Off road Diesel in a 2011 MEP 803

[fpchief]

I am reading that off road diesel is good for any engine prior to 2007...not sure how true that is but I wanted to see about it in my 2011 MEP 803. Any wisdom? I am going to burn down trough my diesel storage and want to replace it with red fuel if I can burn it in the MEP.

Thank you

 

[simp5782]

Red dye is no different than any other diesel just dyed for tax reasons. Its ulsd which older engines need lubricantion for.

There will be an increased fuel consumption with red dye vs on road diesel. We see sometimes 4 hours of additional use on a tank with on road diesel with heavy equipment

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[Triple Jim]

As far as I know, offroad diesel is normal fuel with dye in it, with no other difference. Nothing I've read contradicts this, except some Internet guessing that offroad diesel is not low-sulfur. I doubt if it is any different from road diesel, because I doubt that refineries would make separate (expensive) runs for offroad fuel. I do like to dump a little oil in my diesel fuel so my 003A's injector pump gets some extra lubrication. Crankcase drainings from my various engines is my favorite lubricant.

 

[eatont9999]

Any year MEP 8 series will burn any petroleum-based, liquid oil. Diesel, transmission fluid, hydraulic oil, engine oil, etc. If using straight oil, I usually cut it with 25% unleaded gasoline to thin it out. Almost all mechanically injected, IDI Diesel engines can run on these fuels.

 

[98G]

I'd be leary of crankcase drainings. Sounds like a way to clog a filter. Or introduce nasties to the IP.

 

[eatont9999]

I'd be leary of crankcase drainings. Sounds like a way to clog a filter. Or introduce nasties to the IP.

Definitely thin it out and pre-filter it. I usually thin mine out and let it settle for a few months, filter it and run it. I usually run it in my vehicles but now that I have a generator...

 

[Bighorn]

As far as I know, offroad diesel is normal fuel with dye in it, with no other difference. Nothing I've read contradicts this, except some Internet guessing that offroad diesel is not low-sulfur. I doubt if it is any different from road diesel, because I doubt that refineries would make separate (expensive) runs for offroad fuel. I do like to dump a little oil in my diesel fuel so my 003A's injector pump gets some extra lubrication. Crankcase drainings from my various engines is my favorite lubricant.

I am the Class a fuel system operator for my Lodge.
We have fuel delivered twice a year.
Gasoline for ATV's and snowmobiles and Diesel for our Skid steer and Logan Snowcat.
Our Diesel is Dyed diesel.
I have the delivery ticket for 2,000 gallons of the stuff right here in front of me.
It is composed of 25% #1 diesel (lower paraffin for winter ops)
and 75% #2 diesel.
The red dye is added at the fuel distributor before the tanker left their yard.
The total Sulphur content is 15ppm.

The only difference between summer and winter pump diesel is the percentage of either #1 or #2 diesel in the mixture.
The only thing that makes "offroad" diesel any different is the red dye they add to it to show that it is not taxed for highway use.

I cannot sell you my red diesel even if you run out of fuel in my driveway.
Have to siphon it out of my personal truck.
The penalty for sale of offroad diesel is a fine and potential loss of our fuel dealership license.
"For use in all nonroad diesel engines. Not for use in highway vehicles or engines except for tax-exempt use in accordance with section 4082 of the internal revenue code."
There is no difference in Sulphur content between #1 and #2 or any mixture of which you can buy or find anywhere..
Or at least from Phillips 66 from which, we get our fuel.

 

[fpchief]

Thank all of you for the info. Exactly what i needed.

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[steelypip]

The only theoretically higher sulfur fuel I've run across is home heating oil (#2 Fuel Oil). I would be surprised, though, if they actually ship different feedstocks through the pipelines for any fuel in this viscosity range. I suspect HHO is the same #2 diesel you get at the pump with or without red dye in it most places at least, and is therefore likely also ULSD. I wouldn't run HHO in a diesel anyway without adding a lot of fuel pump lubricant or Biodiesel to act as a pump lubricant.

I've been running red diesel exclusively in my MEP-002A for about six years now. It does the normal diesel fuel things, and fuel burn is right in line with what the manual claims at the loads I see, and has been consistent over the years.

I've also run and burned a couple of batches of 'black diesel' (Waste motor oil plus regular unleaded gasoline), mostly as an experiment to validate that I can do this in a disaster situation (the 'snowpocalypse' of 2009 made my road impassible for a week). Other than the scent of the exhaust, I've noticed no difference between my carefully filtered and settled black diesel versus the red diesel I buy.

 

[eatont9999]

There are two types of fuel that a Diesel engine will burn but ultimately be destroyed by. Vegetable oil and high concentrations of biodiesel. Veggie oil will leave a thick, tar-like substance on anything it touches, over time. Biodiesel will destroy rubber hoses and seals inside the injection system. Even the small amount of Biodiesel added to common road diesel has significantly reduced the life of rubber hoses on several of my vehicles. Hoses that I replaced no more than 2 years ago have become hard and cracked, causing leaks.

 

[Guyfang]

This thread should be a sticky.

 

[Captaincarrier]

If you have red diesel fuel in a road driven vehicle you can be fined by the state and federal government for tax evasion.

 

[98G]

Thought better of it....

 

[rustystud]

I've said it before and I'll say it again. There is no difference in "any" diesel fuel today except for the dye they use for tax purposes. ALL diesel fuel today by command of the United States Government is "ultra low sulfur" fuel period. The only time you will find a different blend is between summer and winter fuels. They try and eliminate the "Pariffin" in the summer fuel as it gels in cold weather. So they will Mix it with Kerosene and other additives. This also lowers the "Cetane" rating for the fuel by about 5 points on average. The days of using household heating fuel or off-road equipment fuel to increase your engines efficiency are long gone.

 

[Daybreak]

Howdy,
Another way to think of it.

The MEP-802/803 uses a Lister Petter design LPW2 and LPW4 which has been around a long time. There are no changes present from a MEP-803A built in 1992 when compared to your 2011 unit. They were made to use sloppy precision.

The only changes which we have seen is the diesel used to be 3000ppm Sulphur, then got jacked to 500ppm, then today is 15ppm.

Diesel Fuel = ULSD = 15ppm = greenish tint
off-road = the same stuff with a red dye.

The engine's were made with a diesel spec of 3000ppm Sulphur.

That is why folks talk about adding something to make up for the loss of Sulphur.

 

[155mm]

I use 2 stroke engine oil, 8 oz per 100-150 gallons

 

[rustystud]

Howdy,
Another way to think of it.

The MEP-802/803 uses a Lister Petter design LPW2 and LPW4 which has been around a long time. There are no changes present from a MEP-803A built in 1992 when compared to your 2011 unit. They were made to use sloppy precision.

The only changes which we have seen is the diesel used to be 3000ppm Sulphur, then got jacked to 500ppm, then today is 15ppm.

Diesel Fuel = ULSD = 15ppm = greenish tint
off-road = the same stuff with a red dye.

The engine's were made with a diesel spec of 3000ppm Sulphur.

That is why folks talk about adding something to make up for the loss of Sulphur.

Actually in the "good ole days" (1980's) diesel had 5,000ppm sulfur. 5,000 to 15, what a bunch of nonsense in my opinion.

 

[rogpike]

Just another note for those unfamiliar with off road diesel reading this post. I called today and off road diesel was $2.12 per gallon vs. the pump price of $2.59 per gallon. If you are like me and have several pieces of off road diesel equipment it might be worth it to go through the permit process (required in KY) and have it around for your tractors and equipment. For just a genset that is serving for when the power goes out, I would get what is most convenient.

 

[csheath]

I have off road diesel delivered 100 gallons at the time. It takes me 3 or 4 months to go through it with my tractor and backhoe. My supplier says all we can get is 5% bio diesel. As has already been stated the red dye is added as it's pumped and it's the same product sold for on road other than the dye. My deliveries end up costing about the same as on road diesel at the pump since I do not claim agricultural use. The main advantage for me is not having to transport it. They take off the road tax but I still pay state sales tax and of course the supplier has to make a little for delivering which they build in the the cost per gallon. Add to that the cost of additives. I spend about $13 per delivery on additives.

I did extensive reading before filling my first load and settled on using Killum Biocide and Stanadyne Lubricity additives. For my 55 gallon drums it takes about 1-1/2 onces of biocide and half bottle (8 ounces) of lubricity additive in each drum.

I would have to have a large supply of other waste and be desperate to consider making up concoctions to burn in my diesel equipment. I will stick with regular diesel fuel.

 

[Bmxenbrett]

Is there any difference between offroad diesel and home heating oil?