M1009 with 15k miles won't start

[n1vbn]

On top of the IP pump there is a rubber return line attached to a brass fitting. Inside this fitting lives a minor (?) curse of the 6.2 Diesel. A GLASS ampule that when clean restricts fuel flow to avoid the Ohio river running back to the fuel tank.Remove the rubber hose and cap it so no dirt gets inside it.....then remove the brass fitting from the top of the injection pump. Take it home to clean or (preferably) to a repair shop that will allow you to clean the inside of the fitting.....when clean it should sparkle like a diamond when light is thrown inside and rattle easily....when the glass gets really dirty it prevents all or most of the return (excess) Diesel fuel from returning to the tank....this causes pressure to build up inside the IP cover which causes the engine to stumble, fart, groan and moan and rev up very little with lousy power and rpm's....don't ask how I found out!!!

When clean it will allow fuel to flow freely while keeping the IP full of fuel and (if your real lucky) the IP the function properly. I learned this the hard way and the IP rebuilder showed me the cause....after I spent way to much to replace the IP&^&%&$#@@!%#

Sorry guys.

Word of warning ...the glass ampule WILL be a PITA (30-45 mins min) to get clean but you will love it when you put it back on and start it. You should be able to blow through it with only a slight restriction and look in with a backlight and see a clear glass ampule.

The DB-2 fuel Injection pump comes in 2 versions regular and heavy duty....The Military uses the heavy duty (150 HP?) The regular version is 135 HP/ either one will work just fine fer the urban jungle.

Please keep the words of wisdom about the trials and tribulations coming....it helps having like minded Men and Women to commiserate with.

Keep the Beer cold.

James Shanks
n1vbn@yahoo.com
1985 M-1009

 

[rickf]

Yes I was talking about the lift pump being a pain to replace. The injection pump is not all that hard to do. The hardest parts is getting all of the injection lines off, especially the two on the bottom. Timing is CRITICAL on these, if you get a later pump it will not have the timing line scribed on the pump and you will need a diesel timing adapter. Even if the line is there you have to remember this is not a gas engine. Just the width of the line can make a big difference in the way it runs.


Rick

 

[3dubs]

There were too many people around on the 4th I so I will do it today. But n1vbn that sounds like what is going on. How do you clean it?

 

[3dubs]

The check valve on top of the IP did have junk in it. Cleaned it with carb cleaner and a toothpick. Then changed the fuel filter. I think there is air in the lines. Did not change the fuel pump yet. But will try adding an elec fuel pump to see if it helps.

 

[ranger]

cucv

Try a little gas on a rag over the intake. But sometimes the circuit card under the dash will blow. you can replace it at napa.

 

[c3bosco]

Thought I'd add a little detail to what's going on:
We cleaned the check valve on the fuel return and put it back on...the truck fired up but had barely enough power to get us 100 yards down the street. We pulled off the road and bled the injectors...that got us more power and back to his place. My next great idea was to replace the fuel filter that said it was replaced 4000 miles ago (it looked brand new, but hey, might as well check everything right?)...we bled at the filter, then bled the injectors one at a time once, and it only stayed running for a second or two. We then found his fathers keg and things went south...

 

[Crash_AF]

Try a little gas on a rag over the intake. But sometimes the circuit card under the dash will blow. you can replace it at napa.

You can replace what at NAPA? The glow plug controller card?

Please provide a part number for the card if that's the case because as far as I know, the card is unavailable except as surplus.

Later,
Joe

 

[3dubs]

I cleaned the valve thing on top of the IP and it was better. But it would start but as soon as it wrmed up it would stop and not want to start again. I finally started it cold and got out and looked at the engine. I had seen smoke figured with all the stuff on the engine no big deal. But when I looked I saw the smoke was coming out of the oil cap. So I pulled the dip stick and the oil was blavk not grey so no watter in the oil, but smoke came out of the dip stick tube. I could only think of blow-by. I check with four diesel shops and they all said it was blow-by. most likely the ring but maybe a cracked piston. I saw GL said it started with starting fluid and a jump. So thanks GL you blew the rings out. I pulled the engine and when I pulled the heads the cylinders had crap in them. I have pulled six of the pistons so far. The rings look dirty. I can see they had blow-by. None of them look really bad. I checked all the piston rimg gaps and they are fine.

 

[rickf]

All diesels have a fair amount of blowby, that is just the nature of high compression. The blowby is controlled by the CDRV, Crankcase Depression Regulator Valve, mounted on the top passenger side of the engine. You can't really "blow" rings out short of breaking them. Be sure you keep ALL of the bearings in the same rod and position as they came out. When these engines are built they size the bearing shell on top to get an exact piston height and then they size the bottom shell for clearance. This is individual for each rod. Starting with ether would have blown a head gasket or broken the crankshaft behind the second rod before breaking rings.


Rick

 

[3dubs]

Thanks, none of the rings are broken. I think some of the carbon build up fell into the cylinders. I could most likely have cleaned the rings and they would have been fine. But there way too much blow-by because the oil was smoking. Does the CDRV have an adjustment or is it just replaced? I am just replacing everything that could be the cause. But if it can be adjusted then I will do that.

 

[rickf]

The CDRV probably just needs to be cleaned out. Blowby is basically smoke and oil vapor but mostly smoke. It is what leaks past the rings during the ignition of fuel. I have never heard of cleaning rings. How many miles are on this engine? The rings should be good for 100,000 with no problem. The only time you would have a major blowby problem on a relativily low miliage engine would be if two ring gaps were lined up. Keep in mind that you can not just throw in anew set of rings without honing the cylinders and the angle of the honing is very important. What kind of lip did you have at the top of the cylinders? You say you have some of the pistons out already, did you cut the ridge? If there is no ridge then I can't see the need for rings. If you decide to go for rings then this is the time to get the block to a machine shop to do the honing and they can also measure the crank and tell you what bearings you need. You will not be able to match the way it was done at the factory but you should not notice any problems. Sometimes they will vibrate a little more if one cylinder has a hair more compression than another.



Rick

 

[ranger]

I have the complete set of tm on cd. how can I forward a copy to you

 

[rickf]

Ranger, I would be interested in those also. You could zip the file and then e-mail it.

Rick

 

[3dubs]

I hone each cylinder as I replace the rings. I always do when the piston comes out. If they are the same TM's here I have them on my laptop to check all the tolerences. The crank is at factory specs but some of the bearings showed some wear. I am thinking the odometer has rolled over so It would have over 100,000 miles. I am checking everything with either a gap or a micrometer. I was thinking I would need to take it to a machine shop but it looks much better than I expected. I have seen much worse. The only I found was some of the rings were a little out of tollerence. I gapped before and after changing the rings. I thought the piston was bad but I put the new ring in and gapped it and it was good. So I think it was either worn rings or the space in the rings were lined up. This may not be this cowboys first rodeo but it is the easiest. But still a pain.

 

[rickf]

This is obviously not your first time around an engine but keep in mind that this is not a gas motor. Check the crank very well since that is usually the first to go with ether starts. It will break right after the second rod. Do not under any circumstance bend any of the injection lines or you will have a hellacious knock! You will swear he rod is coming out. Ask me how I know that one! While the heads are off make sure there are no broken pieces of glow plug in any of the prechambers. If it is over a hundred I would put in a new oil pump for good measure. Timing is CRITICAL!!!! Make sure the timing line is absolutely perfect. If you look at the bearings that came out there should be different color code on the edges, may be worn off but that is how they mixed and matched to gail the perfect piston height and clearance. Good luck and I will be watching for the black smoke to roll.

Rick

 

[3dubs]

I was going to change the fuel pump before I saw the smoke. Since I had it and I saw what a pain it was to change in the truck I put the new one on right away. I saw the colors on the bearings but had no idea what they were. I just did one piston at a time and put things back where I found them after I checked everything. I did not know about the rod hieght but know there can be slightly different shapes on the rods so I put the bearings back where they came from. My expeience was drag racing gas engines. While it was gas pulling engines out and rebuilding was a normal thing. I really miss having buddies with nice shops! I am working under a tent thing with chickens bugging me. Thanks to c3bosco for coming over to help me get the engine out! They say diesels are simple but that is not what I am finding out. The manager at O'Rielly really likes me now! All because I say when in doubt replace it. But those rings are not cheap and I got the shop rate!

 

[mistaken1]

Bump for a situation report.

 

[3dubs]

The engine is sitting on an engine stand. I broke it down replaced the rings and rod bearings. I added a main cap stud girdle for strength. I put a rebuilt injection pump on. A new fuel pump because I could get to it. The engine is back together just getting everthing together before dropping it back in.

There was a lot of carbon build up but nothing major. But the rings must either have been worn or carbon stopped the from sealing. I think if injector cleaner was used it would not have been a problem. Maybe the starter fluid broke some of the carbon loose. I do not know, I just know there was blow-by and the oil was getting hot and smoke was coming out. I hope to be firing it up by this weekend. Then we will see if I got all the problems. I tried to replace everything that could be bad. I just did not replace the injectors.

 

[ranger]

did everybody get their tm's ok

 

[rickf]

I got all but the -20, for some reason Adobe tells me it is damaged and can not be repaired.

Thanks

Rick