I installed PTO on my M813 and now it's acting strange....

[dma251]

I just installed the PTO for my winch on my M813 yesterday, and refilled the tranny with fresh 80-90 gear oil (walmart brand SuperTech ) (11 quarts, until it ran out the filler plug) and now it's shifting funny and making more noise then it used to.

It isn't as willing to go into 3rd or 4th without grinding, and I have to wait much longer with the clutch in before trying to shift. It also seems to be a bit noisier, but I don't know if it is expected to have more noise with a pto or not.

It was very cold today, and I noticed as I drove a while around town the transmission got much easier to shift as everything warmed up. But the noise was still there.

One detail I might mention - the gasket for the PTO was hammered, so I just put it together with a good bead of RTV and cinched it down. Is it possible that the gasket held the gears a bit apart, and I'm forcing them together tighter then they should be?

I've got to drive about 100 miles on Saturday to go get the winch put it, so I need some advice on whether I should drive it or not....

 

[m.walker]

RE: I installed PTO on my M813 and now it

I'm pretty sure some of the winches needed shims or maybe your gasket was just enough , better put a gasket or shim back in .

 

[DDoyle]

RE: I installed PTO on my M813 and now it

The PTO is shimmed from the transmission in order to get the proper lash of the gears. Sounds like this is a step that you ommitted. I believe that there is a guide to this in the technical area of the site. Definately would not drive it any more until this is corrected - transmission parts are not cheap.

HTH,
David Doyle

 

[5tonpuller]

RE: I installed PTO on my M813 and now it

Mine has 2 gaskets and one very thin shim.

 

[dma251]

RE: I installed PTO on my M813 and now it

Where is the best place to get a replacement gasket and shim?

 

[DDoyle]

RE: I installed PTO on my M813 and now it

I know that Memphis Equipment has these in stock. The PTO fits a SAE standard opening, but I don't remember the number. If there is a heavy truck parts house nearby you they should have them in stock.

HTH,
DD

 

[73m819]

RE: I installed PTO on my M813 and now it

any truck shop

 

[lacoda56]

RE: I installed PTO on my M813 and now it

Don't drive it! The pto is too tight with just silicone for a sealer. There has to be .006 to .012 (six to twelve thousandths) of an inch backlash between the drive gear in the trans and the driven gear in the pto. You can set it by "feel" (guess) or on most pto's, you remove the shifter assembly from the pto and check the backlash with a dial indicator. You should be able to move the pto gear slightly without moving the trans gear. Obviously, adding gaskets increases backlash. Gaskets are available in different thicknesses and can be used in multiples to get the proper setting. Any truck equipment supplier will have gaskets. Hope this helps.

 

[cbvet]

RE: I installed PTO on my M813 and now it

A lot of you guys gave ME the same info, which I appreciate.
NAPA had the gaskets in stock. I've checked around South Bend Indiana, where both of my Deuces were built, for the shims. Haven't found anyone yet who knows what I'm talking about.
I got 3 gaskets, & I'll see how it works out.
Eric

 

[73m819]

RE: I installed PTO on my M813 and now it

loose is better then tight

 

[DaveP]

as stated above don't drive it or let it idle with the clutch engaged until this is corrected. as a rule of thumb i use 2 thick and 1 thin gasket for a starting point. any car quest or truck shop should have the gaskets. expensive damage will occur if not corrected.

 

[G744]

Shims are OK, but not necessary. The gaskets can be stacked to achieve the proper standoff of the PTO case. If you are concerned about leakage between the gaskets, dab a bit of Aviation Permatex on things before you put them together.

I've put many a PTO on a trans and this is the way all the old timers showed me how to do it. Once you get to feel the correct free play on the output shaft when in gear, you can set it up easily with no binding...it is not rocket science.

It is convenient that the 6-bolt SAE PTO port is the same the world over for buying gaskets, too.

dg

 

[TheBuggyman]

I used just Ultra Black silicone on mine and it did not make any noise, still had a little play too..........


I'm all messed up.

 

[pa.rich]

I have a five ton that I am going to install the pto on too. Is there a way to access the meshing gears after its installed to check the gears ?

 

[Recovry4x4]

Cracked transmission cases are the norm on these that don't have adequate backlash. You can remove the 6 bolt cover of the PTO and reach inside and rock the gears. You will be able to feel backlash if you have it. I start with one thick gasket and make my adjustments from there. When checking backlash make sure you have the PTO securely bolted down with all 6 studs. PITA? Yes but easier than changing a tranny case.

 

[lacoda56]

On most pto's, you can remove the shifter assembly and be able to look up inside. Like 73m819 said, loose is better. Too much backlash still isn't a good thing, but too little will destroy both gears. The metal from the damaged gears goes through trans and can do a lot of damage.

 

[dma251]

I reinstalled my pto today with two .020" gaskets from napa and some rtv sealant. The previous owner was running only onegasket and it wasn't making any noise and functioned fine for some time without problems. He removed the pto to use on another rig, but then ended up selling back to me. My point is this is the same pto going back on the same truck that previously worked well with one gasket.

I am waiting for the rtv to cure before I fill it up and drive it, but with the pto engaged and the engine off I am able to get a slight amount of play when I try to turn the pto shaft by hand. What do you think?

 

[73m819]

the old gasket could have been 2 stuck tigether or a thick one, a little play is what you want

 

[5tonpuller]

sounds good to me

 

[timntrucks]

thats just like the m37 pto i installed, one gasketwith sealer like it had before and it had some play in it. sounds ok while i drive it around