Power Steering Fluid Blow Out

[nikojo]

Been snowing so I thought I'd take the truck out and help wife run errands. Ran perfect. Even wife like it.

Then as we are pulling into drive I'm turning near lock to pull into drive way and feel it's getting hard to steer suddenly. Smell some type of fluid and some burnt smell but only briefly and already parked and off.

Go look around and there is a 10 foot trail of 'blood' going into drive and then a hemorrhage of fluid under truck. It's cold and there is a lot of snow so I couldn't get under truck. From above the cadillac valve/fan hoses/hydroboost/ and the pump/hoses all look ok although there is some spray of fluid in those areas. Seems like it may be steering box although hoses all look secure.

Can someone give me sense of what it might be and what I'm in for??

I'm just demoralized.

Is it even possible to reasonably drive without steering assist. Could barely turn wheel.

 

[Mogman]

You could possibly drive without power assist but you do not want to, no power brakes ether and you will damage the pump if run without fluid.

 

[nikojo]

You could possibly drive without power assist but you do not want to, no power brakes ether and you will damage the pump if run without fluid.

Makes sense. Do I fill it back up with fluid and then try and see where it's leaking?

Why would it fail so catastrophically?

 

[Mogman]

Well you gota figure out where the fluid is going, could be any number of things, hopefully just a hose

 

[Mogman]

Here is a handy flow schematic, just take the winch out, the pressure hose goes straight from the hydro-boost to the steering gear.

 

[nikojo]

Here is a handy flow schematic, just take the winch out, the pressure hose goes straight from the hydro-boost to the steering gear.

Thanks for that.

 

[TNDRIVER]

Been snowing so I thought I'd take the truck out and help wife run errands. Ran perfect. Even wife like it.

Then as we are pulling into drive I'm turning near lock to pull into drive way and feel it's getting hard to steer suddenly. Smell some type of fluid and some burnt smell but only briefly and already parked and off.

Go look around and there is a 10 foot trail of 'blood' going into drive and then a hemorrhage of fluid under truck. It's cold and there is a lot of snow so I couldn't get under truck. From above the cadillac valve/fan hoses/hydroboost/ and the pump/hoses all look ok although there is some spray of fluid in those areas. Seems like it may be steering box although hoses all look secure.

Can someone give me sense of what it might be and what I'm in for??

I'm just demoralized.

Is it even possible to reasonably drive without steering assist. Could barely turn wheel.

Two lines behind the left splash panel to the cooler kind of out of sight, is my bet. And there is a reason it is advised to change all the lines out as a sound practice when acquiring one of these. Ask me why I know about these two lines!

 

[nikojo]

Confirmed the carnage.

Filled it up with power steering fluid and started it up........gushing from input shaft area of steering box. Audible and excessive.

As a tangent I noted the thread regarding 'reliability' and agreed (and still do agree) with those supporting general reliability regarding this truck. Have to account for fact that these are over 20 years old. But God bless if this had to happen.


Questions:

1. Is this the seal?

2. Why did this go bad at this time? Was it because I was turning wheel which significantly spikes pressure and the box/seal was crap?

3. Can I move the truck a short distance? Like 200 yards to get in better spot in my driveway? I'm concerned that without fluid the pump will get fried or even the hyrdrobooster?? Is this reasonable fear? What else can go bad without fluid?

4. I don't trust the previous owner as there have been several similar things that needed to be re-done. So my instinct is to replace the whole box with a new or reman box. Is this reasonable thinking?

5. Should/Can I 'upgrade' the box? I've read of the Sheppard box (H1/Alpha) that looks beefier. I understand it is significant $$ but at this point I just want it done right and with the best parts. I've also seen a PSC box.

6. Lastly, I've also read on the 'Moog' upgrade which includes pitman arm/idler arm/ steering link........is this reasonable to do? Does this fit the Sheppard box?


Thanks again everyone. Can't do this alone and can't believe how much I've done with the help of this forum.

 

[Mogman]

I would try and drag it as far as I could, could you move it a couple hundred yards? probably but why tempt the fates.
Curious what fluid if any you put in the PS?
Also never hold the steering at lock one way or the other that does spike the pressure and heat.

 

[Mogman]

I am curious, maybe someone can comment on if the frame mounting holes are the same, if so there is really no need unless you are truly armored (read heavy) to have the Shepard steering gear, tons of Saginaw boxes out there

 

[Coug]

1) maybe/probably

2) the seal should be fine under normal use, so either it's failed or something else has failed and caused the seal to fail.

3) not a good idea

4) it certainly won't hurt anything to replace the entire box. If you aren't comfortable doing tear down/inspection/repair, it's probably better to replace.

5) Last I heard Sheppard wasn't selling to civilians, and wasn't supporting their products anymore, so I'd recommend against going that route.

6)Moog problem solvers (as opposed to just moog parts) are definitely an upgrade.
And no, you can't mix saginaw and sheppard parts. Different sizes, different geometry.

 

[nikojo]

I would try and drag it as far as I could, could you move it a couple hundred yards? probably but why tempt the fates.
Curious what fluid if any you put in the PS?
Also never hold the steering at lock one way or the other that does spike the pressure and heat.

I refilled it with power steering fluid. I'm pretty sure previous owner had ATF in it (pink/red). The new power steering fluid is blue.

 

[Mogman]

I refilled it with power steering fluid. I'm pretty sure previous owner had ATF in it (pink/red). The new power steering fluid is blue.

ATF is the way to go, cannot say that PS fluid causes problems but just like anything mixing fluid types is usually not a good idea so a good flush with the new fluid is a must.
I like many others use and recommend DEX III over DEX VI but many do use DEX VI, kinda a Mary Ann VS Ginger thing...

 

[nikojo]

ATF is the way to go, cannot say that PS fluid causes problems but just like anything mixing fluid types is usually not a good idea so a good flush with the new fluid is a good idea.
I like many others use and recommend DEX III over DEX VI but many do use DEX VI

I have a built in flush now.........will switch to the DEX III ATF. I guess I can have one of my kids poor in the fluid as I drive it.

 

[mccullek]

First off, you do want to use ATF on the power steering, as that is the preferred fluid. I just rebuilt my power steering box with a kit I bought from one of the well known military suppliers. The kit was junk!

The input shat seals were the wrong size and the pitman arm shatf seals failed instantly. I found that my gear box is the same as a 79 Chevy Malibu, so if you need a new kit, source it locally from NAPA if possible, as their kit is half the price and a better quality.

Look closely to see if the Pitman shaft seal is the one that failed, as a hard left turn causes extreme pressure and could blow a bad or weak seal and the fluid just gushes out at very high pressures when that seal is bad.

I replaced my bad kit seal with the new NAPA seal without removing the box again and things have been fine since then. If the guy you bought it from got a rebuild kit like me, then it was probably less than perfect parts.

The hardest part about changing those seals with the gear box still in place is removing the Pitman arm. Go get a pitman arm tool for about $16 and save yourself a ton of heartache and time. I wasted 6 hours trying to remove it and once I got the right tool, it literally took 30 seconds. I also spent another hour rethreading by shaft because I buggered up the threadstrying to remove it without the right tool.

I would check the pitman arm seal and the steering shaft seals, but it sounds like the pitman seals to me. You can buy that kit alone from NAPA for $12.

Another tip on removing air from the system once the gear box is repaired. It will take a few rounds of turning the wheel from full left to full right about 20 times, then check fluid leve and fill again if necessary. Once it remains full with no foam and no noise, you know you got all of the air out. Do this with the wheels in the air as well or you will be replacing the seal again most likely.

I think it took 3 or 4 rounds of turning the wheel and adding fluid before mine was full and stopped foaming and squealing.