Now I Don't Know if my Cab is even a Gasser Cab.

[Barrman]

Now I Don't Know if my Cab is even a Gasser Cab. M35 differences

I have been pointing out differences between 1952 and 1953 cab and bodies for a few weeks now as I find them. It seems the biggest difference was staring me in the face all these months and I didn't see it until yesterday.

My 1952 and 1953 Gasser trucks both have a flat firewall as seen in the second picture below. My replacement cab has an indent away from the engine on the firewall as pictured in the first picture.

I didn't catch it until I went to put on the forward tunnel cover and it didn't fit. I had already put on the starter lever, throttle linkage and all the wires without figuring it out. The flat firewall cab was sitting about 20 feet away for me to walk over to and make sure I was putting stuff in the proper hole the entire time too. Thankfully, I had cleaned and painted the front cover from both cabs just so I could use the best one and keep rust from killing the other one.

I was looking at a 1969 Multifuel today. Pistolnut was laughing at me as I walked around his noticing differences and similarities between his truck and mine. But, his firewall is just like my replacement cab firewall. His even has the holes for the Gasser throttle linkage, starter lever and a mount for a generator. But, he has multifuel fenders on his, newer headlight panels and the frame under the cab is square at the front compared to the curve on mine.

Basically, the only real difference between his cab and mine is the dash panel which has a bigger hole for the bigger gauge plate.

Interesting stuff if you care about it. Oh, here is how far I got Saturday in the bottom picture. I am about out of painted parts to put on the truck now. Hopefully, it will warm up above 60 this week so I can get some more stuff ready.

 

[pistolnut]

RE: Now I Don

Now I get what you were talking about Tim! I can't believe how different those cabs are. I see what you meant about the MG mount on the passenger side door hinge. Today confirmed my suspicions that there is no telling how old my deuce is or what it started out as. It looks to me like many of the upgrades may have been done at the unit level rather than as part of a major rebuild/refit.

 

[nattieleather]

RE: Now I Don

That indent in the firewall is probably ment to clear the diesel motor that wasn't needed for the gasser. Unless you are worried about the been counting restores nobody and I mean nobody is going to notice it.

 

[Recovry4x4]

Here's a pic of the cab on my 53 Stude. Has the indent and I know this is the original cab. Interesting finds for sure.

 

[DDoyle]

Way back when - Reo made the cabs themselves - it seems even for IH (who used them on five tons) - at some point, Budd began to make the cabs - when I have not yet determined. I do know in December 1950 Budd was struggling to get the needed steel.

The Budd cabs were made to be universal - and the extra space was to clear the R6602 in a 5-ton.

Regards,
David

 

[Barrman]

Thanks for the insight David.

I don't care about "correctness" of the parts Joe. I just have become facinated with the subtle differences in the parts I am working with. I also figure there are people reading this who want to know as close as possible what year truck they are looking at.

Kind of like car guys and the ability to tell a '71 Chevelle from a '72 while looking at the front only. If you know which front blinker lens is which, you can. Otherwise you have to walk to the rear of the car.

Kenny's picture just confirms my theory posted in another thread about 1952-1953 changes. His has the cab mounted rear brace for the front fenders, squared off battery and tool box covers and the type D air regulator.

Now I can say the indent in the firewall "might" be a Studebaker built cab that is still a Gasser M35 cab. I just don't see a diesel truck being converted back to a Gasser is why I limit my projections.

Thanks for the help gentlemen!

 

[DDoyle]

Gentlemen - I believe I have found the definative answer to this question. Attached is a request for a quotation for the Reo-type cab that IH sent to Reo in May 1950. Pay particular attention to the area I have highlighted. By the way, Reo responded 6 days later with a quote of 408.86 - which included windshield, seats, canvas top, mirrors and wipers.

Mass production of the five-ton began in January, 1951, with 55 trucks being assembled.

This would be the origin of the indention - and there would be no reason for two different styles to remain in production, as the five-ton cab will fit the deuce.

Hope this helps,
David Doyle

 

[Recovry4x4]

David, you are an unbelievable source of information. Never fails to amaze me!

 

[DanMartin]

David, you are truly a wealth of information! It's amazing how you came up with a definitive answer to this (let's face it) obscure question. I would love to see all of the similar letters in your files...what a fun read that would be!

Oh..and this letter was sent on my b-day! (well...19 years before).

 

[ida34]

You should set up a lemonade stand and ask $5 per question answered. Like Lucy in Charlie Brown. Just know that all the help you provide on the site and to the community as well comes back in book sales. I have many of your books on MV and wait with a credit card ready for any new ones to come out.

 

[Barrman]

Cool! Thank you for looking into this. I did not start this thread thinking "DDoyle is going to see this, stop what he is doing to provide for his family and look up my answer within 24 hours."

I actually feel kind of bad that you did just that. I love the complete answer given though. Thank you.

If I understand this correctly, any M35 made after May 1950 could have had the recessed firewall depending on how long it took each maker to use up the flat firewall supplies on hand. Along with making the tooling switch over. But, all 5 tons did from the start. Right? Very interesting.

 

[DDoyle]

Cool! Thank you for looking into this. I did not start this thread thinking "DDoyle is going to see this, stop what he is doing to provide for his family and look up my answer within 24 hours."

I actually feel kind of bad that you did just that. I love the complete answer given though. Thank you.

If I understand this correctly, any M35 made after May 1950 could have had the recessed firewall depending on how long it took each maker to use up the flat firewall supplies on hand. Along with making the tooling switch over. But, all 5 tons did from the start. Right? Very interesting.

Glad to help - I find this type of thing very intersting.

As for the rest of the message, your close - I'd say 99+ percent of the 5 tons did - I know where one of the original 5-6 prototypes is - and will take a CLOSE look at it in about 3 months. (If I said all five tons, sure as the devil someone would say "well the first one didn't!)

As far as the change over goes - the contract to build 5-tons was awarded on June 7, 1950 - and IH would not have ordered cabs before the contract was awarded - I'd be surprised if the IH-style cab was made before fall 1950.

What I DON"T know - yet - is if Reo really made the cabs for IH. White, who was the second runner up on the five-ton contract, had Reo quote them on the drawings and information necessary for them to make (or have made) the cab themselves. IH may have done this as well.

I know with certainity, as mentioned earlier, Budd made cabs for 2 1/2 ton trucks. I don't know everyone that they sold these to, however they were definately bought by Studebaker and at least one was shipped to International Harvester.

Reo never made five-tons - so I suppose its possible all Reo-made cabs had flat panels, and those made by/for others had the depression - but at least now we know with certainty why the change was made.

Regards,
David

 

[littlebob]

I noticed the differences in mine also. I think DDoyle and Medlog were able to date my truck to 1952. It had the same flat firewall and also had the mounting holes for the floor mounted starter button. The donor cab(which I don't have any info on), has the hump and a reinforcing plate where the multifuel Air cleaner mounts and lacks the floor starter holes.
littlebob

 

[Barrman]

Another little tell tale I have noticed is the front tunnel cover. Obviously, the flat firewall cover is different than the recessed firewall cover. But, mine which I know came from a Gasser truck has the speedometer cable going up in the middle of the cover. You can see this in the picture above. Pistolnut has the speedo cable coming up on the drivers side of the cover. His cab has the mount holes for the floor starter, but not the cutout for the starter "button" itself, so his cab has probably been a multifuel all its life.

Just little stuff that I am trying to point out as I find.

Thanks for all the help gentlemen!

 

[EO2NMCB]

DDoyle you are to MV's, What Galen Govier is to Mopars!!!! Many thanks for all that you do!

 

[54reo]

DDoyle you are to MV's, What Galen Govier is to Mopars!!!! Many thanks for all that you do!

I've been thinking the same thing!

 

[hndrsonj]

Here's another question. I know of most of the sheetmetal differences between the multi's and gassers. In fact everything is a little different except the doors and hoods. I have not been able to find any differences in these. Can anyone point any differences out on either the doors or hoods?

 

[FreightTrain]

wasn't the profile of the hood scalops a little different in the early models?

 

[Barrman]

None that I have observed between the doors, hoods, rear of the cab, cowling on the front of the cab, windshield frame and the other big stuff. The early Gasser trucks had the wiper motors off set some compared to the later trucks with centered motors on both sides. Now, if you look real close at my avatar, you will notice the Gasser has the hood hold downs on "upside down." The early trucks were that way and the holes in the hood and grill gaurd don't let you turn them around. Unless you drill out the gaurd and I didn't want to do that.

As pointed out above and in some other of my post from early 2008. The biggest changes happened between 1952 and 1953. The way the front fender mounted required changes to the fronts of the tools box and battery door, different firewalls, different clutch and transmission covers. At least those are the main differences I have observed between Gasser M35's as built.

Then the multifuel era had a lot of little changes such as the head light mounts, inner fenders, dash panel and gauge cluster, starting activation method, exhaust routing, remote generator regulator to internally regulated alternator, flasher box for the blinker system, cold start systems, Douglas fittings to Packard fitting wiring harness, at least 4 different ways of mounting tail lights, bigger bucket tail lights, different bed designs, different u-joints in the front axles, different version of the transmisson, different horn buttons and a few other things that were required for the multifuel switch from the REO OA331. Plus all the different versions of cold weather gas powered heaters, multifuel powered heaters for the engines, then gas or multifuel powered heaters for the cab, gas or multifuel powered heaters for the bed, water heaters for the cab. Different versions of soft top support, different hard top versions, different seats.

I could walk around between my two Gassers and observe at least a dozen differences between 1952 and 1953. Then walk between the Gasser and the Whistler and pick out at least another dozen. It comes down to how detailed do you want and when do you stop?

 

[Barrman]

I just did a fast search and can't find my thread showing pictures of most of the major differences. I will find it or post them again in a few days.

Don't forget the parking brake handle and cable, on/off switch, plastic versus metal wiper motors, water cooled vs. air cooled two cylinder air compressors vs. air cooled single cylinder air compressors, trunion bushings versus trunion bearings, brake hold down hardware, short versus long air packs, fluid or air activated brake lights and the dual master models. When do you want the list to stop?