Josh
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Does the truck get to 2600rpm in the other gears?
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M35 Fire truck WOT 2000 rpm 44 mph ... what's up?
- Thread starter scootertrs
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TexAndy
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Interesting possibility.
If that's the case, 4th and 5th should be in the traditional (for every other manual truck) positions, right?
Scooter, show us a picture of the shifter in 5th gear.
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We had a similar issue with a GL truck purchased out of Lavinia TN. Devilman96 and I tried several things including confirming full travel of the throttle arm, increasing fuel rate a bit and nothing helped. We finally opened up the cover and adjusted the full throttle, throttle stop and drove it the rest of the way home at speeds between 58 and 60. You might also check pedal throw as there is a stop under that too.
rockman
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sounds about right for the rpms...
SEAFIRE
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Scootertrs,
Does your truck have a turbo? if so is it working correctly? it might have an issue where it's not working correctly restricting airflow.
Does the pump work off a PTO from the main drive shaft like most regular firetrucks? or off a tranny PTO?
How much water does your truck carry? We've never messed with a "real" deuce firetruck, all of ours are/were converted.
Are you using a military air filter?
Your truck may be governed because of the Fire Pump set-up.
Our M35A2 with "C" turbo & 1236-gallon water tank goes around 55-58mph.
Our 2nd M35A2 with "D" turbo & 500-gallon water tank goes around 58-62 mph. This truck came without a turbo and was a slow smoking dog before we added a turbo and re-timed the fuel pump.
Does your truck have a turbo? if so is it working correctly? it might have an issue where it's not working correctly restricting airflow.
Does the pump work off a PTO from the main drive shaft like most regular firetrucks? or off a tranny PTO?
How much water does your truck carry? We've never messed with a "real" deuce firetruck, all of ours are/were converted.
Are you using a military air filter?
Your truck may be governed because of the Fire Pump set-up.
Our M35A2 with "C" turbo & 1236-gallon water tank goes around 55-58mph.
Our 2nd M35A2 with "D" turbo & 500-gallon water tank goes around 58-62 mph. This truck came without a turbo and was a slow smoking dog before we added a turbo and re-timed the fuel pump.
jimmcld
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Do you know if there is a similar TM for the NHC250?
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You can adjust te idle...an internal adjustment...but high idle and gov settings are only done on a stand. It's done with shims and springs.
OSO
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I Know the problem ! You're in low range!!!!
Low range wouldn't limit the RPM's to 2000, and would limit the maximum speed in 5th gear to 28MPH... So that probably isn't the problem.I Know the problem ! You're in low range!!!!
When I was hunting for my deuce, I saw lots of pictures of M35A2's that had their warning stickers set for 45MPH. I wonder if some base commander got the idea to have his motor pool's governor's set down to save the fleet repair expenses? It would sure make the MF engines happy.
-Chuck
armytruck63
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I agree with Stump's theory. My first deuce was a nice whistler turbo and ran OK during a test drive on city streets, but it took almost two miles to get to 50 MPH on the freeway. It would not rev over 2200 RPM or so. I also noticed I was flooring it until the engine ran out of poop and then would shift gears.
A friend of mine upped the governor setting for fuel (smoke) rate and max RPM and the truck ran great and had plenty of power.
I think the Army mechanics are tired of 18-year-old kids blowing up the trucks and de-tune them.
A friend of mine upped the governor setting for fuel (smoke) rate and max RPM and the truck ran great and had plenty of power.
I think the Army mechanics are tired of 18-year-old kids blowing up the trucks and de-tune them.
scootertrs
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OK guys... here is the latest... I am actually thinking of posting this in a separate thread because it might save someone a lot of heartache...
OK ... fuel pressure from tank pump... OK... but my helpers... my 2 sons tell me the fuel smells funny.... take a whiff and the stuff smells like a combination of kerosene, varnish and linseed oil... I know that is not right... this truck came from a fire dept in Minnesota direct to me and I know they are special in Minnesota, but the best I can guess is that they took the name "multi-fuel" truly literally and they mixed who knows what in that fuel tank... I then inspected the filler cap and in tank filter and it was covered in a white powdery stuff that can be best described as lithium grease? feels like it and rubs like it and smells like it... what it is, I have no clue... I figured that the tank had to be taken out and cleaned... not a bad idea as there was approximately 1/2 inch of goo and sediment on the bottom
If this truck was running as well as it was, it only goes to evidence the fact that it will run on everything and anything... The only issue I was having was that it would not go over 44 mph and 2000 rpm... I may still have problems, but this has to be sorted out before I go any further... Tank will be cleaned, filters all replaced... system flushed... etc.
If you all think I should post this in a separate thread, don't be bashful, I will gladly do so... I know that the problem should have been easily diagnosed, but it wasn't... Let's see where we are when I get it buttoned back up.
Thanks
OK ... fuel pressure from tank pump... OK... but my helpers... my 2 sons tell me the fuel smells funny.... take a whiff and the stuff smells like a combination of kerosene, varnish and linseed oil... I know that is not right... this truck came from a fire dept in Minnesota direct to me and I know they are special in Minnesota, but the best I can guess is that they took the name "multi-fuel" truly literally and they mixed who knows what in that fuel tank... I then inspected the filler cap and in tank filter and it was covered in a white powdery stuff that can be best described as lithium grease? feels like it and rubs like it and smells like it... what it is, I have no clue... I figured that the tank had to be taken out and cleaned... not a bad idea as there was approximately 1/2 inch of goo and sediment on the bottom
If this truck was running as well as it was, it only goes to evidence the fact that it will run on everything and anything... The only issue I was having was that it would not go over 44 mph and 2000 rpm... I may still have problems, but this has to be sorted out before I go any further... Tank will be cleaned, filters all replaced... system flushed... etc.
If you all think I should post this in a separate thread, don't be bashful, I will gladly do so... I know that the problem should have been easily diagnosed, but it wasn't... Let's see where we are when I get it buttoned back up.
Thanks
scootertrs
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1236 gal of water... that is a lot of water... I hope I don't have to go to a turbo... I have spent enopugh money just getting the fire valves and pumps working... can't afford turbo right about now. As is, the gov info say that the turbo did not really increase the power, just cleaned up the smoke... don't really know... just parroting
thanks
Scootertrs,
As yet the most important question hasn't been answered directly: Can you get above 2000 rpm with the engine unloaded?
If you cannot ever get the engine to go above 2000 rpm, the governor is set wrong, either by intention, or maybe a broken part.
If your fuel is bad, or your maximum fuel is set too low, you may not be able to get to the governor speed at some loadings, but you still should be able to get to 2600 rpm when in neutral.
-Chuck
As yet the most important question hasn't been answered directly: Can you get above 2000 rpm with the engine unloaded?
If you cannot ever get the engine to go above 2000 rpm, the governor is set wrong, either by intention, or maybe a broken part.
If your fuel is bad, or your maximum fuel is set too low, you may not be able to get to the governor speed at some loadings, but you still should be able to get to 2600 rpm when in neutral.
-Chuck
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I run the same type of swill as fuel in my trucks, never have a problem. The white stuff seems to accumulate in lots of deuce tanks, at least it does here.
scootertrs
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Yes, the engine revs up to 3000 rpm for a moment unloaded (according to in truck tach)... this was nasty stuff though... what is that white powdery stuff?
and BTW, had I not tried to get it over 44 on the highway I would have never known. She starts before first rev is done and chugs nicely... until she hits the wall at 44 and 2000 rpm... gonna run a bit of reg diesel through see if she clears up... will keep you guys posted
and BTW, had I not tried to get it over 44 on the highway I would have never known. She starts before first rev is done and chugs nicely... until she hits the wall at 44 and 2000 rpm... gonna run a bit of reg diesel through see if she clears up... will keep you guys posted
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Your governor shouldn't overshoot that much, so hopefully you are just seeing an instrumentation glitch as your tach needle swings past the mark, and returns.
Does your tach show a sustained 2600-2800 rpm at WOT, or does it do something else? [Note, running WOT unloaded is a standard part of the diagnostic testing for LDT engines.]
-Chuck
OBTW, if it seems to want to go past 2800rpm as you slowly head for WOT, don't let it!
Does your tach show a sustained 2600-2800 rpm at WOT, or does it do something else? [Note, running WOT unloaded is a standard part of the diagnostic testing for LDT engines.]
-Chuck
OBTW, if it seems to want to go past 2800rpm as you slowly head for WOT, don't let it!
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scootertrs
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OK... Road Test... after cleaning... 49mph - very little smoke
found something interesting... air rushed in when I removed the fuel cap... somehow my vent is clogged... gonna research posts on that
BTW my motor is an LD465 IC how does the turbo manual relate? governor and inj. system look different
goint to have to adjust top rpm... 3000 is too high
thanks
hklvette
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Is the LDS built such that it can wind up to about 3K, but the LDT can't? The LDS troubleshooting manual says it can, if i remember correctly.
The LDT was designed for less HP/torque, and lower RPM's than the LDS engine. The LDS is a heavily modified version of the LDT engine. It is designed to run another couple of hundred RPM, and another 30-40 HP. To do that, they redesigned the pistons, changed the crankshaft counterweights, added additional oil cooling, increased the oil pump capacity, bigger turbo, and a few other things that I don't recall right now.
Think of the LDS as being a high performance racing version of the LDT.
-Chuck
Think of the LDS as being a high performance racing version of the LDT.
-Chuck
I know it is not the same issue but checkout this thread.
http://www.steelsoldiers.com/deuce/29359-m35a2c-clogged-fuel-system.html
When you mentioned the smelly fuel and crud in the tank it made me think of this thread.
The fuel passages in the hydraulic head may be gummed up and not allowing full flow of the fuel. Remove the cover for the injector stop and check for movement of the Fuel Control Rod.
If its gummed up you can remove it and clean it and the passages out with carb cleaner.
If you do remove it watchout for the small pin at the tip of the rod. It can get lost and is a bear to reinstall just right.
http://www.steelsoldiers.com/deuce/49153-help-hydraulic-head-removal-gone-wrong.html
http://www.steelsoldiers.com/deuce/29359-m35a2c-clogged-fuel-system.html
When you mentioned the smelly fuel and crud in the tank it made me think of this thread.
The fuel passages in the hydraulic head may be gummed up and not allowing full flow of the fuel. Remove the cover for the injector stop and check for movement of the Fuel Control Rod.
If its gummed up you can remove it and clean it and the passages out with carb cleaner.
If you do remove it watchout for the small pin at the tip of the rod. It can get lost and is a bear to reinstall just right.
http://www.steelsoldiers.com/deuce/49153-help-hydraulic-head-removal-gone-wrong.html
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