Found these in a package that probably came from Levy through Brian at one point. No markings on the seals. They're not a pliable rubber and more like a stiff plastic so I hope these ones will still be ok. Brian is such a great guy and has set me up more than once. Glad things worked out for you.......and thank you for the great video(s).

 

[68FB]

Yes, those are the ones. The ones I took out were not solid rubber but a fibre-reinforced material. Very hard but that was probably their age.

The AN6225 ones are solid rubber, quite pliable, but on the hard side. Since some of the vendors offered the seal in 70 or 90 durometer, the harder 90 durometer would be the best bet. And the material should be nitrile (aka BUNA N) for oil resistance, or better still Viton but I didn't see any vendors offering it in Viton.

Malcolm

 

[USMC 00-08]

I checked out the v-cup packing i got in the g749 seal kit from Brian asbury. They had " AN6225-25 moulded into the rubbber which is a standard v-cup packing part number. Looks like a few companies sell these.

Malcolm

Great! Thank you! I added this to our parts list. Any other part numbers you have, please let me know and I will add them as well.

Plowboy...could you tell me the federal stock number? I can't see the whole number in your picture. For the parts list of course.

 

[m1010plowboy]

FSN numbers

It's the first day of spring, I'd do just about anything for you today!

But..........They didn't give us a part number on the FSN. Here is the Ordnance Stock # G200 - 5342366 / The manufacturers part number YT-6806462

Man.....you ask me to do ONE job...

 

[USMC 00-08]

I said the wrong thing. Was looking for the ordinance part number 5342366. Sorry for the confusion. Thank you for posting that!