MEP-803a possible battery short

[sigley89]

So I have a fairly new to me 803. It ran fine a month or 2 ago. Today I went out to load test it and nothing. No pumps or lights kicking on. I took my multimeter to my batteries and one was at like 4v the other was at -2v. The -2v battery reversed polarity. I went out and bought a new battery. When I reconnected the new battery and before I connected the cable that goes to ground I put the meter between the terminal and the cable. It read 0.L. I’m assuming what happened was I have a short somewhere and it drained the batteries and one was charged in reverse from the other resulting in the polarity swap. I also noticed that the oil fill cap chain was corroded as well where I had it folded on top of the cap. I’m definitely thinking that I have short somewhere. I checked from the terminal to the case and I have 0.L between the two. Not sure if that’s supposed to happen.
I’ve looked at the battery cables and they are in good condition. No breaks, rubs, or abrasions. I don’t think I had this problem before I moved it. I moved it about 200 miles on the trailer you normally see them on. I’m thinking what during the trip something bumped loose. Also before the trip I disconnect the cables from the lugs and from the transfer switch as I had another generator on the trailer as well.

What I’m looking for are common places to start and check for shorts or someone to tell me I dumb. Thanks for the help!

 

[WWRD99]

These are a 24 volt setup so the batteries will look reversed to get 24 volts...as far as the ground, you have to hook up the battery cable to get a ground...your meter won't do that unless it's in the 10 amp positive port in the meter and put on the battery and the cable...usually that is done for a voltage drain anyhow....getting ol is good so you know the positive is not shorted to the box....but you won't know anything until you hook up the batteries....were the batteries you replaced come with the genset? You are replacing both batteries?

 

[Chainbreaker]

Yes, unless the other battery is very close to new you MUST replace both batteries as a set. You probably don't know the history of the batteries since you said the genset is "fairly new to you". Especially if temps are dropping is when marginal batteries fail.

Since it was starting & running before put a "new set" of batteries properly connected in series and give it a try.

 

[sigley89]

These are a 24 volt setup so the batteries will look reversed to get 24 volts...as far as the ground, you have to hook up the battery cable to get a ground...your meter won't do that unless it's in the 10 amp positive port in the meter and put on the battery and the cable...usually that is done for a voltage drain anyhow....getting ol is good so you know the positive is not shorted to the box....but you won't know anything until you hook up the batteries....were the batteries you replaced come with the genset? You are replacing both batteries?

when I bought the generators they didn’t have any batteries in them. I bought new ones and they have been sitting in there for maybe less than 8 months. Everything was all good and dandy until I moved the genset. I hooked the system up fully and it starts but now I’m worried I have a short some where. Is anyone willing to walk me through testing for a short?

pics after it’s been running for about 10-15 mins no load.

 

[WWRD99]

when I bought the generators they didn’t have any batteries in them. They have been sitting in there for maybe less than 8 months. Everything was all good and dandy until I moved the genset. I hooked the system up fully and it starts but now I’m worried I have a short some where. Is anyone willing to walk me through testing for a short?

Ok so you put new batteries in it when you got it and they lasted about 8 months then died...you think there's a slow drain on the batteries to kill them when it sits not being used? Just for my clarification...a short is when a wire is positive and touches ground or vice versa...that would blow fuses, melt wires, burn out the regulator, relays and possibly start a fire...if that's what you think you have from removing it from the trailer? Just trying to get on the same page.
If you think you have a drain...put the meter positive lead in the 10 amp fused volt port in the meter and then touch the post and the battery cable not hooked up...it should read .02 or less volts not turned on...don't turn on the genset with the meter hooked up like this...the meter won't handle that draw...if you have much more than that something is on...I think but not sure that the dead crank switch should be set at normal...that may draw if not set to that...you can test that though when you hook up the meter.

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[sigley89]

Ok so you put new batteries in it when you got it and they lasted about 8 months then died...you think there's a slow drain on the batteries to kill them when it sits not being used? Just for my clarification...a short is when a wire is positive and touches ground or vice versa...that would blow fuses, melt wires, burn out the regulator, relays and possibly start a fire...if that's what you think you have from removing it from the trailer? Just trying to get on the same page.
If you think you have a drain...put the meter positive lead in the 10 amp fused volt port in the meter and then touch the post and the battery cable not hooked up...it should read .02 or less volts not turned on...don't turn on the genset with the meter hooked up like this...the meter won't handle that draw...if you have much more than that something is on...I think but not sure that the dead crank switch should be set at normal...that may draw if not set to that...you can test that though when you hook up the meter.

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Yes I’m trying to see if I have a slow drain. Sorry for the confusion. Google led me astray.

 

[Guyfang]

The picture showing M4, (battery charging meter) is a good, normal reading for the set.

WWRD99 wrote:
If you think you have a drain...put the meter positive lead in the 10 amp fused volt port in the meter and then touch the post and the battery cable not hooked up...it should read .02 or less volts not turned on. This is correct. Perform the test.

I think but not sure that the dead crank switch should be set at normal...that may draw if not set to that...you can test that though when you hook up the meter. Correct, the S10 should be in the normal position. No matter what position S10 is in, the draw should not change. .02 or less.

 

[sigley89]

The picture showing M4, (battery charging meter) is a good, normal reading for the set.

WWRD99 wrote:
If you think you have a drain...put the meter positive lead in the 10 amp fused volt port in the meter and then touch the post and the battery cable not hooked up...it should read .02 or less volts not turned on. This is correct. Perform the test.

I think but not sure that the dead crank switch should be set at normal...that may draw if not set to that...you can test that though when you hook up the meter. Correct, the S10 should be in the normal position. No matter what position S10 is in, the draw should not change. .02 or less.

I’ll give these a test when I’m home. I’m the meantime how does the 803 run on heating oil?

 

[dav5]

I’ll give these a test when I’m home. I’m the meantime how does the 803 run on heating oil?

My 803A runs great on heating oil

 

[Light in the Dark]

HHO is #2 Diesel with a ratio of Kerosene... should run fine. Wouldn't hurt to run something to help with the lubricity when you do.

 

[dav5]

HHO is #2 Diesel with a ratio of Kerosene... should run fine. Wouldn't hurt to run something to help with the lubricity when you do.

My supplier tells me the HHO comes out of the same tank as diesel. I do add additives when my farm tank is filled. Since I'm in Canada this may not be true in America.

 

[Guyfang]

There is a data plate on your gen set that lists all approved fuels.

 

[sigley89]

Yea I’ve seen the data plate I’m just wondering what everyone’s experiences was with heating oil. For those that have used heating oil, what additives do you use and what’s the thought or science behind its usage?

 

[dav5]

Yea I’ve seen the data plate I’m just wondering what everyone’s experiences was with heating oil. For those that have used heating oil, what additives do you use and what’s the thought or science behind its usage?

I use whatever is on sale. I want an additive that adds lubricity because of todays low sulphur fuels and an antigel. I don't worry about algae because it isn't warm enough up here to worry about it and my farm tank gets refilled every 8 to 12 months. Right now I'm using Kleenflo diesel fuel conditioner because it was on sale at TSC

 

[WWRD99]

Yea I’ve seen the data plate I’m just wondering what everyone’s experiences was with heating oil. For those that have used heating oil, what additives do you use and what’s the thought or science behind its usage?

I have 3 300 gallon tanks I use for heating...they are also hard plumbed into the genset...I think it really depends on location...how cold and hot the oil will get etc while in storage mode...I'm in central pa...use the genset for 12 hours every month...I haven't put any additives in the oil BUT I should put in something for lube...so far it's run like a clock...biggest thing too is when you run it, get it loaded up...I run 2 heaters to make sure it's up in the summer and crank down the ac to keep the compressor running too.

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[sigley89]

My situation and setup are as follows:

I live in Alaska, offgrid. I have solar and a battery bank. The generator will be used about 1hr everyday in the winter to charge our battery bank. Our inverter draws approximately 4kW at 30amps but the generator only shows about 2.5kW on the gauge. In the winter in my area I usually see -30 for about a month but can get to get to -60. The average temp is 0 though. The generator has a coolant heater in it but I haven’t had the chance to put it to the test yet. Long term plan is to build a concrete pad with an insulated building surrounding the generator and a toyo stove that will run off of a 500gal tank that feeds the generator and the toyo.

I will probably average about 1gal of fuel usage a day. With that amount of usage and type of environment what recommendations for additives should I look into.

I also have a electric stove and an electric dryer that will get me to 100% power output for a full load and I’ll do that once a month to prevent wet stacking.

 

[csheath]

Not sure how common it is or what the problem is but my unit has a small battery draw if the dead crank switch is left in the on position. I just leave it in off and turn it on when I prepare to start.

 

[Ray70]

I see you have an Arctic heater on your machine... nice option to have up in your area!

Back to your battery drain issue.... If you verify that you have a substantial battery drain try removing the + 24V output wire from the back of your alternator.
What you described smells an awful lot like a bad alternator diode to me!
I have run into this a couple times before.

On the use of HHO, others here are dead on. It will run perfectly fine but I always add a bit of extra lubricants to my fuel. ATF, hydraulic fluid, even 2 stroke injection oil will work fine. I personally use Dextron ATF, since it's cheap and also throw in some Hot Shot or PRI-D diesel additive.
I've been using it for 20 years in my backhoe, Lull and all the generators.... no issues at all, just don't go throwing it in your LSD road vehicle! The DOT won't be too happy with you!

 

[Guyfang]

The alternator is the first place to look in such a situation.

 

[sigley89]

I see you have an Arctic heater on your machine... nice option to have up in your area!

Back to your battery drain issue.... If you verify that you have a substantial battery drain try removing the + 24V output wire from the back of your alternator.
What you described smells an awful lot like a bad alternator diode to me!
I have run into this a couple times before.

On the use of HHO, others here are dead on. It will run perfectly fine but I always add a bit of extra lubricants to my fuel. ATF, hydraulic fluid, even 2 stroke injection oil will work fine. I personally use Dextron ATF, since it's cheap and also throw in some Hot Shot or PRI-D diesel additive.
I've been using it for 20 years in my backhoe, Lull and all the generators.... no issues at all, just don't go throwing it in your LSD road vehicle! The DOT won't be too happy with you!

Thanks. Is there a general amount that everyone uses per gallon?