M923A2 Engine Swap

[Carlstealth]

The 22* is only if you can rev up past 3k. On a regular 8.3, I wouldnt go over 3-4* of advance, and 16 is decent. Most of what I mess with is a DT466, which is a very similar setup as these(almost identical pumps). The low end torque really suffers with timing of 20 or higher. On the flip side, the trans will like it a little better with the torque a little higher in the rpm band. For normal driving, if you play with the timing, you'll find it will probably only want 1-1.5*....sometimes not even that much. It's all in how you like it.

I would like to get a bit more response off idle and clean up the light blue smoke at idle and when initially accelerating.
I have installed the pacbrake gov spring kit and turned the top screw out 3 turns and its a pleasure to drive now and doesn't make me nervous pulling into traffic.
Can I loosen the pump and turn it a bit or is it like the 5.9 and we have to pull the gear and reseat the gear?
I'm not big on black smoke for power(Truck gets enough attention without that) so I would like to stay within the black cloud realm and get the most out of the fuel.

 

[Jeepsinker]

No black smoke???!!! I love my diesel smoke! I've got my deuce smoking like a freight train 1st-4th before it cleans up and I love it! Can't wait to see what my wrecker will do when I turn the fuel up.

 

[Carlstealth]

No black smoke???!!! I love my diesel smoke! I've got my deuce smoking like a freight train 1st-4th before it cleans up and I love it! Can't wait to see what my wrecker will do when I turn the fuel up.

Ha ha it does look cool but I want the power out of that smoke.

 

[nevrenufhp]

I would like to get a bit more response off idle and clean up the light blue smoke at idle and when initially accelerating.
I have installed the pacbrake gov spring kit and turned the top screw out 3 turns and its a pleasure to drive now and doesn't make me nervous pulling into traffic.
Can I loosen the pump and turn it a bit or is it like the 5.9 and we have to pull the gear and reseat the gear?
I'm not big on black smoke for power(Truck gets enough attention without that) so I would like to stay within the black cloud realm and get the most out of the fuel.

For one degree, you can try to rotate the pump for the advance. They do timing just like the 5.9(bust the gear loose, and reset it), and some dont even have timing marks on the crank.
For an even cleaner burn, you can run P-pump injectors. Not saying to get the 480hp marine injectors, but anywhere from 250-350hp would be great.

 

[charlesmann]

i was thinking of an engine swap too, along with a 8-10 spd manual (IF it will fit and not have to relocate the t-case and mess with the drive line, other than the short shaft from xmsn to t-case). i like rolling coal, but every time that happens, its just $$$$ being pi$$ed out the stack. so gobs of HP isn't what I'm looking for, but enough to get the 936A2 rolling down the highway. plus, there are NO jakes for the 8.3, and i don't NEED a jake, but LOVE the sound. so the sound alone would be worth the cost of the swap, and bc i HATE autos in a tck big trucks, actually, i hate autos in anything really, i want to swap to a manual. there is a thread going about a man swap in the 800 series iv read, so once i get back from western canada and have more than a day to go get the 2 wreckers, I'm gonna take 1 to the local cummins dealer and see what they recommend for xmsn that will still allow for both pto units to be reinstalled.

 

[simp5782]

i was thinking of an engine swap too, along with a 8-10 spd manual (IF it will fit and not have to relocate the t-case and mess with the drive line, other than the short shaft from xmsn to t-case). i like rolling coal, but every time that happens, its just $$$$ being pi$$ed out the stack. so gobs of HP isn't what I'm looking for, but enough to get the 936A2 rolling down the highway. plus, there are NO jakes for the 8.3, and i don't NEED a jake, but LOVE the sound. so the sound alone would be worth the cost of the swap, and bc i HATE autos in a tck big trucks, actually, i hate autos in anything really, i want to swap to a manual. there is a thread going about a man swap in the 800 series iv read, so once i get back from western canada and have more than a day to go get the 2 wreckers, I'm gonna take 1 to the local cummins dealer and see what they recommend for xmsn that will still allow for both pto units to be reinstalled.

Cheapest option is a Big Cam swap and a 10spd. You will have to move the transfer case back about 6 inches. Would be smarter to start with a plain M936 and not an A2 variant. The lack of doghouse on A2 trucks limits engine size

 

[charlesmann]

Cheapest option is a Big Cam swap and a 10spd. You will have to move the transfer case back about 6 inches. Would be smarter to start with a plain M936 and not an A2 variant. The lack of doghouse on A2 trucks limits engine size

i have to start with what i can get my hands on. I'm buying the wrecker to load logs on a trailer, haul them to my mill and load/turn/unload off my mill. once i get a pair of axles under my mill, ill then haul my mill to the customer and mill onsite.

as for lacking a dog house, depending how far into the cab it needs to go, and how wide the hole needs to be. cutting the firewall and building a template to make a composite doghouse, or building out of stainless can be done. I'm not very good at composite making, nor welding stainless/alum, but it gives me a reason to buy a tig strike torch or start learning the composite world.

as for messing with t-case relocation, that means shortening at least 1 shaft, and lengthening 2. that might get a bit costly at the machine shop and balancing shop. ill look at my options and see if its worth messing with. thanks for the info.

 

[simp5782]

i have to start with what i can get my hands on. I'm buying the wrecker to load logs on a trailer, haul them to my mill and load/turn/unload off my mill. once i get a pair of axles under my mill, ill then haul my mill to the customer and mill onsite.

as for lacking a dog house, depending how far into the cab it needs to go, and how wide the hole needs to be. cutting the firewall and building a template to make a composite doghouse, or building out of stainless can be done. I'm not very good at composite making, nor welding stainless/alum, but it gives me a reason to buy a tig strike torch or start learning the composite world.

as for messing with t-case relocation, that means shortening at least 1 shaft, and lengthening 2. that might get a bit costly at the machine shop and balancing shop. ill look at my options and see if its worth messing with. thanks for the info.

A0 And A1 wreckers are cheaper than A2 wreckers by far. Some sold last month at auction in south Mississippi in running condition for $4500.

the trucks with the NHC250s have the doghouse already setup for the big cam motor to fit. You simply need to refab the front engine mount at the crossmember.

You moving the transfer case base does not require but one shaft to be lengthened. You simply move the case back to a specific length that will allow you to use a M931 Transfer case to Front Tandem driveshaft. They are cheap and abundant. You can use two of them. Transmission to Transfer and transfer to front tandem axle. You simply only have to have a longer tube for the front shaft from the center support to the transfer. OR add in another crossmember and add another support bearing to add another short shaft.


I have put a big cam in one and i even fabbed in a 16speed transmission into one. I have relocated the transfer case in one. There is not much I have not done to a 5 ton

 

[charlesmann]

im

A0 And A1 wreckers are cheaper than A2 wreckers by far. Some sold last month at auction in south Mississippi in running condition for $4500.

the trucks with the NHC250s have the doghouse already setup for the big cam motor to fit. You simply need to refab the front engine mount at the crossmember.

You moving the transfer case base does not require but one shaft to be lengthened. You simply move the case back to a specific length that will allow you to use a M931 Transfer case to Front Tandem driveshaft. They are cheap and abundant. You can use two of them. Transmission to Transfer and transfer to front tandem axle. You simply only have to have a longer tube for the front shaft from the center support to the transfer. OR add in another crossmember and add another support bearing to add another short shaft.


I have put a big cam in one and i even fabbed in a 16speed transmission into one. I have relocated the transfer case in one. There is not much I have not done to a 5 ton

im not able to find these trucks ya'll speak of for cheap prices. I'm not against auctions at all, but depending when the bid closes depends if i can bid on it. my schedule rite now is a 3wk on/off. if it ends 1-20 day/s after I'm on shift, well, i can't bid on that bc i would have a way to pick it up.

im also getting 2 a2s for the price of 1 ($13,000), but 1 has a burned out xmsn and a bad boom lift cyl, which i can rebuild.

copy on only 1 shaft possibly needing to be lengthened.

 

[snowtrac nome]

replace the cummins with a 3406 cat

 

[charlesmann]

replace the cummins with a 3406 cat

3406B. I do LOVE a ylw kitty, but a cat isn't a cheap inframe, granted it was an E, but my step dad did an inframe plus had the head rebuilt and a new set of jakes and it cost him nearly $12,000. he did the eng himself, sent the head off and had them install the jakes.
iv seen plenty of B models for sale, cheap (2500-3000), but then do they need to be rebuilt?, that may run the cost up another 7-10K.

 

[snowtrac nome]

The old pre electronic cat engines will run a lifetime some of the larger motors suffered from leaks because of the multi piece gaskets but, I believe if you can build a Detroit that wont leak you can build a cat that wont leak to. An 8v 92t would be another cool conversion and would sound like no other. Another conversion would be an e-7 mack in the 350 hp range but the high hp macks are pretty rare, and you thought cat parts are expeseive. The one thing about mack motors though, is they don't care how cold it is they will start, and they have a wide torque curve , I would imagine they work well with the 5 speed auto of a 5 ton.