Pulling tractor with a deuce engine

[JP]

I do not own a deuce but I have an Oliver pulling tractor that uses a D4800 Hercules engine that is real similar to an ldt-465 except it has the manifolds reversed so that the turbo is on top and the intake manifold is on the bottom. My engine is a 478 cu. in. but I have been told that there is a military engine that had a longer stroke. Does anyone know if the lds-427 had a different stroke than the rest of the ld engines? I was thinking that maybe they used a smaller bore and a longer stroke. Thank is advance for any insite on this.

 

[rdixiemiller]

The engine manuals for the LDT 465 and LDS 427 are in the tech section. Not sure on the differences, except the 427 was not supposed to be as reliable in the field. Having never owned anything except the LDT 465, I can't say from experience.
Pulling tractor? as in tractor pulls? What kind of RPM do you turn your engine at?

 

[JP]

I rev the engine to about 4,000 rpm at the line and it pulls at about 3,500 rpm. It is putting out about 500 hp. I am actually running an ld-465 motor but is has tractor manifolds and a roosamaster injection pump. The camshaft has been reground and it has bigger injector nozzles, bigger injection lines and the heads have been ported. The pistons are original but the bowl has been modified and is now much bigger.

 

[gringeltaube]

4000 rpm without flying apart! And 500 horses!Never thought a multifuel could make that for longer than a few revs...
Wonder what the tricks are. Maybe carefull balancing, blueprinting, much lower compression, etc.??? Guess we all could learn something here...

For your info, 427 and 465 crankshafts are interchangeable, have done it. Stroke of both is 4.87". Bore is 4.31" and 4.56", respectively.

Gerhard

 

[SasquatchSanta]

Hello JP,

Does the Oliver engine have dual inverted oil filter canisters mounted on the engine or are they detached?

There has been quite a bit of head scratching as to how to mount remove filters. Perhaps oliver had the answer.

Thanks.

 

[Polverone]

4000 rpm without flying apart! And 500 horses!

Holy Shazzzaaaaam!!!

JP,
Can you post a picture of that tractor puller and especially the engine? That thing rocks!

 

[Flatlander]

Jeez louise...could you write a section about the modifications you have made to your motor? The most I know how to do is crank the fuel up! What other modifications were made to the heads? Does it have a turbo?

Thanks for joining JP!

 

[JP]

Thanks for the replies guys.

I will get a picture of the tractor posted when I get the time.

The engine is pretty much stock except for what I listed before and it has been balanced and the it has fire rings to hold the high boost. It will run 45psi of boost during a pull. It also has water injection to keep from melting the pistons. The pyrometer will still hit 1,600 degrees pretty easily.

There is another tractor just like mine and it runs way better than mine. I think he took the sleeves out and runs 4 3/4 pistons right in the block making it about 518 cu. in.

I was hoping an lds-427 had a longer stroke than the 465 so it would increase my cu in. if I used the 427 crankshaft. But I guess they use the same stroke.

I know another guy close to me that runs his ld-465 on alcohol with three turbos. It is making about 1,800 hp .

I am not sure about the oil filters on an Oliver but the White tractor engines used spin on filters that were mounted to the oil cooler just like the canister filters on the ld engines. I do not run an oil cooler and I just use a remote oil filter. I had to make a plate to cover the area that was originally covered by the oil cooler.

 

[jh1990]

Sounds like one heck of a tractor, bet ya that would plow a field . Looking foward to some pictures.

 

[bottleworks]

I am not sure about the oil filters on an Oliver but the White tractor engines used spin on filters that were mounted to the oil cooler just like the canister filters on the ld engines. I do not run an oil cooler and I just use a remote oil filter. I had to make a plate to cover the area that was originally covered by the oil cooler.

Could you post some pictures of the Oil filter setup?

 

[rdixiemiller]

The reason we are so interested in RPM is that the military governed these engines to either 2600 or 2800, depending on year. There has been a lot of speculation as to what the tractor companies rated the engines at. I think a lot of the listers would re-adjust their governors a couple of hundred RPM if they thought the engines would hold together.

 

[Katch1]

so what you are running started out as a 1950-t? as far as the canister filters, I'll check into it tomorrow, we used to build them here.

 

[rdixiemiller]

As you can see, even though we are from different interest groups (MV's vs. Tractor Pulling) there is definately some common interest! We would all like to hear how you have built the motor, and what issues you may have had. I am amazed at the rpm and hp you are getting out of the old multifuel.

 

[M543A2]

For those interested in looking up the tractor that used this engine on websites, it was the White 2-155 model. My neighbor has one, and likes it very well. I could get some pics of a stock installation from it if interested.
The pump and injector sustem is different from the military. It is a very smooth running engine. I thought I had an I&T manual for it here, but my son must have it right now. If you were to buy an I&T manual for the White 2-155, it would give complete overhaul procedures and data for the engine. You can buy the manuals on internet.
Regards Marti Sacks

 

[JP]

Hello again guys. I have tried to find a picture of my tractor but it seems that the only pictures I have are video and I don't know how to post a still picture out of a video.

The tractor is currently in the shop torn down because I had a problem with my valve guides. I had made some valve guides out of bronze because this is the hot setup in race cars but the bronze actually melted somewhat down towards the exhaust valve from the high heat. As soon as I get it back together, I will take a picture of it and post it.


Just to clear a few things up, My tractor started out as an Oliver 1800. The class I pull in allows us to upgrade to the Hercules engine that was used in the Oliver 2050 and the Oliver 2150. They were almost the same tractor except the 2050 didn't have a turbo and the 2150 did. My tractor has 2150 decals on it. The Oliver 1950T used a Waukesha engine that was only 310 Cu. In. and was prone to throwing a rod. These are not the hot setup for a pulling tractor with high boost.

The Oliver tractor co. was bought by White and they made 2 tractors using the Hercules engine. The 2-135 and the 2-155. They both had a turbo but the 2-155 was rated at more hp I think because the fuel was just turned higher.

When I was looking for an engine for my tractor, I found a few ld motors but they did not have the right manifolds that I needed so I bought a motor from a 2-155 White. The only difference I see in this motor and an ld engine is the manifolds, the water pump, the timing cover, timing gears and the injection pump. This White engine was pretty worn out so I happened to find an ld-465 on ebay and bought it for $100.00. It turned out that this guy had 2 of the ld motors so I bought both for $100.00 each. He said if no one had bought them on ebay, they were going to the scrap yard. The one motor was froze up but the other had been rebuilt by the military and was in real good shape. I took it all apart and had it balanced but I reused the bearings They were like new. I got a set of pistons from a guy that used to pull a tractor like mine. They are stock pistons but the bowl has been filled with an aluminum slug and welded in, A new bowl has been machined in but it is about 3 inches in diameter about 3/8 of an inch deep. The cam was reground by crane cams in Florida. The heads are ported out but are still using the original valves. The valve springs and valve spring retainers have been replaced with some off of a Winston cup Nascar. The Injectors tips now have 5 holes in them instead of 2. The Injection lines are bigger than stock. The injection pump is a roosamaster just like the ones on the White tractor engines except it has a bigger head and rotor to make it pump more fuel. The turbo is a 3lm with a 2.700 intake wheel and a 2 3/4 exhaust wheel.

As far as turning up the rpms on these engines, I really don't see a problem going a few more hundred rpms. I have free reved mine to 4,000 rpms and it has held together so far and it will make 35 psi of boost just reving it in the driveway.

Now I don't think my engine would hold up running 4,000 rpms all day long. I use water injection to keep the tops of the pistons cool during a pull. I don't think I would want to buy fuel for this thing to run all day long either. It uses 2 gal to make 1 pull and that is less than 300 feet.

 

[rustywagoneersdotcom]

hat's off to you sir.
anxiously await a pic or two and i will be paying very very close attention to this thread.

peace
Dave

 

[M543A2]

These experiences with the 465 engine in pulling confirm my position on the 465 motor for years: it is not a fragile motor! I have seen many posts from people saying that touching the fuel screw is to guarantee motor destruction. My son and I have several trucks with the fuel turned up, and have had no problems for years. The biggest potential problem is with how the person with his foot on the accelerator uses it! We currently have a neighbor's 466 John Deere motor apart for rebuild. The strength differences between it and the 465 are very obvious. Almost all components in the 465's are quite a bit heavier. The 465 has studs for the heads where the Deere has bolts. The 465 has two oil cooling shooters per cylinder where the Deere has one. The timing gears in the 465 are almost twice as wide as the Deere. The oil pumps are noticeably different is size, with the 465 being the biggest. The list could go on! It is a good, dependable motor with a large safety factor built in when built right and properly maintained.
Regards Marti Sacks

 

[JP]

I found a few pictures of my tractor but they are not very good pictures. I will try to get some better ones.

 

[Djfreema]

This is like a strip tease! Take off the sheetmetal baby!

 

[Recovry4x4]

Does this tractor run super stock class?