MVPA 2012 Alaska Highway Convoy

[davidkroberts]

the difference is everyone has been to disney... ive never been on the AlCAN. I also fully intend to fish and most likely hunt on the trip. August is usually when my grandfather leaves to go on his Alaska/Canadian adventure trip every year. Thats good enough for me. If nothing else I will have a gun for bears. Getting firearms across the border isnt an issue its just some paperwork and declarartion at the border. Sportsman have been traveling to Canada for decades it isnt anything new. For me this is a once in a lifetime vehicle convoy/camping/hunting/fishing/exploration trip.

 

[mkcoen]

Paul I would suggest you don't go. But unless you make it a hobby to get up every day and try to rain on someone's parade just because you can, lay off the folks that are going or would like to go.

My wife saw some information on this and told me I needed to do it. There wasn't any concern about breaking down or "what's it going to cost" just "you need to do it." And for that reason I probably will. I'll drive, hopefully with a co-driver that has more mechanical experience than me, and she'll fly up to AK when we get there for her part of the vacation.

I'll likely take my M1010 with a M101A1 in tow. The idea is to take the rig and drop it off at my brother's place in WA some time between now and then and fly back up just before the kickoff.

Anyone know about regulations of packing extra fuel cans across the border? Do they need to be empty to cross and then filled on the other side or can we top off before hand?

*****

Just did some rough calculations for the trip - 8536 miles by taking it to WA first and then to BC. I'll likely drive straight back from BC to TX so can save 500 miles on the return trip. At 13mpg and $4/gal avg on diesel it'll cost me a little over $2600 in fuel. I'm not sure what the park fees will be for camping but I calculated $400. $1000 for food for 2 people over 6 weeks (mostly camp food). And the $300 registration fee puts me at $4300. I added in another $700 for breakdown expenses just to round things up to $5k for the trip. If I can find a co-driver to split everything then it's $2500 and that gives me another $500 for misc (and more breakdowns) so $3000 out of pocket for me but still $2500 for the co-driver. Yes it's a lot but for 6 weeks of travel through some beautiful country I think it's reasonable.

 

[m38mike]

I've got to say that I'm enjoying most of the discussion in this thread. Very interesting to see what's important to some individuals and not at all to others. I plan to go, and I'm going to drive the whole route. I'll do it because I can, because my M38 can, because that country up there is wonderful to look at and explore, because the Canadians and Alaskans I know and have met up there have been wonderful people and I hope to meet many more.

I'm so committed to making this trip a good one for myself and everyone else who will go, that I signed on to be the refuel planner for the convoy. After doing that I thought it was ironic that the only all-electric-drive vehicle in the convoy is responsible for planning the fuel support for all of us. But I guess I need fuel too since the generator burns gas. So mkcoen, I'll find out how much extra fuel we can carry, and in what kind of containers (cans/drums/tanks) before we need placards and certificates. We should all plan on extra fuel cans. There will be one, maybe two days where we'll have to have fuel delivered to us because we will not pass a fuel stop in 200 miles of driving.

The staff that's planning this event is pooling lots of knowledge from many sources to do a great job of anticipating problems and planning solutions. There are people who have lead convoys in the past, people who have driven the road, people who can fix almost anything, people who are great at organizing, and everyone is motivated to make this a great experience. We're putting together some SOP's so everyone will know what to expect from when we'll gas up, to when we'll start each day, to how to call home from the middle of a wilderness. They are also looking for the interesting things to see and do along the way, and many of them will be on the itinerary. Hot springs, crossing rivers on Ferrys, ancient Sternwheel steamships, the arctic circle, Army and Air Force bases, North America's tallest mountain, Glaciers, natural lakes, remote countryside, Moose, bears, caribou, and roadhouses that make you feel like you stepped back 50 years in time. All of these are along our route.

What will make this a once-in-a-lifetime trip for me is the good people I will travel with. This will be a challenging trip for all because we will have to be much more self-sufficient than any of the convoys crossing the US. The parts places, fuel stops, and repair shops up north are way fewer and many miles farther apart. That's part of the challenge I'm looking forward to. Making the journey with other self-reliant GI motorheads. Celebrating a historic undertaking from our vast US Military history.

'Nuff said.

 

[davidkroberts]

well im stoked. Ill be going and I will have a ball. Cooking steak and eggs over fire while fishing/hunting/convoying in 18+ hrs of daylight. I have tons of time to get this put together and I have a vehicle now I would feel comfortable taking. the weather averages are going to be between 62 and 48 with less than 2" of rain (Fairbanks Area).

 

[pvtjorge]

the difference is everyone has been to disney... ive never been on the AlCAN. I also fully intend to fish and most likely hunt on the trip. August is usually when my grandfather leaves to go on his Alaska/Canadian adventure trip every year. Thats good enough for me. If nothing else I will have a gun for bears. Getting firearms across the border isnt an issue its just some paperwork and declarartion at the border. Sportsman have been traveling to Canada for decades it isnt anything new. For me this is a once in a lifetime vehicle convoy/camping/hunting/fishing/exploration trip.

Their are restrictions on bringing firearms on this convoy.

 

[paulfarber]

Hunting? You expect to export and reimport a firearm? You are leaving the US, and unless there is some special law allowing US citizens to take guns to Canada without a TON of paperwork (Canada doesn't seem to be a very gun friendly country) I'd quadruple check that 'going hunting in canada' thing,

Visitors / Non-Residents

You can't even fish in the US without a permit.

Fisheries and Oceans Canada | Pacific Region | Recreational Fishing | Licensing

Did you know a fishing permit in Canada in $101? That you are most likely NOT bringing meat back into the US without a valid permit?

I really have to question some of the assumptions of the people planing... $700 'breakdown fund'? I can't get a tow truck in the US for less that $150 just to show up.... you think $700 is gonna fix a 20+ year old US made MV in the Canadian/Alaska wilderness? Maybe CUCVs or some other very civilian MV, but how many NAPA's do you expect to run into up north?

One thing that I did not hear a lot of were the breakdowns on the last convoy. And a dirty little secret was that many MVs were on trailers for most of the haul, and few people actually did the entire trip.

If you plan to go, go... have fun. But be prepared. Most people seem to be underestimating the logistics of going 2000 miles ANYWHERE in a 20+ year old MV. Some are even thinking of taking firearms.. that there is a huge red flag in the lack of understanding of leaving the US.

 

[mkcoen]

Here Paul. I think this thread was started with you in mind:
http://www.steelsoldiers.com/conversations/63507-attitiude-steel-soldiers.html


****
And yes, I am taking a CUCV. And I plan on taking along most of the major parts that tend to fail (extra alt, starter, etc). And yes I have a medium towbar that I also intend to bring along in the event I should need a tow. I think I can get that help from one of the several deuces who have already signed up (and paid) for the trip.

****
Oh, and yes, I know there is no Santa Claus already so no need for that bulletin.

 

[davidkroberts]

My grandfather has been hunting and fishing in Canada for the last 40 years most recently four months ago. He has always brought his own firearms. He has driven across the border every time its really not a big deal. They are Canadians not Nazis and a large part of the economy in that area are hunters and fisherman. The firearm laws in Canada are more restrictive on semi-autos mostly handguns. This will mainly be a hunting and fishing trip for me. I will probably be with the convoy far a bit of it but had no intention of staying with them the whole way. That would throw a damper on my fishing. At 35 mph I think i can catch them in my M1009. Fishing in Canada and Alaska without a firearm for bears is something I dont think im going to try.

Paul you okay buddy, you seem a bit hot under the collar about this.... Its going to be okay. I work for the US embassy I might have the ability to coordinate something that thousands do every year.

 

[paulfarber]

Not really.

I am pointing out the issues that you need to be aware of. Would you rather know how to stay legal NOW, or when the Mounty is cuffing you becuase you had 'no idea' it was illegal to take a gun to Canada? Do you think ICE is going to give you a mulligan at the boarder becuase you have no paperwork for your firearm or are trying to bring back meat/fruits/veggies?

If you think I am negative, fine... the mistakes you make will be much more costly than simply reading the advice of people who know this stuff.

Plus, if you cared to read.. I never tried to talk anyone out of going... I don't care if you do or not go, but BE PREPARED and KNOW THE LAWS.

Its truly amazing that people think they are just gonna toss the gun in the truck and head to Canada. YEE HAW! Or that a breakdown is going to be fixed by a trip to the local NAPA. Have you looked over the route in google maps?

 

[hndrsonj]

Taking a non regulated firearm into Canada isn't a big deal at all. Just leave the assault rifle at home. A hundred bucks for a fishing license is not excessive and if you are doing this trip you would be eating the fish not bringing them back. (imagine trying to keep them frozen for that length of time up there?).

 

[73m819]

I just see this trip costing a good $20,000, a lot of time off work, MAJOR break downs. the cross country trip was easy compared to this one, the cross country one you could go as far or as short as you wanted, the Alaska one, there is no stopping and turning around, well you could but in that kind of country, I don't think you want to run the road by yourself in a 20, 30, or 40 year old truck. So I see this trip is for the person that has a LOT of money and a LOT of time, I DO NOT see it aimed at the average MV hobbyist by the MVPA

 

[pvtjorge]

I realize this is an expensive outing and I would like to join the convoy too. But I keep thinking, Man!, that is a long way to haul an MV and back. then I think how many gas cans am I gonna have to bring to get me from one station to the next in Canada and Alaska.

Knowing my vehicle, If I had any break downs I believe they would be minimal. I would probably have my towing vehicle a 2008 1/2Ton crew cab GMC p/u pulling an 18' trailer follow anyway. That's more expense for sure, but security and a place to pitch a tent on the trailer. Now that would require someone other than my wife to help drive either vehicle.

Mapquest tells me it's a little over 2700 miles to Dawson Creek from home. I don't drive at night anymore so that's maybe a 7 days journey and a motel room everyight. I figure gas and expenses to get to Dawson Creek an back would be approx. $5000. That's assuming gas may get to $5/gal by then. If gas gets to $5 a gal in the US it certainly will be higher up north.

I'm gonna figure maybe $7/gal.. That would make it approx. $4600 just in gas alone on the convoy. Stick another $2000 in expenses on that. So, $5000 + $4600 + $2000 = $11,600.

I would reserve $15,000 for the trip.

Look's like I'm trying talk myself out it. haha!

 

[CatMan]

MVPA 2012 Alaska Convoy

Well, it won't be a free trip that's for sure, but if you go and you should, you won't have to say, "Oh the 2012 Convoy"?, "well no, I stayed in Texas, layed around on the couch and watched Oprah for four weeks."

You can travel with the group driving up from Texas, find someone else in the group to split the motels with. We are working with the folks in Dawson Creek to have a secure yard were we can leave the Pick up and trailer. Get someone to go with you and get them to pay for part of the gas. That's what others are doing. Don't sweat the little stuff like were to store a couple gas cans.

Just make up you mind it can be done. It will be a once in a lifetime trip. WE had a blast on the 2009 Convoy. Met and became friends for life with many new people. Never worried about a breakdown. And would do it again in a minute.

"Upon the plains of hesitation, rest the bones of countless individuals who sat down to rest and resting, died never achieving their the goal"

We'll see you in Dawson Creek in August 2012. Be there.

Cat Man

 

[pvtjorge]

Cat Man,

No, I'm sure that I won't be watching Oprah for four weeks or even one minute. I guess I am not as bold as I use to be when I was younger, But you are very encouraging. I can see you doing the 2009 convoy sense it probably came very close to your area.

What is the MV you are taking?

 

[m38mike]

For Paul and David,
Hunting sounds like fun, and bringing a long gun into Canada is easy, but the convoy rules specify NO WEAPONS of any kind. So hunting trips in the evening are out. I'd recommend deciding between the convoy, or the hunting trip Dave, but it won't be both.

pvtjorge,
do you know what mileage you get with your M38? Our longest day is about 230 miles. You should be fine with one gas can plus your gas tank. I'll be making sure we can refuel at least once every day, gas cans included. A second can would simply be good insurance, and extra weight. We have 15 jeeps signed up now, so there will be many kinded drivers and lots of spare parts. If your jeep is in good condition, there's no reason short of $$ why you can't enjoy a great vacation with lots of other Willys drivers in the land of the midnight sun!

And contrary to what paul mentioned earlier, almost all vehicles made the 09 convoy on their own wheels. So for anyone planning on coming, get the iron fixed. If you think it needs fixing, fix it before you go. When the other 75 vehicles are pulling out of a rest stop is not the time to discover your old rubber brake lines are beginning to leak. With good machines in good condition we'll all be able to enjoy a great adventure.

 

[paulfarber]

I read the 2009 AAR and while 'over 125 MVs' participated AT LEAST 41 MVs HAD A PROBLEM.

There might have been more, since the response was voluntary.

So, 41/125 = 33% of the MVs had an issue. Most had more than one, I counted one guy with 5.

Go, don't go, just be prepared.


Another point:
Financially, the 2009 convoy was a net loss.. and that one at least had some sort of appeal. Since the MVPA set aside membership funds for these events, how many members know that the MVPA is losing money on wacky trips? I am currently not a member, nor will I ever be one again, but what gains are to be had from these expenditures? Was there a membership 'bump' after the 2009 convoy? It seems that (as usual) the MVPA is willing to spend membership money on pet projects and 'buddies bennies'. While that may sound like an unsupported attack, let me remind everyone of the huge problems the BOD had what, 2-3 years ago with compensation and back room deals.

 

[oldMan99]

Paul you okay buddy, you seem a bit hot under the collar about this.... Its going to be okay.

Paul,

Your probably a real nice guy and in person you and I may get along real well. However, as pertains to the above quote, I'm sorry but I have to agree. Everything I have read posted by you in this thread seems to be very negative.

I think we all get it, your not the least bit interested in going. Based on your comments that is probably the best for all parties.

Man, lighten up some, let those that want to go and want to have fun go and have what fun they can. If in the end it is a disaster then you can sit back, smile, and gleefully say "I told you so".

In the mean time, we all get it, you do not approve of any aspect of this trip and you believe that every single aspect of it is a total and complete waste and that there will be absolutely nothing but one huge problem after then next and that not one single person on the trip will have any fun at all... We get it, we ALL get it, We all get it over and over. You can stop now.

For my part, I intend to try to do what I can to obtain and prepair a proper MV for the trip and if I am successful in my attempt I intend to go and make the best of whatever happens every day.

No matter what, it will be an adventure. I will meet a lot of people.

It is indeed likely I may not really like a few of them.

It is more likely that the small segment I may not get along with all that well will be vastly outnumbered by those that I do get along with well, probably very well in fact.

It is even more likely that some of the people I meet I will become really good friends with.

And If I am not successful in getting my vehicle ready in time I plan to try to hitch a ride with somebody that has an empty seat and would like some help with gas money.

Or I could just sit on the internet and bitch about how miserable the entire trip will be and try to ruin it for everybody else.

And now, back to the regularly scheduled discussion of all the possibilities and the fun to be had by all...

 

[m38mike]

Go, don't go, just be prepared.

Thank you Paul. That is the message that we on the leadership team are also sharing with those interested in going. We're simply putting a more positive spin on it.

Another point:
Financially, the 2009 convoy was a net loss.. and that one at least had some sort of appeal. Since the MVPA set aside membership funds for these events, how many members know that the MVPA is losing money on wacky trips? I am currently not a member, nor will I ever be one again, but what gains are to be had from these expenditures? Was there a membership 'bump' after the 2009 convoy? It seems that (as usual) the MVPA is willing to spend membership money on pet projects and 'buddies bennies'. While that may sound like an unsupported attack, let me remind everyone of the huge problems the BOD had what, 2-3 years ago with compensation and back room deals.

This reflects on you as a disgruntled former MVPA member. Since you are no longer a member, why would you be concerned about how the organization chooses to spend it's money supporting it's membership in a sponsored activity? Do you care how I spend my money? Since you will never be a member again, you don't get a vote in how our organization conducts it's business. We are all adults here, well except for that lucky 16 year old who just got his first deuce. Your words of warning are not needed.

'Nuff said.

On to happier topics! The leaders have planned out a tentative route to follow for the convoy. Late this spring, or early summer a team will test drive the route to validate the good planning that's been applied so far. I'm sure that somewhere in there the details will get published on this and other forums for everyone to enjoy.

We've got about 75 vehicles preregistered or registered already. Most of them are MV's that are going without a chase or support POV. Those are good folks who know how to take care of their MV, and have confidence that any mechanical issues that they can't handle, will be handled with the skills of other MV owners like themselves, or by the outstanding Maintenance Team that will be traveling with us. So we've got 3 layers of skill working toward keeping everyone on the road; each individual owner, the teams of owners of similar vehicles, and the outstanding convoy Maintenance Team.

So if you've done a GOOD job of vehicle preparation, you WILL have a great adventure!

 

[Stalwart]

When I went negative it was about MY OWN shortcomings in my ability to remain sane going 30 mph (that's assuming I'm sane now, which is debatable). I want to go in the worst way, not sure if I can make sure my truck is totally dependable for 7,000+ miles and it is a 1984 with 28,000 miles on the clock. Until I can be reasonably sure, I'm gonna hold off signing up. The work, systems upgrades and maintenance will continue.

It would be a trip of a lifetime!

Well, this sums it up:

 

[pvtjorge]

I don't really know for sure what the mpg's used is. I guess when it warms up I'll take it for a run and see how far I can go on a full tank and try to average 30-35 mph doing it.
But just for grins I'd say 10mph. We'll see.