M925a2 Power Surge

[74M35A2]

Im thinking you can roll your chair out next to the skid, rig up the pedals and get us a test drive video, while your doing your test fire...

I was going to test the pedal anyway, so this works perfect. I'll do it just for you bud.

 

[74M35A2]

ECM is mounted back onto engine. Requesting wiring diagram of electronic accelerator pedal sensor from pedal maker now. May need to add or move some terminals around in the ECM connector for this depending upon how this pedal configures vs the stock RV application. Some use an idle verification switch in the pedal sensor, and some use dual voltage sweep potentiometers. ECM can use either, but different terminals per. Honestly, for anybody intimidated of installing an electronic Cummins engine into a mechanical vehicle, this is really the only wiring there is to do. Majority of the rest is self contained on the engine itself. Just need to feed it battery power, switched ignition key power, and accelerator pedal position. Not a big deal at all. Additional wires give additional options and conveniences such as cruise control, wait to start lamp, fan control, water in fuel filter warning lamp, PTO speed, etc.., but are not required for basic start and run up to speed. Even the accel pedal is not required for basic start and run at idle. Just battery power and ground, and it will run.

Pedal needs new sensor, one signal output is bad.

UPDATE: Kongsberg, the accel pedal maker, does not sell the sensor alone, they want $288 for a new replacement pedal and sensor. I don't see that happening for just a throttle pedal. I'm on the prowl for another accel pedal and sensor assembly. Too bad, the one I had seems like it is built tough as nails. Will grab something from a KW, Pete, Freightliner, Volvo, or the like.... This is the part where everybody is going to jump in and say that this is the reason they don't want an electronic engine.

 

[74M35A2]

Factory Jake actuation harness installed.

 

[74M35A2]

While sitting bored in meetings at work today, I came up with a way to use the electronic accel pedal I acquired anyway, even though it tested as having one bad output circuit. I can use an external relay to simulate the IVS (Idle Verification Switch) that should regularly have a set of normally open and normally closed contacts, which alternate states when the pedal is pushed off of idle position. I have one working, and one not. I can use the signal from the one that works, to drive a relay and simulate the second, inverse, signal. This should work. Will wire it up temporarily to the ECM and hope to do a test fire on it this weekend to confirm. The ECM uses this IVS as a cross-reference to insure the request is to accelerate the engine.

 

[Buffalobwana]

Oh cool so Basically, accelerator turns into and “on-off” switch for the engine. Idle or 2500 rpm. Awesome! I knew you were going to do that eventually.

JK

Actually, that is what would happen to me. I’d get one of the relays wrong and do the above mentioned scenario.

So, are you going to leave the relay in there and use it if it works?

 

[74M35A2]

Cute. Cummins ECM's can accept either a dual voltage sweep sensor, or a single sensor with an idle verification switch. Either is a safety measure to confirm pedal increase is requested. The external relay will act as the idle verification switch, and can be driven from either working terminal of the IVS pedal portion, to replicate the portion not working. Also looking at the possibility us just using the single sweep position sensor as a dual (feed it to both inputs of the ECM), but that may not work as the ECM may be looking for an offset between the two (2 different output slopes), or inverse behavior of one of the slopes.

I really should just get a pedal that works properly, as I am still measuring 10 ohms of resistance even on the working IVS switch leg. Circumventing anything kind of takes away the fail safe. Not a huge deal with a manual trans and clutch pedal, with redline protection though. Even a Dodge Ram one is the same circuitry. ECM calibrates the full sweep range during a power up-engine off condition, you depress the pedal fully and return (1x-3x?), then key off, and fire it up.

 

[Buffalobwana]

.
I really should just get a pedal that works properly,

Nah. Let’s not ruin the fun part.

 

[74M35A2]

Nobody is calling you out, don't get soft on us. Most should know by now I respect sarcasm, highly. Few like it, a lot don't, we're all different but here for the same thing. Dad killed lots in Vietnam, and I'm 23 miles from Detroit, where the weak are killed and eaten. So, bring what you got and use it. I'll help anybody that asks, without insulting them.

Yep, I'll wire up the relay, and try it once back from Japan. I'm sick of trying eat things that run off my plate, with 2 wooden sticks. The last one I held the front door open for it and let it run away. Today for lunch with my Japanese counterparts, we went to another scary eatery, I took my shoes off, sat on the floor, and noticed a sign for ice cream bar dessert. I'm sick of eating seaweed, so the guys ordered, it was my turn, and I handed the girl the ice cream sign and said I'll take 4 of these chocolate ice cream bars for lunch. I had to tell her yes 3 times, but then she finally did it. The guys laughed in disbelief, but then finally got the message, maybe...

Diesel is $4/gal (104 Yen per liter) here, and gasoline $5/gal (126 Yen per liter) so quit crying.

 

[Buffalobwana]

おい、海草はあなたの頭にいった？あなたは何らかの寄生虫や本当のお酒を手に入れましたか？誰かが私を電話したとは思わない？私の返事の50％が本質的に皮肉なので、通常はそうするのです。

it wont translate directly, but, basically, I asked, Dude, has the seaweed gone to your head? Did you get some kind of parasite or a bunch of real good sake? I don’t think anyone called me out, did they? Usually when they do, it’s because a full 50% of my replies are sarcastic in nature. especially toward you, because I know you!


​

 

[grendel]

I read it...

I sort of miss Japan. Spent 4 months there last year.

Clint, it's 5 wires.

 

[74M35A2]

g, I'm leaving this morning, come take my spot.

I'd trade you three 12v starters, shipped, for it? One of each different clocking configuration, with 11 tooth pinions on them.

 

[grendel]

g, I'm leaving this morning, come take my spot.

I'd trade you three 12v starters, shipped, for it? One of each different clocking configuration, with 11 tooth pinions on them.

No thanks, I have to stay local.

Let me see if I can free it up. It's from a late model M917

 

[74M35A2]

Thanks.

 

[Jericho]

Fuel is cheap in Japan. Try England. Depending on the exchange rate I've seen it as high as $12.00 a gallon once paid $42.00 for a half gallon of diesel equivalent motor oil on the motorway. Applaud your research into the micro electrical realm with the controls. But as you predicted. I would prefer manual everything. Work aviation electrics and controls on aircraft. Don't want any on my trucks !

 

[74M35A2]

Yep, EU fuel is expensive. This is where the stop-start strategy was born that I am working on at work for all vehicle classes in US.

Thanks, understood, and almost agree on the engine. There are a lot of gains via EFI. I am documenting this for anybody else interested. I am seeing 300hp ISC engines (EFI 8.3 with 4 valve head and roller cam) as low as $1,500 running, yet our mechanical 6CTA8.3 is fetching in the range of $2,500 - $4,500. This confirms that your preference is not alone. I don't think I'd try to run an EFI engine underwater, but I would a mechanical one. Otherwise, I'm hoping for nothing but benefit, and none of the worrisome issues. Definently a power upgrade, and possibly a small bump on efficiency. Jakes were a bonus, can't get them with a 2 valve 8.3. This stuff should be pretty hardened. We'll soon see. Thanks for saying hello, all opinions valued.

 

[Jericho]

Just drove a rental in uk for a month took it back after first week. Kept stalling at intersections. Only to be told it was normal for a diesel VW. Man was I embarrassed

 

[74M35A2]

Clutch pedal is the one on the left. *wink*

 

[Jericho]

Yup. It had the auto stop function. Every time I stopped or hesitated at an intersection or round about the car shut off. What I didn't know was that if you held steady pressure on the brake. When you let up Engine automatically restarted. so I was was the proverbial Yank cranking it with the button , foot still on brake. Holding up traffic. Brits are not patient !!!

 

[74M35A2]

Hope to get the clutch pedal installed this week and a second test run of the engine on the pallet with accel pedal action after work. Have an off-road function to attend on Sunday, then should be able to do the swap hopefully the following weekend. Fingers crossed. Truck will need to be towed out from my work, there are too many changes in intake air handling, cooling system, and driveshaft, for the truck to drive out on its own power. I do hope to be able to have at least the power steering pump work for short bursts of cranking or idle for when parking the truck at my house or the storage lot Sunday evening.

 

[Another Ahab]

Applaud your research into the micro electrical realm with the controls. But as you predicted. I would prefer manual everything. Work aviation electrics and controls on aircraft. Don't want any on my trucks !

Wondering what makes you say that:

- Is it maybe because they work (aviation electronics), but take a whole lot of maintenance to ensure that they work?

- Something else?