MSD-ICE Kit Diagnostics

[Wire Fox]

I was looking at grabbing one of these, but wanted to know before I committed the money...has anyone gotten the ICE kit adapter set to work on a non-Miltope computer? The kits seem to have a basic software included with them, plus I have the HMMWV IETM that begs me to plug in an ICE Box everytime I start the program. I'm hoping I don't have to be the pioneer...

 

[Wire Fox]

Looks like I'm going to gamble it. The price on these kits is the lowest I've seen in 6 months. Worst case, I just patiently wait for a cheap Miltope MSD v2 laptop to show up somewhere, since this kit will come with the recovery disk for one.

If anyone does have any feedback still, I'd really appreciate it. I'm a bit more tech-savvy than the average bear, but I'm no good at unpacking installers and manually extracting drivers from an operating system image...

 

[CARNAC]

You missed a 100% complete with software kit at the Sussex show. Went for around 500

 

[Wire Fox]

Does sound like I missed out, especially if that was all in excellent condition. I just got the test set for about $205 delivered. There's still one more on eBay from the same seller. "MSD ICE" was my search to bring it up, should anyone else want one. This set should be complete with all of the adapters, cables, software, and test probes. For a true Miltope MSD system, I'm just missing the computer package that offers up a rugged laptop, more software, and a power supply for vehicle or A/C use. I've seen the laptops for as little as $75 on eBay, but the accessories are absolutely unobtainable from my observation, so buying just the computer looks risky...

 

[Action]

Maybe I shouldn't have thrown away my old STE-ICE units. They had most of those same connectors.

 

[Wire Fox]

So mixed news! I got the set and scoured through it... It has both CDs (1 is the OS and core OS driver disk, 2 is all of the drivers to run the actual ICE kit, Dearborn adapter, and other items related to the MSD kit.), everything is in great shape, but it's missing one cable... The good news is it's literally the only common part in the whole kit: a standard serial cable.

As I had read, the CD freaks if you try to run it on a non-Miltope computer. Mine actually takes it to new heights by force-ejecting your CD drive and immediately shutting down your computer. It was amusing, to say the least. If you don't let the autorun utility run, you can explore the files and all of the drivers are actually plainly listed and you can individually run the installers manually. Once I get a better chance to run everything, I'll let you guys know how functional it is without a Miltope FR. As it is right now, I'm pretty excited for what I can do. As long as I don't find any non-distribute clauses, I'll be uploading the operator's manual that embedded in the software and maybe even the training tool. Now, based on some functions of the Miltope computer, I really want one. Particularly getting to power the laptop via the test tool. ...just a neat convenience.

 

[Wire Fox]

Excelsior! I was able to tweak the disc a bit and successfully got the ICE drivers to install. Plugged in the main connector to the STE/ICE port and connected the ICE Box to the serial port on my laptop and was able to feed live voltage data through. I used both the straight ICE tool, and the HMMWV IETM also had success initializing the ICE Box and getting data. I'm really glad to see that the ICE Box and the cables are good to get that connection established. Tomorrow, I'll get some pictures and will try out one of the transducers on something, if I can. Maybe also get LabView up (provided on the disc) and see if I can make use of the analog probes and see how precise they are.

Trying the Dearborn Protocol Adapter will have to wait, as I just don't have anything to test with it. Once I get some of the wiring in for the TCM, I can at least drop on the connection there to see if I can get it to throw error codes at me and show that it works.

 

[jeffhuey1n]

Not sure what the MSD-ICE machine is but my STE-ICE works pretty good. I saved about the cost of one by using to troubleshoot different problems. I've used on my M-35's, M1009 and M-52. I've got 2 1/2 kits. Not sure why, musta been a weak moment on my part.

 

[Wire Fox]

Not sure what the MSD-ICE machine is but my STE-ICE works pretty good. I saved about the cost of one by using to troubleshoot different problems. I've used on my M-35's, M1009 and M-52. I've got 2 1/2 kits. Not sure why, musta been a weak moment on my part.

I'm assuming you have the STE/ICE-R? The one where you push buttons up and down to select a test and then run it on the box? If so, this does the same job, but it's all computer-controlled. It's setup in a pretty legacy manner, too, because all of the IETMs refer to the tests in conducts by the same test numbers as the old, standalone -R setup. My set is supposed to be used with the Miltope AN/PSM-95 A/B computer, but I'm not made of money, so I've pressed an old Dell laptop into service with a lot of success so far. Now, on its own, this sounds silly to throw an extra computer in the mix when the old box did it on its own, but the real benefit here is having the analog to digital conversion. The software included has a lot of lab bench software that should allow me to do some type of waveform analyzing, plus this all also can interface with systems that already have their own on-board diagnostics systems via the Dearborn Protocol Adapter. I've got tests available for nearly every model of HMMWV, Bradley Tanks, PT Boats, several dozers, and even an MLRS battery. These are all ICE analog tests, not the full IETMs [I wish...]. The only IETM it actually includes is, as practical as it can be, the IETM to service an MSD-ICE test set.

 

[FKAM]

Wire Fox

Found your thread here from your posting on "what have you done... HMMWV today". I've been trying to figure all this out for a while, thanx for being the "pioneer", I had really no idea where to even start, was just hoping to find someone who was doing what you are. You could spend a lot of hours here on SS lookng, but if you don't know the terminology it's hard to find things sometimes. I didn't even know what STE-ICE was until today. Any chance you could post some pictures of your kit? I've found some kits on the internet but not really sure if they are V2 kit you mention/have. Thanx in advance.

 

[Wire Fox]

Wire Fox

Found your thread here from your posting on "what have you done... HMMWV today". I've been trying to figure all this out for a while, thanx for being the "pioneer", I had really no idea where to even start, was just hoping to find someone who was doing what you are. You could spend a lot of hours here on SS lookng, but if you don't know the terminology it's hard to find things sometimes. I didn't even know what STE-ICE was until today. Any chance you could post some pictures of your kit? I've found some kits on the internet but not really sure if they are V2 kit you mention/have. Thanx in advance.

Sure, I'll be happy to once I'm home. I'm actually working on picking up a second kit for both spare parts and as a lender unit. There's a MV museum near me that has three HMMWVs on the way and they would probably appreciate having one of these on-hand to do a bit of tuning (though I admit, most of the precision work is in the injection pump...and that's a separate tool set).

The biggest thing to note with these kits is they're dead weight without the software (well, the Dearborn Protocal Adapter could function with software available on the DPA website for their "legacy devices"). Mine was fortunate enough to come with both disc 1 (operating system) & 2 (drivers and programs). I'm willing to share an ISO image of either disc with anyone that can prove they own one of the kits. The software licensing on it appears that it's A-OK to be transferred from one user to the next [and there is no unique serial keys that have to be entered during installation of disc 2], but the discs do state that they're for distribution with the MSD-ICE kit only, so I don't want to distribute to anyone without a kit.

 

[FKAM]

The biggest thing to note with these kits is they're dead weight without the software

Software was one of the first things I started looking for with the kits I found today, based on what I read in your posts. Some have them and some don't. I was hoping if I end up with one that doesn't , that you'd be willing to share an ISO of yours.

You've been a lot of help with some current things I'm working on this week.

Thanx a lot.

 

[Wire Fox]

I just realized that I should share some usage shots of MSD-ICE kit for this thread. Nothing in this post should be new for anyone that already read the "what have you done to your HMMWV today..." thread.

The setup:


In the above photo, you see the second revision ICE Box (green in color instead of black...it automatically detects if it's being powered through the STE/ICE connector or NATO plug). It's connected via W1 cable to the STE/ICE connector of the HMMWV, which is providing power and obviously the main diagnostics. On the back side is the serial cable, which also has a branched cable off of it to provide power to an MSD Miltope laptop from the vehicle. The red cable seen is the test probes, which I had connected to the alternator at the time to do a test to verify there was no voltage drop in the cabling. Unused in this picture are two ports to support simultaneous use of various transducers and a contactless ammeter, as well, the nato power connector is unused. There's also a port on the other side that resembles a parallel port. I don't recall off the top of my head what it does.

Standing Voltage tests:


These are all occuring simultaneously, live. Nothing out of the ordinary here except the starter solenoid voltage. This was with the vehicle switched off, so this may be my pulse charger in the PDU, a failure in the solenoid circuit, or simply the ICE Box may be providing an invalid measurement. I'll be exploring this more later!

RPM Tests:

The idle speed of a 6.5L engine is supposed to be at 700 RPM, -+ 25 RPM. It's a bit high here. I originally tried to tune it down to 700 RPM, but that would allow the engine to stall if I was at high RPM and let go of the throttle.

Around 720 RPM was the sweet spot. Still well within spec, plus the engine RPM never dropped below 359 if I accelerated and then released the throttle. Still to be tested is how the engine behaves once under load. I suspect that I may have to do some work on the injection pump.

Maybe I'll make a video of hooking the system up and using one of the electronic technical manuals to diagnose a failure, should there be some demand for it.

 

[FKAM]

Maybe I'll make a video of hooking the system up and using one of the electronic technical manuals to diagnose a failure, should there be some demand for it.

You have my vote, to make! Pioneer on! Thanx

 

[jeffy777]

I saw a driver for Windows 64. I also saw that there is some USB drivers and cables. So I know there is further enhancements from where you have your system.

If I can find the connector info I would get some of my guys here make a decoder cheap. So all you would need was the cable, a magic box (electronics in a box that will decode the output) and modern computer and bam you can see your ICE info. I work around a group of guys who love to build electronics and software.

So if anyone has info on the connector and its output I would appreciate it.

Thanks.

 

[Wire Fox]

I saw a driver for Windows 64. I also saw that there is some USB drivers and cables. So I know there is further enhancements from where you have your system.

If I can find the connector info I would get some of my guys here make a decoder cheap. So all you would need was the cable, a magic box (electronics in a box that will decode the output) and modern computer and bam you can see your ICE info. I work around a group of guys who love to build electronics and software.

So if anyone has info on the connector and its output I would appreciate it.

Thanks.

What connector? Do you mean that parallel port I mentioned? If so, the TM included with the ICE Box mentioned what it is and how to use it, I'm just not at the computer with it on it yet. If not, them all I can say is the ICE Box basically already is an analog to digital converter and in itself works on 32 bit or 64bit; however, a lot of its bundled software is 32-bit only.

 

[Wire Fox]

Got an answer for that connector. The J7 port on the ICE adapter (that I've been calling ICE box) is designed to connect to the DPA. The -10 manual specifically states "Special Purpose Cable (PN 13580839-2) uses a 15 pin D connector to connect the DPA to the J7 connector of the ICE Interconnecting Box. Used only on the Palletized Load System (PLS), Heavy Expanded Mobility Tactical Truck (HEMTT), and Heavy Equipment Transporter (HET) J1708 vehicles." and in a separate section, "Used with the Data Bus Kit for data acquisition by means of the DCA Cable or NATO PWR Cable. It can be connected to the vehicle during a road test to develop an operating log. This log will consist of vehicle parameters and a record of any malfunctions which may have occurred during the road test. This log can then serve as an aid in fault isolation."

 

[jeffy777]

Got an answer for that connector. The J7 port on the ICE adapter (that I've been calling ICE box) is designed to connect to the DPA. The -10 manual specifically states "Special Purpose Cable (PN 13580839-2) uses a 15 pin D connector to connect the DPA to the J7 connector of the ICE Interconnecting Box. Used only on the Palletized Load System (PLS), Heavy Expanded Mobility Tactical Truck (HEMTT), and Heavy Equipment Transporter (HET) J1708 vehicles." and in a separate section, "Used with the Data Bus Kit for data acquisition by means of the DCA Cable or NATO PWR Cable. It can be connected to the vehicle during a road test to develop an operating log. This log will consist of vehicle parameters and a record of any malfunctions which may have occurred during the road test. This log can then serve as an aid in fault isolation."

Is the TM you mentioned in a PDF form? Maybe I have it but I do not remember it.

Good info. I will get with a couple of guys here to see what they can do. We have been making a box that provides a solid state server in vehicles which also talks to the ODBII, GPS, Cell towers, so that a user in a vehicle can have LAN and WAN networking, up-to-date mapping, vehicle telemetry, and resource buffering. So I think these guys may have what it takes. How long it may take them, I do not know. I do know they could make a system that will work with all modern computers.

 

[Wire Fox]

Wire Fox
Found your thread here from your posting on "what have you done... HMMWV today". I've been trying to figure all this out for a while, thanx for being the "pioneer", I had really no idea where to even start, was just hoping to find someone who was doing what you are. You could spend a lot of hours here on SS lookng, but if you don't know the terminology it's hard to find things sometimes. I didn't even know what STE-ICE was until today. Any chance you could post some pictures of your kit? I've found some kits on the internet but not really sure if they are V2 kit you mention/have. Thanx in advance.

Got home today in time to have enough light for pictures, so it's time to deliver!
Case, Closed and Opened, as-packed:

Non-cable contents displayed:

Assemblies, as seen above: Probe Set; ICE Interconnecting Box; MSD Backup Software Disc 1 & 2; Adapter Set, ICE Test Fittings; Data Bus Kit (mine is missing the d-sub 9 serial cable, but this is extremely easy to replace as it is commercial-of-the-shelf for the last 30 years or so). An earlier ICE Interconnecting Box will have a switch to toggle between DCA power and external power. The version here auto-detects the source.
Cables:

Cables, as seen above: 2X W4 TK Cable (connects transducers to ICE), Serial Power Data Cable, W1 DCA Cable {connects ICE interface to vehicle DCA connector}, Volt/Ohm Ext Cable (red/black test leads).

 

[Wire Fox]

Is the TM you mentioned in a PDF form? Maybe I have it but I do not remember it.

Good info. I will get with a couple of guys here to see what they can do. We have been making a box that provides a solid state server in vehicles which also talks to the ODBII, GPS, Cell towers, so that a user in a vehicle can have LAN and WAN networking, up-to-date mapping, vehicle telemetry, and resource buffering. So I think these guys may have what it takes. How long it may take them, I do not know. I do know they could make a system that will work with all modern computers.

It is in PDF form (and a ghastly IETM version that's tough to navigate, unlike vehicle IETMs). I picked it off of the LOGSA ETM site. For your convenience, have it here! If you care to look, the LOGSA ETM site also has the MSD v3 TMs; however, I didn't grab them because I don't have that kit and I don't think we'll see it in any appreciable quantity for a few more years.